Are my grains crushed?

Got shipment with all my initial equipment and ingredients today. Want to do a batch of Graff... I requested that my grains (some 60L and torrified wheat) be crushed, but they don't look very crushed. I'm not sure how crushed they are supposed to be, I guess, is the problem. So, how can I be sure these are milled properly and that they didn't send me uncrushed by mistake? Is there a good before after picture showing what it should look like?

i would think this would be obvious. do they look like whole seeds or irregular chunks. if your worried get a rolling pin (or similar object) and run it over the grain a few times.

Well, the 60L has lots of what looks like whole seeds but also a lot of husks and bits floating around. The wheat is mostly cracked in about halves with some full pieces in there. I thought it would be obvious as well, but, well, obviously it isn't as I had to ask.

The fact that they forgot part of my order, despite a "packer and picker" both checking it off the list and signing the packing slip made me slightly doubtful of their abilities to send the right items...

ok i think i see your source of confusion then. sounds like maybe they had a course setting on their crusher. i still stand by my rolling pin suggestion.

TipsyDragon said:

ok i think i see your source of confusion then. sounds like maybe they had a course setting on their crusher. i still stand by my rolling pin suggestion.

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I appreciate the input - I was also unsure of whether it was possible to over-crush them so to speak. I think they are crushed, though. I found the DVD in my little kit and popped it into the computer. The guy mentions that the grains need to be basically cracked and not ground or powdered, and these are cracked, which not being what I would have called crushed... I will probably still give them a light hit with a rolling pin just to be on the safe side though!

Thanks again!

It might help if you post a quick picture of your grains just to be sure.

Hm, I think I am too much of a newbie to post pics on the forums, so I will to take them, upload them somewhere else and post a link... might take a moment, but I appreciate you offering to help!

to me "over crushed" is when they can't be held in a grain bag without sifting through the mesh. the more you crush the more the water can get at the grain and dissolve the sugars. but there is a point when it is too fine and cant be held in a grain bag during steeping.

OK, this should work... (sorry for the low quality cell phone pic)

ok i definitely see what your saying now. i wouldn't call those crushed either. to me those look like whole grains. hit them with the rolling pin.

TipsyDragon said:

ok i definitely see what your saying now. i wouldn't call those crushed either. to me those look like whole grains. hit them with the rolling pin.

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Thanks for the heads up... I am unimpressed with Midwest Supplies today.

Those are definitely not crushed. I'd call 'em up and *****, they should be willing to ship you the crushed grains (because that is what you ordered) for no charge, as well as whatever item they forgot to send.

Yeah that crush looks suspect at best based on the picture. Where did you order the grain from?

Edit: I see I missed where you posted the vendor a couple posts up.

It was Midwest Supply, who I thought had a pretty good reputation. There was several issues about this order. Aside from the grains, I was also shorted a packet of yeast ($0.80 item, but still), had a substitution made without being contact before hand (they were out of stock of the Briess Sparkling Amber DME and replaced it will Muton Plain Amber) which isn't a problem in this case, but was not appreciated as an example of how they do business, and also didn't represent the contents of the kit I bought correctly (oddly, they under represented it. They specifically stated that the kit did NOT have a thermometer when it in fact did. As a result I ordered one in addition my kit. Now, the kit thermometer is pretty chintzy - just a long stick lab thermometer and the floating thermo I got is nicer and was only $6, but it's still a little annoying).

I'm pretty sure I won't be ordering from there again unless they are good about correcting the situation. I already emailed them about the yeast, thermometer, and DME substitution but I will have contact them again about the grains. Sigh.

Thanks for the help everyone!

EDIT: dumb thing is I am lucky in that I live about 3 blocks from a HBS. Midwest Supply had a good price on the kit, so I ordered one there and just added the ingredients to save me a trip to the store. I think I will sick local from now on.

Midwest has been a good supplier for me. I believe in giving people a chance to do the right thing. If they make good on your order, give them another chance. If they stiff you, you know what to do.

Hoppus_Poppatopolis said:

Midwest has been a good supplier for me. I believe in giving people a chance to do the right thing. If they make good on your order, give them another chance. If they stiff you, you know what to do.

