Blue Moon Clone

I'm waiting to taste #4 before I post.
I use Briess white wheat 2.5L and Briess 2 row 1.7L

Took my stab at it today. Hopped in the mash and FWH to get a little flavor. Used Crystal and Liberty in lieu of Hallertauer. Didn't have enough White Wheat. Added a little Vienna and C-pils...:

Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 6.50 gal
Boil Time: 75 Minutes
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %

3 lbs 12.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) 37.50 %
3 lbs Wheat Malt, Pale (2.0 SRM) 30.00 %
1 lbs Wheat, White Malt (2.5 SRM)10.00 %
1 lbs Vienna Malt (3.0 SRM) 10.00 %
1 lbs Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) 10.00 %
4.0 oz Carapils (Briess) (1.5 SRM) 2.50 %
0.50 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (75 min) (Mash Hop) 2.4 IBU
0.75 oz Crystal [3.20 %] (75 min) (FWH) 8.7 IBU
0.75 oz Crystal [3.20 %] (60 min) 9.7 IBU
0.50 tsp Sweet Orange Peel, Ground (Boil 5.0 min)
1.25 tsp Coriander, Ground (Boil 10.0 min)
0.75 lb Rice Hulls (Mash 60.0 min)
1 Pkgs SafAle American Ale (Fermentis #S-05)

75 min Saacrification 155.0 F
10 min Mash Out 168.0 F

BeerBaronBob said:

Thanks ekjohns,

I am using Nilo's version of Wayne's original recipe with the Vienna substitution suggestion from Wayne's post #188 with less Crystal 40L. I just got a great deal on a 55# sack of Weyermann Vienna so Im going to try this out using Vienna as well as the additional Flaked Oats at 1.5# sugested to get a better creaminess to the body.

Im not sure I will add the Orange Extract to the fermenter after blowoff as you suggest, I will add the 0.5oz at the end of the boil. I may end up using both the some Valencia peel and the extract. Im not sure the bitterness is something you want to get rid of completely but I do like the orange taste.

Click to expand...

A late update on this batch which had a few issues that affected my batch. First the addition of the Orange Extract was not as expected. The beer turned very cloudy when I added it and the taste was not very real, kinda fake orange. The beer got better with age but was not my best effort by far.

I'm going to have to reserve judgement on the Vienna as well as I had a real problem with the water I used from my well. This was the first batch I tried using 100% well water and 5.2. This was a mistake as my batch turned out very astringent from what was very high carbonate levels. This messed up three batches (2 lagers!) before I realized it and I am now diluting with 50%-60% distilled water and creating a target water profile online and adding minerals back to get to the proper target levels. I had been using 100% bottled mineral water and thought the quality was too varied and not predictable so I tried the well water.

Anyway I'm going to have to go back and rebrew and taste again without the Orange Extract. Now to get it on my brewing schedule and try to drink the last of the Vienna lager with the same astringency issue. A lemon slice makes it little better.

i had my first few batches come out sour as hell from using tap water. I now use all DI water and add minerals. As far as the fake taste I did realize it after the keg had almost been finished (it was brewed for a friend). At first it didnt taste fake but it did get noticable later on. Im brewing it this weekend for myself and Im going to try orange marmalade in primary and adding some sweet orange peel during boil. I have done marmalade before during the boil and OMG it smelled amazing but by the time it fermented out there was no more ornage flavor.

ekjohns said:

i had my first few batches come out sour as hell from using tap water. I now use all DI water and add minerals. As far as the fake taste I did realize it after the keg had almost been finished (it was brewed for a friend). At first it didnt taste fake but it did get noticable later on. Im brewing it this weekend for myself and Im going to try orange marmalade in primary and adding some sweet orange peel during boil. I have done marmalade before during the boil and OMG it smelled amazing but by the time it fermented out there was no more ornage flavor.

Click to expand...

Campden tablet worked for me.

