Looooong AG session

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Khirsah17

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I must say, the jump from extract brewing to all grain is full of surprises. I have brewed three all grain beers, and each one of them has had unique challenges and woes. The last one, however, has brought up a situation which I wouldn't mind getting some advice on.

I was brewing my first big beer, (12.5%), and it took almost 12 hours from start to finish. The biggest time drain was boiling tons and tons of excess sparge water away. So after the mash I lautered until the corrected gravity reading of the runnings was about 1.012. It took a lot of water to get to this point. In order to get it down to a 5 gallon batch, I boiled water away in 4 different pots for hours until the volume came down, then recombined everything in the turkey fryer. The way I sparged was just adding water as needed to keep about an inch or two of liquid above the grain bed.

Is it normal that I had to use so much water to extract all the sugar from the mash?

Is there any more efficient way of doing this, so I don't have to add hours of boil time in order to reduce my batch size to 5 gallons?

I've somewhere heard that excess boiling "caramelizes" the grain. If I had to boil for such an extensive amount of time, have I pretty much lost any contribution of the lighter specialty grains.. such as a Belgian Pils grain?


As a side note, I used 23 pounds of grain and guessed a 70% mash efficiency. I was pretty much right on! My corrected OG was 1.112! Woo!
 
With a beer that big you are going to be boiling for every. This is just a fact of life with big beer. 23lb for 5 gallons and OG 1.112 is huge. Thats enough grain and wort for a normal 10 gallon batch. A normal 5 gallon batch with 10-12lb of grain isn't going to need near the boiling.
 
Khirsah17 said:
As a side note, I used 23 pounds of grain and guessed a 70% mash efficiency. I was pretty much right on! My corrected OG was 1.112! Woo!

I use 23 pounds for my 10-gallon batches.

Holy shnikeys.

I suppose you could figure out a way to recirculate the wort to continually wash the sugars into the solution.
 
Yes, but the recirculated wort is only capable of picking up so much sugar before equilibrium is reached. Once there is equal amounts of sugar in the wort and in the grain, no more will transfer. The only way that it would help is if you're fly sparging and the first time around it was missing pockets of high sugar (due to channeling). You hope on the recirculation that it finds those pockets. In the case of a stirred batch sparge, it generally pulls as much sugar as it ever will at that particular concentration.
 
Bobby_M said:
Yes, but the recirculated wort is only capable of picking up so much sugar before equilibrium is reached. Once there is equal amounts of sugar in the wort and in the grain, no more will transfer.

Right. I didn't mean to recirculate only the original wort. Of course he'd have to sparge. But recirculating the initial strike several times, then draining, sparge in additional water and recirculate that several times before running off to the kettle.

Recirculating the sparge water (if your batching) will especially help because it will (naturally) have a lower concentration of sugar and resist "equilibirum".

I improved my efficiency greatly by doing that and was able to reduce my boil time because I used less water for sugar extraction.
 
My 1.093 ended up with close to 10 gallons of wort that I boiled down to a 5 gallon batch. It took forever. I don't think I'll be doing a huge beer again for a while.
 
Cheesefood said:
My 1.093 ended up with close to 10 gallons of wort that I boiled down to a 5 gallon batch. It took forever. I don't think I'll be doing a huge beer again for a while.
1.093...

Holy gravity. I'd be serving that in shot glasses. At least it will last you a while...maybe... ;)
 
If you could fit it, you could use 50% more grain or so.
Or you could mash, top off with water, mix, then run dry - then dump mash tun and do again with new grist. Guessing 15-18# per mash.
If nothing else, this would be a lot quicker, but more expensive,.
 
JimC said:
You could also keep the 1/2 spent grains and sparge them again for a table beer.

Probably what I will do but then you have 2 batches of beer to boil etc so still a long day...

An alternative would be to make the biggest AG batch you can do comfortably with your system and process and then add extra light DME to make up the gravity points you need.
 
JimC said:
But, but, but, then at the end of the day you have a table beer and a big heavy!

Which is why I said I would use your strategy;) but then again I don't mind spending the whole day brewing...
 
Instead of using so much water and boiling it down I'd add a little more grain and run off a second 5-gal batch. That way you get a huge beer and a small beer, you get good efficiency, and you don't have to boil forever.
 
Thanks guys, some good replies here. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't doing something terribly wrong. Big beers just take more time. Maybe that's why the cost so much more at the store :)

However, what effect does excessive boiling have on lighter specialty malts? Are they going to get caramelized to all heck and neutralized?
 
Khirsah17 said:
However, what effect does excessive boiling have on lighter specialty malts? Are they going to get caramelized to all heck and neutralized?

You will get kettle caramelization which will darken your beer and change the flavour some.
 
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