So....

cnbudz said:

Now you're just stereotyping Northeasterners. I'm from the Northeast and own multiple guns as do many of my friends and family members.

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Fair enough. It sounds like you may be the minority though
I didnt mean for it to sound that way to be honest. What I meant was that it is my impression that gun control is a hot issue in that region.

orfy said:

You are not allowed to kill people.

If my dogs bite an intruder they can prosecute me.

They will get free legal aid.

I would have to pay for a lawyer.

If an intruder cuts themselves on barb wire I can be prosecuted.

If an intruder enters with a knife and I try to stab them.......

You get the picture.

I am supposed to call the police who may not turn up and just wait. I am not allowed to attack them.
All I can do is defend my self using minimal reasonable force.

If I attack them I WILL be prosecuted for assault and battery.

Do you want me to carry on?

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Ouch. And I thought the U.S. was bad when it came to criminal rights.

orfy said:

You are not allowed to kill people.

If my dogs bite an intruder they can prosecute me.

They will get free legal aid.

I would have to pay for a lawyer.

If an intruder cuts themselves on barb wire I can be prosecuted.

If an intruder enters with a knife and I try to stab them.......

You get the picture.

I am supposed to call the police who may not turn up and just wait. I am not allowed to attack them.
All I can do is defend my self using minimal reasonable force.

If I attack them I WILL be prosecuted for assault and battery.

Do you want me to carry on?

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Come on over! We got room for yah over here!

Hell, they passed the 'castle doctrine' down here in Florida a few years ago. Basically says, if you break into my house you do so at risk of your own peril. We are no longer required to attempt to retreat before applying force. How ever, if viable it is always the better option.

I made one comment in that thread, then stayed away from it so I don't know how bad it got. My comment is that "guns" are one of those topics that make corporate internet censors very nervous. It CAN be worse than pr0n in many cases simply because of the incidents that have happened.

I'm not trying to open up the whole "Are we more or less safe if we carry them" argument, I'm just stating a fact that many companies would be NERVOUS if gun talk started showing up on someone's internet report.

Also, Tx has a perfectly useable gun forum site already.

OK Folks, this is an attempt to bring us all together.
I'll put it this way, for those of you who brew beer, but don't like guns...

Befriend one of us who brew beer and love guns, for it is us, who will defend (with force if needed) our rights to own guns and brew beer.

This site is about beer, but if you look at the entire political spectrum... "They" are banning transfat for goodness sake... Let me choose! These people believe that prohibition didn't work because they didn't do it right in the 20's, not because it was wrong to take a freedom away. Today, the french fry.. tomorrow YOUR home brew

Save the Brew... buy a gun
or at leased befriend someone who has one.

Seabee John said:

Save the Brew... buy a gun
or at leased befriend someone who has one.

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I support the police, even when they're against me.
I support the armed forces, even when I'm against war.
I like guns, and I think shooting them is fun.
I'll never own one.

I believe guns should be legal, and bullets should cost $5,000 each.
I believe the only people who need automatic weapons are those in the forces.
I believe that if you want to own a gun, you should join the armed forces or the police.

I believe gun manufacturers need to take more public accountability and stop hiding behind the second ammendment.
I believe that everyone who owns a gun should be forced to have gun-owners insurance which would pay for damage or injury inflicted by the weapon.
I believe people should have to register their guns and, once a year, bring them to a local place to show they still have ownership of the weapon.
I believe guns, like cars and houses, should have a title. You should not be able to sell it without transferring the title.

These are just my beliefs.

From Texas:

If someone breaks into my house I'm going for the 44 mag. before the phone to call 911. We can sort it out later at the police station.

"I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6."

Well said TxBrew.

TxBrew said:

"I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6."

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"I'd rather stay out of that situation all together, like 99.999% of America and almost 100% of the rest of the world."

Cheesefood said:

I support the police, even when they're against me.
I support the armed forces, even when I'm against war.
I like guns, and I think shooting them is fun.
I'll never own one.

I believe guns should be legal, and bullets should cost $5,000 each.
I believe the only people who need automatic weapons are those in the forces.
I believe that if you want to own a gun, you should join the armed forces or the police.

I believe gun manufacturers need to take more public accountability and stop hiding behind the second ammendment.
I believe that everyone who owns a gun should be forced to have gun-owners insurance which would pay for damage or injury inflicted by the weapon.
I believe people should have to register their guns and, once a year, bring them to a local place to show they still have ownership of the weapon.
I believe guns, like cars and houses, should have a title. You should not be able to sell it without transferring the title.

These are just my beliefs.

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It's good you have beliefs, beliefs are what make you human, or even alive for that fact. It's a combination of your experiences and your fears, mixed with a little bit of hope that makes up your beliefs.

If you look above, almost every belief you list requires action on the part of the government. It's all about the government restricting what you can and cannot do. You even state "I believe that if you want to own a gun, you should join the armed forces or the police." which tells me that "the government" is the only group of people you trust to defend you. But the rest of your fellow citizens are not worthy...hmmm... the government IS rule by citizens.

I'm not telling you that you are bad, I'm not calling you names, I'm not threatening you in any fashion. To the contrary, I've given the last 16 years of my life (11 active duty and 5 reserve) defending YOUR BELIEFS. All I ask of you is to live your life the way you see fit and let me live mine the way I see fit. We have laws to take care of the fringe... no need to un-weave the fabric of our nation.

Umm... OP, I think it's your turn to delete your thread...

Seabee John said:

"They" are banning transfat for goodness sake... Let me choose!

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Your talking about "banning" a substance thats made millions of children morbidly obese because they in their families had it snuck into their pre packaged food to boost flavor and make an addictive product. Thats what the FDA is supposed to do, stick up for people being poisoned.