Well lucky for me the gorcery store that is 200 yrds from my apartment has a glacier water refill center so I pay $0.39 a gal. I also have very hard nasty water which makes it hard to brew with.

what is the final thoughts on amount and time for boiled oats. I have seen 1 lb for 60 min (thick), 1/2 for 30 min (seems to be the most common) and 1/4 for either 30 or 60 min.

ekjohns said:

what is the final thoughts on amount and time for boiled oats. I have seen 1 lb for 60 min (thick), 1/2 for 30 min (seems to be the most common) and 1/4 for either 30 or 60 min.

Click to expand...

1lb for 60min I think is too much, from my experience.
I think 1/2lb for 60min or 1lb for 15min may turn good..
My#4 recipe had 1lb for 15min, have not tried it yet.

Any tips on a proper water profile??? I am brewing Nilo's recipe #3 tomorrow with a few small changes.
5.25 gallons.
4.5# wheat malt
5# 2row
2# crystal 10L
1/2# carapils
2 oz swauzermalt/ acciduated malt 2% (ph control)

1/2# flaked oats boiled for 1h
1oz hallertauer for 60min (maybe 75 minutes)
1oz sweet orange peel
US - 05

1/2oz coriander for 10min

This is also the first time I won't be using my high bicarbonate, very alkaline CRAPPY water. So I'll be diluting 60 % RO and adding minerals back. Right now, according to EZ water I will be mixing up:
calcium: 57
magnesuem: 11
sodium: 45
chloride: 82
sulfate: 80
and this says balance beer for chloride to sulfate ratio.

Not that I'm trying to perfect anything, I just want to get in the right area, as my last few beers have had problems.

Happy Easter!

CaptainL

I think you water profile will be ok.

I just tried my #4 recipe, the first I adjusted my water, and it tastes awesome!

No much changes, boiled 1/2lb oats for 15min and changed the orange and coriander a bit. See below.

4# white wheat malt
5# 2 row malt
2# crystal 10
1/2# carapils

Mashed at 158 for 60min.
Mash ph at 5.27
Sparge ph at 6.5

Boiled 1/2# oats for last 15min
1oz hallertauer for 60min
3/8oz coriander for 10min
2oz sweet orange peels for 10min
1oz curacao orange peels for 10min

OG=1.049
FG=1.012
ABV%=4.8
SRM=6
IBU=13

Water profile
Ca=58
Mg=12
Na=2
Cl=93
SO4=50
Cl/SO4=1.86=malty
RA=-29

Wow, too many variables. We are getting too technical

Used yeast SO4 at 67F. FG was reached in 5 days. Bottled in 7 days.

Nilo,

In your last batch it seems like you have significantly upped the amount of orange peel while keeping the now lower amount of corriander. Was the orange flavor much more pronounced? And is the curacao orange peel the same as bitter orange peel? Thanks!

Kahu said:

Nilo,

In your last batch it seems like you have significantly upped the amount of orange peel while keeping the now lower amount of corriander. Was the orange flavor much more pronounced? And is the curacao orange peel the same as bitter orange peel? Thanks!

Click to expand...

Yes, curacao is the same as bitter, from what I know.
I decided to go crazy with the sweet orange peels just to see what happen, but 2oz did not add much more flavor, at least not as I thought it would.
I'm not sure if the water adjustment that I did also improved the beer, but #4 is what i'll be brewing again, perhaps using only fresh orange peels as I did in a previous recipe.
I have said this before, if you drink both commercial and home brew side by side, you will not want, ever , to drink the commercial again.

Kegged mine today (post #362). Tastes great out of the fermenter. Think this is going to be a good one!

I brewed this up yesterday and it is fermenting away nicely. I followed Wayne1’s recipe on post 274, although I upped the orange peel due to the fact the only McCormick’s orange peel I could find was expired for 2 years. HAHA I am very excited for this beer… I have brewed several wheats and have never had any of them turn out really, really good. I have a feeling that this will be the one.

