creating an IPA that is all about the flavor and aroma withOUT the bite?

.....OK, obviously an IPA needs to have some bite, but the one's I like the most, such as DFH 60 and New Glarus Hop Hearty IPA, are relatively balanced in the bitterness department (that aftertaste that hangs in the back of your throat), but over the top in hop flavor and aroma.....

....It I was going to craft an IPA to meed these criteria, what type of hops would work well this way? and what might the hop schedule look like?
(Note: I would like suggestions beyond the awesome Cascade, because I am already drinking a delicious APA centered on cascade hops and I want to branch out...what I want to do is step it up a notch and find some more complexity beyond the citrus) thanks hopheads.

If you dont want citrus, you might try using fuggles and goldings to hop it.

I'd start looking at a good English IPA recipe to get a hold of a more balanced, non C hop IPA.

Take your favorite IPA recipe and use this hop schedule:

60 - 2 oz. Galena
15 - 2 oz. EKG (could use Fuggle)
5 - 1 oz. EKG

IBU ~ 60

You might also try first wort hopping, which supposedly produces a less harsh bitterness. And use a low-cohumalone bittering hop for your 60-minute addition.

If I am understanding you correctly, you want big hop flavor and aroma with a balanced bitterness. If so, I think the key to this is FWH as ArcaneXor suggested combined with late (<30 min) additions to maximize flavor and aroma while keeping the bitterness in check. Dry-hopping will most certainly boost the aroma that you are craving.

I've brewed an all Simcoe IPA now a couple of times and I'm just blown away by this hop. Supper fruity without any brash bitterness, very even keeled and smooth. Pineapple, mango, some slight citrus but nowhere near the C-hops the likes of Centennial or Cascade.

I've done two five gallon batches with 1oz at 60 and the rest at or after 20. The last batch was:

60 - 1oz
20 - 1oz
10 - 1oz
5 - 1oz
0 - 2oz

Plus 1oz per week for two weeks dry hop.

gwood said:

I've brewed an all Simcoe IPA now a couple of times and I'm just blown away by this hop. Supper fruity without any brash bitterness, very even keeled and smooth. Pineapple, mango, some slight citrus but nowhere near the C-hops the likes of Centennial or Cascade.

I've done two five gallon batches with 1oz at 60 and the rest at or after 20. The last batch was:

60 - 1oz
20 - 1oz
10 - 1oz
5 - 1oz
0 - 2oz

Plus 1oz per week for two weeks dry hop.

Click to expand...

I was curious about this hop until I raed some thread about simcoe having a cat-piss quality.....now I'm afraid of it.

ArcaneXor said:

You might also try first wort hopping, which supposedly produces a less harsh bitterness. And use a low-cohumalone bittering hop for your 60-minute addition.

Click to expand...

what is first wort hopping? and can you give a few examples of low-cohumulone hops? thanks

also, I like the citrus in there, but I'd like to expand on it rather than have grapefruit be the dominant flavor characteristic.....I think DFH 60 minute IPA does this well....it's citrusy, but there's more to it as well. that's why I like it so much.

ArcaneXor said:

You might also try first wort hopping, which supposedly produces a less harsh bitterness. And use a low-cohumalone bittering hop for your 60-minute addition.

Click to expand...

+1 for 1st wort hopping, I have a test batch going on right now but according to Palmer you add the hops during the first runnings and it does something to the lupulins to bring out the flavor and/or aroma but changes the chemical makeup so it doesn't bitter (as much) during the boil.

"Junior member" Vern

snailsongs said:

what is first wort hopping? and can you give a few examples of low-cohumulone hops? thanks

Click to expand...

First wort hopping: How to Brew - By John Palmer - How Are They Used?
For cohumolone: Hop Variety Specifications

Isn't an IPA without the bite kinda like having a Jack Russell terrier as a guard dog? Just plain annoying

Since you're a fan of DFH60 (as am I), maybe do something similar to this (from Yooper's DFH60 clone https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f69/dogfish-head-60-minute-clone-ag-extract-25709/):

.75 Warrior hops 16.4% AA (60 minutes) SEE NOTES ON HOPPING!
.50 Amarillo Gold 8.5% (35 minutes)
.50 Simco 12% (30 minutes)
.50 Simco 12% Dry hop
1.00 Amarillo Gold Dry hop

Hops were added as continous- first warrior only for the first 25 minutes just a few pellets at a time, then remainder all mixed together and continuosly added, starting at 35 minutes.

One thing to do is to balance out your IBU's with your starting Gravity. I use this chart for all my beers,



As you can see, you have a range to play with from Extra Malty to Extra Hoppy.

Awesome chart, don't believe I've seen that anywhere but it's going on the wall of the brewhouse.

Whenever I re-read "How to Brew" I learn something new, Palmer is a genius.

snailsongs said:

I was curious about this hop until I raed some thread about simcoe having a cat-piss quality.....now I'm afraid of it.

Click to expand...

I've never come across any flavors anywhere near what you've described. Give it a shot, it's by far the most flexible higher alpha hop that I've come across in a while.

I've heard of the "cat-piss" qualities, but have never experienced it. I heard it more from the aroma of the hops themselves, than from in beer. I've almost wondered if it was some sort of oxidation product from improper packaging or handling, something like the "cheese" odors some can take on.

AZ_IPA said:

Isn't an IPA without the bite kinda like having a Jack Russell terrier as a guard dog?

Click to expand...

I dunno. we have a boston terrier and a pug and they're quite ferocious :rockin: ....still, I'd like to keep the teeth on the dog and out of my beer.

I'm gonna look into this first wort hopping...I read How to Brew but I don't remember anything about that.....

I am very partial to centennial and columbus. I like to bitter with high % neutral bittering hops, and use late additions and dryhopping to get the 'nose'.

I hate overbitter IPA's and under-aroma'd ones.

Henry Hill said:

I am very partial to centennial and columbus. I like to bitter with high % neutral bittering hops, and use late additions and dryhopping to get the 'nose'.

I hate overbitter IPA's and under-aroma'd ones.

Click to expand...

I've fallen in love with Magnum as an early add for this reason. Very clean bitterness that I can then layer a ton of late adds and dry hop onto.

I'm a big fan of Sterling and Willamette for Pale ales and IPA's. Like the others have said, I think the key is to use FWH, and reserve 25% or more of the IBU's for hop additions in the last 20 minutes of boil.

Note that this will double or triple the amount of hops you need for the equivalent IBU's, due to reduced utilization. However, the flavor and aroma are more pronounced.

YMMV and all that. IPA's are not my go-to brews, but I do like a good hop bomb sometimes.

I'm gonna diverge from popular opinion and say that the type of hop is not that important. Sure, steer clear of ultra alpha bittering hops, but that is not the critical thing. Use water soft water with a bit of magnesium (most commercial "spring waters" will do nicely) and add *all* of the hops at K.O. I would do maybe 2 oz Willamette and 2 East Kent Goldings at K.O. and allow the beer to sit for 30 minutes before chilling. Stir it once or twice with a sterile spoon as you will have no ebulliation. Dry hop with 1 oz Styrian Goldings and you have a killer aroma.