Lucky for you, to my knowledge, it will not be illegal to possess or synthesize trans fats, so a firearm may not be necessary to defend this particular god-given right.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article2409817.ece

Good article about gun control.

I highly suspect anyone with pro-gun control views have actually researched the topic in depth because once you do the facts don't favor gun control. I guess though in some search for a phantom utopia gun control sounds good in theory, well maybe for the Government more so, a non-armed populace is a dream for aspiring tyrants.

TxBrew said:

"I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6."

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That is my favorite. First time I heard it was in a concealed carry class, really drove the point home.

NateKerx said:

Your talking about "banning" a substance thats made millions of children morbidly obese because they in their families had it snuck into their pre packaged food to boost flavor and make an addictive product. Thats what the FDA is supposed to do, stick up for people being poisoned.

Lucky for you, to my knowledge, it will not be illegal to possess or synthesize trans fats, so a firearm may not be necessary to defend this particular god-given right.

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What ever happened to the terms "buyer beware" or "personal responsibility?" Since when were those parents forced to feed their OWN children prepackaged food without reading the ingredients first? You wouldn't feed your kid your own alcohol would you? It's not good for them, but it's ok for you to choose to drink it. You make it... it's YOUR choice... AND responsibility.

Cheesefood said:

I believe guns should be legal, and bullets should cost $5,000 each.

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I feel the same way about cell phones. Minutes should not be so cheap, then we wouldn't have people talking and driving at the same time.

I usually do not touch gun control arguments with a ten foot pole, for the very reasons that the_bird mentioned.

However, I served for 10 years in the Army as an Infantryman, so I'm quite familiar with various firearms, both domestic and foreign. I also did about 2 years as a Police Officer, so I'm pretty versed in the laws surrounding guns. I own guns, I grew up with guns, but I agree that not everyone should be able to just go out an buy one, regardless whether they have committed crimes or not. An idiot is an idiot.

I believe the issue is not the gun laws, but enforcing the ones already in place. It is also a fact that even if tomorrow the government decided to ban all firearms, guns would still be prevalent. Criminals would not give up their firearms. You can dig around the news for any country that has complete gun bans and find murders by firearm.

I hate to lean towards any side, however, a firearm has never jumped out of a box and killed someone it is the moron hold the firearm.

Here's a challenge for you, dig around and find a single state where firearm (intentional or accidental) deaths are more per capita then vehicular deaths. You won't find one. But I bet there are not many folks who would vote for a vehicle ban.

To Seebee John: That is one of the biggest problems we have in the US, no one (or very few) takes accountability for their actions, it is always someone else's fault. It's the gun manufacturers for not putting big freakin letters on the side of guns saying "this may kill you or someone else", it's the NRA's fault for believing that every citizen has a right to bear arms, its McDonald's fault for making you fat, it's the fashion industries fault that models are to skinny, etc ad nauseam....

On the idea that I should delete the thread, why? There is nothing wrong with discussion, especially in this forum. Although the 1st amendment does not apply to a privately owned forum, folks should be able to express their views. If folks get childish and start name calling or slandering another member for their beliefs said individuals should consider never visiting internet forums, or maybe even leaving their houses for fear of someone having an opinion or world view different from their own.

Anyways, let's keep this civil and please if you are going to make a point an use numbers or statistics, make sure
they are correct.

EDIT: By all means, if the mods think this gets out of hand delete it.

Seabee John said:

What ever happened to the terms "buyer beware" or "personal responsibility?" Since when were those parents forced to feed their OWN children prepackaged food without reading the ingredients first? You wouldn't feed your kid your own alcohol would you? It's not good for them, but it's ok for you to choose to drink it. You make it... it's YOUR choice... AND responsibility.

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I understand your point and I do think Americans have gone to incredible lengths to shirk their responsibilities as parents/consumers. However... I don't think there is anything wrong with sending a stronger message in the form of a transfat ban, especially considering the rate of heart disease in this country, and especially since reducing unnecessary illness through better diet makes a universal health care system more feasible

Whiskey® said:

On the idea that I should delete the thread, why? There is nothing wrong with discussion, especially in this forum. Although the 1st amendment does not apply to a privately owned forum, folks should be able to express their views. If folks get childish and start name calling or slandering another member for their beliefs said individuals should consider never visiting internet forums, or maybe even leaving their houses for fear of someone having an opinion or world view different from their own.

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You don't need to be responsible for deleting the thread, the mods will take care of that if/when the need arises. There is a pretty strict policy around here to stay away from political topics. Many threads have been deleted or closed as a result. The reason for the policy is that politics easily divide people who might otherwise be friends. If we avoid sensitive and argumentative issues that have nothing to do with beer, there will be less adversarial relationships here, and we will more likely share ideas that are more relevant to the forum's main topic: beer!

I used to manage at a gun shop. All I can say is enforce the laws, don't sell to someone even if they pass the BG check if they seem off to you and heck I think people should take tests like you do when you interview for a job. And as a final rtest they should get DNA from you and 5 different people in your not so immediate family just to make sure the family tree branches and does not look like a braid.

Beer doesn't kill people; people kill people.

...or something like that.

Does anyone else realize that this thread DID turn into a gun control debate? =) The pictures of the guns post was probably tamer than this one, haha.

Interesting isn't it.

???? I thought we were going to start talking about beer and sex? After 20 yrs. of marriage, I found what "Doggie style" is. I sit up and beg for it and she rolls over and plays dead.

Willy Boner said:

???? I thought we were going to start talking about beer and sex? After 20 yrs. of marriage, I found what "Doggie style" is. I sit up and beg for it and she rolls over and plays dead.

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Well, I guess you can teach an old dog new tricks. Kind of a slow learner, though, aren't ya?