Poobah58 said:

Kegged mine today (post #362). Tastes great out of the fermenter. Think this is going to be a good one!

Click to expand...

Poobah58,

I am interested to hear how this turns out. I also followed post #362 (but added .5 oz of Orange extract at bottling for 5.5 gallons). Two weeks in the bottles and the aroma is awesome but the taste is like orange crush with a punch in the face coriander aftertaste. I'm hoping another week or two and it will calm down. I saw another post where someone mentioned that 1.25 oz of coriander was possibly too much.

psusoccer21 said:

Poobah58,
I am interested to hear how this turns out. I also followed post #362 (but added .5 oz of Orange extract at bottling for 5.5 gallons). Two weeks in the bottles and the aroma is awesome but the taste is like orange crush with a punch in the face coriander aftertaste. I'm hoping another week or two and it will calm down. I saw another post where someone mentioned that 1.25 oz of coriander was possibly too much.

Click to expand...

I'll know more in a week or two. It's carbonating now and I need to empty a keg in the fridge. I post results but the sample out of primary was very promising. Definately nothing too spicey...

I just brewed five gallons of this today with your #4 recipe Nilo. The only thing I did was use 3 Valencia Orange rinds for it. My efficiency was pretty good, I had 5.5 gallons @ 12.6 brix. I actually added some water at the end because I boiled for 90 minutes. The wort was FANTASTIC!!!! On the coriander I added 2.25 teaspoons of ground fresh coriander. I am also using a Wlp001 Cali ale yeast on this batch. I will let you all know what it tastes like and looks when it is done. Speaking of, when its done, Are most of you going about 7 days and then straight to keg? And how are we carbonating this, at what psi for how long. I have my kegerator set at 40 degrees. I only ask that because this beer has a higher carbonation level than most ales correct? Thanks for all the help and answers ahead of time. I love this site.

petrostar said:

I just brewed five gallons of this today with your #4 recipe Nilo. The only thing I did was use 3 Valencia Orange rinds for it. My efficiency was pretty good, I had 5.5 gallons @ 12.6 brix. I actually added some water at the end because I boiled for 90 minutes. The wort was FANTASTIC!!!! On the coriander I added 2.25 teaspoons of ground fresh coriander. I am also using a Wlp001 Cali ale yeast on this batch. I will let you all know what it tastes like and looks when it is done. Speaking of, when its done, Are most of you going about 7 days and then straight to keg? And how are we carbonating this, at what psi for how long. I have my kegerator set at 40 degrees. I only ask that because this beer has a higher carbonation level than most ales correct? Thanks for all the help and answers ahead of time. I love this site.

Click to expand...

Cool.
I bottle, so I bulk prime with 1 cup corn sugar, probably about 2.5 volumes of CO2? Not sure.

My attempt of this recipe has been bottle carbing for 3 weeks. I poured one last night and it had very little to no carbonation. I'll let it sit another couple weeks and hope that it will carb up.

Are you carbing at a lower temperature? That seems like a long time.

petrostar said:

Are you carbing at a lower temperature? That seems like a long time.

Click to expand...

They have been hovering around 70 degrees for the entire three weeks. I am pretty confused because this is the only batch that I have had trouble with. A batch that I bottled on the same day is very drinkable.

Nilo,

Why'd you switch from mashing to boiling the oats? What difference in flavor can we expect with this change? Thanks!

Nilo, a few questions on this...

Are you boiling just Flaked Oats?

What in your opinion on all your attempts would give the best orange flavor? i've never been able to get a good orange flavor in any of my beers..

Is sa-04 english Ale yeast....I've never used dry yeast but it is a lot cheaper...