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We'll see what the say tomorrow. On a good note, I crushed the grains with a rolling pin and have some Graff nearly ready for the fermentor! (The yeast they forgot wasn't for this - it was a packet for a friend who I am gifting my old "make hard cider in a gallon jug kit" to). Hopefully I didn't f' anything up! I'm super paranoid I didn't clean everything well enough and I will get a nasty infected cesspool of beer!

Their cracked, not crushed lol. Should be fine, but if you want higher efficiency- you may want to roll them with a rolling pin.

Well, all done... Graff in the fermentor. Thanks to everyone! Had some small mishaps right towards the end... one that I am really concerned will cause me trouble. Dropped an apple juice cap right in the bucket. Last bottle of juice, of course. Nothing to be done about it so I just covered it up and hoped for the best.

David: well, I emailed Midwest about it already, so hopefully I didn't make a huge ass of myself. I rolled it and broke them up some more. The steeping smelled grate and nothing came out of the grain bag (more or less) so I think that they did need some extra rolling.

mrgreen4242 said:

Well, all done... Graff in the fermentor. Thanks to everyone! Had some small mishaps right towards the end... one that I am really concerned will cause me trouble. Dropped an apple juice cap right in the bucket. Last bottle of juice, of course. Nothing to be done about it so I just covered it up and hoped for the best.

David: well, I emailed Midwest about it already, so hopefully I didn't make a huge ass of myself. I rolled it and broke them up some more. The steeping smelled grate and nothing came out of the grain bag (more or less) so I think that they did need some extra rolling.

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Definitely, I wouldn't have used them like that lol. I once read in my early-brewing days that one should only crack the grain. I don't really agree with that now & those barely look cracked. I would have rolled em pretty good.

Also, don't worry about the cap; you'll be good. It's nothing to stress out over. RDWHAHB

Hope everything works out for the best with Midwest Supplies! Glad to hear you got that first brew in the fermenter OK.

DavidSteel said:

Definitely, I wouldn't have used them like that lol. I once read in my early-brewing days that one should only crack the grain. I don't really agree with that now & those barely look cracked. I would have rolled em pretty good.

Also, don't worry about the cap; you'll be good. It's nothing to stress out over. RDWHAHB

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Ya, I gave them a good rolling and my steeping looked very dark and smelled very rich, so I think I had them crushed enough. I'm not too concerned about the cap. My hands were sanitized and cleaned and its not like the caps were covered in filth or anything.

My airlock had some gas in it this morning after just 6 hours, so I am hoping fermentation is taking off quickly and all is well. I think I need to more it somewhere warmer, though. It's winter here and it's by a window so the temp looked down around 63degrees? Too cold?

Not too cold, at the lower end of the temp range for Ale Yeast. I'm fermenting my IPA at 61* right now. I think it gives you a cleaner tasting beer.

wyzazz said:

Not too cold, at the lower end of the temp range for Ale Yeast. I'm fermenting my IPA at 61* right now. I think it gives you a cleaner tasting beer.

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Thanks for the input. It should be warmer than that during the day when the temp kicks up a little (warmer outside and programmable thermostat) and not much cooler than 61 at night time...

Be careful with that floating therm - we have stopped putting them in kits because they can break in the kettle, ruining your batch.

Jipper said:

Be careful with that floating therm - we have stopped putting them in kits because they can break in the kettle, ruining your batch.

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Funny you say that, as I actually ended up much preferring the long "lab thermometer" in the kit. It was able to get a reading much, much fast and was easier to read.

Maybe I can send the floater back for a refund.

Hoppus_Poppatopolis said:

Midwest has been a good supplier for me. I believe in giving people a chance to do the right thing. If they make good on your order, give them another chance. If they stiff you, you know what to do.

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Well, Midwest hasn't even replied to ne yet... I will have to give them a call tomorrow, just so busy at work lately that it's a pain and frankly would rather deal with this via email - it's one of the reasons for doing business over the internet, I don't need to be free during the day. Definitely will not use their services again, though, regardless how this turns out.

The way I see it, they shorted me one item and blatantly lied to me to sell me another one, so ripped me of for about $7 (not the money that matters, but the principle). Plus failed to crush my grains and ignored my emails, which is just poor service.

At least my graff is bubbling along nicely, and smells awesome.

Ditch the floating thermometer. And if you are just steeping the grains, hell it hardly matters if they are crushed at all.