Thx

my 3rd attempt based off nilo's 3 attempt

4 lbs flaked wheat
6 lbs 2row
1 lbs crystal 20L
1/2# carapils
1/2# flaked oats boiled for 30 min (see note)
1oz hallertauer for 60min
1/4oz coriander for 10min
6 oz orange marmalade @ flame out
1 tsp irish moss for 20min
Mashed at 157F, fermented at 66F with 1 pack S04 for 21 days

I forgot to add the oats at boil so I took out 1 gal of wort and boiled 1/2 lbs of quick cook oats for 30 min then added it to the carboy. This did not mix very well but the mouth feel still seems pretty good. The biggest change was the marmalade at flame out. It is cooling and carbing now but at kegging OMG the taste is awesome. Good amount of orange flavor that is there if you think about it but is not overpowering at all. It does not have the somewhat "fake" taste similar to the extract and is much better than dried peels. I also used 20L crystal since my LHBS doesnt sell 10L so I only used 1 lb and upped the 2 row a lb to make up for it. Finally I used flaked wheat as opposed to wheat malt which should give a little more of that wheaty flavor. I will report back with the tasting after its carbed up but at this point its the best yet and I dont know if ill change it from there

Wayne1 said:

I hereby propose this recipe as an alternative:

6 lbs. Weyermann Vienna Malt
5 lbs. Weyermann Wheat Malt (pale)
1.25 lb Flaked Oats
0.5 Rice Hulls (pre-soaked in warm water)

Pre-heat mash tun with 4 gallons of 170F water.

Remove water from tun and re-heat to achieve 170F.

Mash in grains with 4 gallons of 170F water.

Allow to rest at 154-156F for 90 min.

Add 2.25 gallons of 198 F water to raise temp to 168F

Let mash rest at 168F for 10 min.

Recirculate (vorlauf) wort for 10 min. to clarify and establish grain filter bed.

Slowly sparge with 4.5 gallons of 168F water.

Collect roughly 8.3 gallons of water in kettle. (I try to take 45-60 min to get full volume)

Start boil as soon as wort covers bottom of kettle. Boil for 90 min after total volume is collected

Add 1.7 oz Hallertau (3%) pellets 30 min into the boil. (60 min boil left)

Add 1.25 oz fresh ground coriander (10 min boil left)

Add 0.3 oz Valencia Orange Peel (5 min boil left)

Turn kettle off and whirpool (if possible) to deposit trub in center of kettle. Draw off wort from side of kettle and chill as quickly as possible.

Ferment with Wyeast 1056, Safale US05, or White Labs WLP001 at 68F

With these amounts, assuming a 72% efficiency you should end up with 5.5 gallons in the fermenter @ 1.055 with IBU @15.6

This will give you a bit "bigger" beer with more mouthfeel. Feel free to experiment more with differing amounts of spices to get what does it for you.

I have never boiled oatmeal with the brew, but if it gives you what you perceive as the same flavor that Blue Moon has today, go for it.

Click to expand...

I believe this has been mentioned before but I wanted to save someone my experience. 1.25 oz fresh ground coriander is way too much. I strongly advise against it. This beer is not one of my favorites or my friends and we are blue moon fans.

So, I'm not quite sure what to do with this batch now. I started with a OG of 1.0157 and just took a sample 8 days later. I was at 1.0076 which I calculated to be about a 51 percent attenation. Since I am new to calculating this, I am not sure how much longer I should leave my beer in the primary before going to keg and carbing. I used a starter with WLP001 Cali Ale Yeast. Im currently at 5.7% ABV. Its what I was shooting for. Please let me know what you guys would recommend. Thanks ahead of time, I followed Nilos 4th recipe. It taste great so far btw.

petrostar said:

So, I'm not quite sure what to do with this batch now. I started with a OG of 1.0157 and just took a sample 8 days later. I was at 1.0076 which I calculated to be about a 51 percent attenation. Since I am new to calculating this, I am not sure how much longer I should leave my beer in the primary before going to keg and carbing. I used a starter with WLP001 Cali Ale Yeast. Im currently at 5.7% ABV. Its what I was shooting for. Please let me know what you guys would recommend. Thanks ahead of time, I followed Nilos 4th recipe. It taste great so far btw.

Click to expand...

Take hydrometer readings for 3 days in a row and if it has not changed, it should be done. Your hydrometer is your window as to what's going on inside the beer and whether or not the yeast have finished their job.

Let us know how it turned out!

So I was brewing yesterday and was making an english mild as well as a similar recipe to the blue moon clone at the same time. I have made it the past with great results. The issue I ran into yesterday was that with two batches going at once, when I got to the final 15 min of the boil, I had this hops going here, that hops going there and totally forgot to add the coriander and lemon peel to the Belgina Wit style...

Can I still use these ingredients in this beer?? Has anybody added coriander or lemon peel to the secondary fermentor? If so, how did it turn out? I was thinking of brewing up a small batch of tea so to speak with the coriander and lemon peel and adding that to the secondary. Is this a bad idea? I would still like to get that flavoring into the beer but it may be too late.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

BREW ON BREWERS!!!

I brewed a 12 gallon AG batch 10 days ago based on the original recipe in this thread. I added .9oz of coriander and 7.2oz of McCormick dried valencia. The orange taste is spot on (not kegged yet) but the coriander is prettly much non-existent. I wonder if I could add some coriander to the secondary?

I brewed a batch similar to the earlier recipes. When I bottled it, the orange was very strong and the coriander was non existent. Couple of weeks later after the bottles has carbonated the orange and coriander had balanced out.

GusWatab...yes you can add it in the secondary. If fact i think it has much more flavor doing it that way. Just soak the lemon or any zest in vodka before adding to the secondary. The coriander does not need to be soaked, crush it with a rolling pin in a zip lock bag. I use a hop bag and put everything (Orange zest, lemon zest, lime zest, coriander for Shock Top) into the primary after 2 weeks. I keep it in there for a week. Also, as mentioned 1.25 oz is way to much coriander, keep it under 1 oz.

psusoccer21 said:

Poobah58,

I am interested to hear how this turns out. I also followed post #362 (but added .5 oz of Orange extract at bottling for 5.5 gallons). Two weeks in the bottles and the aroma is awesome but the taste is like orange crush with a punch in the face coriander aftertaste. I'm hoping another week or two and it will calm down. I saw another post where someone mentioned that 1.25 oz of coriander was possibly too much.

Click to expand...

Finally had a glass tonight. Very nice. The SWMBO loves it! There is definately some orange in there but not overpowering. Coriander is very faint. This might be a yearly brew...

so the orange extract mellowed out and blended nicely?

ekjohns said:

so the orange extract mellowed out and blended nicely?

Click to expand...

I didn't use the extract. That was psusoccer21...

Tasted mine today with a blue moon side by side comparison. Lets be honest, there isnt one.

I used the 4th veesion of nilos recipe and with only 4 days in the keg. The beer is just great. The head is great. The color os just barely darker than normal blue moon. I will say that is because of my effiency.

Overall, would I brew this again? Hell yes! And I cant wait until this mellows out a bit more in the keg. Thank you nilo and others who have troubleshooted the ingredients for the rest of us. Btw, I used cali 001 yeast.

prcbrewer said:

Hey i asked Nilo about his #3 recipe. And i also got his input on and extract recipe i made up. He gave me this recipe:
-2.5 pounds wheat malt syrup
-3 pounds golden light DME
-2 pounds chrystal 10L
-.5 pounds carapils
-.5 pounds flaked oats

-1 oz. hallertau
-1/4 oz. coriander
-1/2 oz. sweet and 1/2 oz. bitter orange peels

s-04 yeast for 8 days at 66F

Click to expand...

Has anyone brewed this?

Tapped on 5/25.... Dead on 5/30! Very popular stuff amongst the family...

Has anyone tried to add the orange extract after fermentation, when bottling or kegging?
I would think this could keep the aromas from evaporating, what surelly does happen if added to boil or primary.
I'm planning to do a batch that way and see what happen (#5), perhaps 10ml = 2 tea spoons to 5gal batch. Will use same #4 recipe other than replacing the orange zest with extract.

I brewed a partial mash version recently but just tried it yesterday. If anyone is looking for a PM variation on some of the prior ones listed or simply doesn't want to look through 30 pages to find it, this one came out damn good, I must say.

5 gallon batch:
2.5# White wheat
2.5# american 2 row
14 oz quick oats
2 oz dextrine malt
2# pilsner LME
1oz Sterling Pellets
1 tsp ground corriander
1/2 tsp ground valencia orange peel (McCorrmicks)

I ground the barley, white wheat, and oats together with a medium to fine crush. Mashed in a bag at 155 70 minutes in 2.75 gallons filtered water.
Dunk sparged in that pot 5 minutes then dunked sparged in second pot of 2.5 gallon 170 degree water. 90 minute boil, added hops at 60 minutes. I used Sterling hops since it was the only Noble type hops I had, and had the correct profile and AA. IBU's probably a little high around 21 or so. Corriander added with 10 minutes remaining, orange peel with 5 minutes remaining. Cooled to around 70 and pitch 1 pack rehydrated Notty, fermented in mid-upper 60's 2 weeks (it was pretty much done in 3 days though) then straight to keg. Force carbed/crashed x 4 days or so and drank the first one last night.

The color is really perfect, white/yellow, more like what Wayne describes as the original than what is sold now which has darker yellow-orange color, not a true white. To me the bitterness is also excellent, very subtle, comes on in the finish. The corriander seems right on but the orange is only slightly detectable and I agree with others, it needs to be scaled up a bit unless you are always going to serve with a slice, in which case this amount is probably fine. The body is not nearly as thin as most seem to be reporting, maybe because of the dextrine, or the mash temp? Overall it came out great and I will definitely be making this again. I will probably increase the orange peel to 1 tsp and go 1.25 tsp on the corriander. I think the 3:1 wont get you the orange flavor with the McCorrmicks since it probably isn't that fresh as what Wayne had available.

Anyway, just wanted to keep the thread going and list my version. Thanks much Wayne, I know my ratios are off a little but pretty close to teh original and very good for a PM brewer since you can get white wheat in 5 lbs and use half and save half and the oats come in 42 oz so the 14 oz is a third, then throw in the 2 oz carapils and you have an even 6 lbs grain which is kind of the upper limits for many PM brewers.

Let me know what you all think.

Batch number 2 getting done tomorrow. 1st batch lasted less than a week (see post #362). It was so good I don't need to change anything except for what I have on hand. Don't have any white wheat so I'm using pale wheat. I only have 1 pack of S-05 yeast. I'm doing 10 gallons so half will get Nottingham. I finished at 1.007 last time so I'm bumping up the mash temp a bit even though it was a great beer!

Batch Size: 10.00 gal
Boil Time: 75 Minutes
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %

8 lbs Pale Malt (Can -2 Row) (2.0 SRM) 39.02%
8 lbs Wheat Malt, Pale (2.0 SRM) 39.02%
2 lbs Vienna Malt (3.0 SRM) 9.76%
2 lbs Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) 9.76%
8.0 oz Carapils (1.5 SRM) 2.50 %
1.00 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (75 min) (Mash Hop) 2.4 IBU
1.50 oz Crystal [3.20 %] (75 min) (FWH) 8.7 IBU
1.50 oz Crystal [3.20 %] (60 min) 9.7 IBU
1.00 tsp Sweet Orange Peel, Ground (Boil 5.0 min)
2.50 tsp Coriander, Ground (Boil 10.0 min)
1.50 lb Rice Hulls (Mash 60.0 min)
1 Pkg S-05
1 Pkg Nottingham

75 min Saacrification 156.0 F
10 min Mash Out 168.0 F