Would this kettle boil large volumes?

On a previous thread Shafferpilot mentioned the necessity to increase burner to liquid surface area in order to facilitate boiling on a large scale.
I stole this idea (and if I decide to go through with it, the parts) from an RV water heater.
Another problem may be trying to weld to the thin aluminum pot.
BTU's can be controlled by burner orifice size and an adjustable high pressure regulator.
If anybody has any background in - thermodynamics, engineering, or just messing around with this type of stuff - and could help me design this, please let me know!
I'm looking for a system to handle 25-30g and from what I've heard, a standing burner won't cut it.

WOW! how do the big boys do it? do they have a similar system to what you've illustrated above?

i'm now taking reservations for open spots in my car to go see this in action when it's up and running!!

I'm wondering if maybe a couple electric elements may work. They would be easier to install into the pot. I could even built them onto a separate mount and drop it in. Either way, I guess I should add a bonding lug to the pot.

So, say (2) 240V, 4500w elements on a dedicated 50A.

Of course, getting the 8-3w/g (maybe 6awg if I go aluminum) through the underground conduit going to my garage should be fun, but I've been wanting to get more power out there anyway.

The 4500W elements are available cheaply ($15) throughout the internet, so the real downfall is getting adequate power to them.

At about $.10/kwh, a 2 hr usage would cost me about $1.80 vs. (guessing) 180,000BTU's(~2gal/hour) @ average of $2.50/gal would be about $5.00.
Pretty minor I guess...

Any thoughts on whether 9000w would be efficient enough for 25-30g?

Has anybody ever heard of any problems with a submersible element in the wort?

MonsterMash does large volumes. I can't remember exactly, but I thought it was 20-25 gals. He used to use burners but switched to electric (maybe just the HLT, though) so he could automate the process. I'd PM him and see what he thinks. I don't see any reason why you shouldn't be able to use a burner and large diameter pots. Morebeer also sells 20 gallon setups (and used to sell 40 gallon setups) that used burners.

SenorWanderer said:

WOW! how do the big boys do it? do they have a similar system to what you've illustrated above?

Click to expand...

5isnotenough said:

I'm wondering if maybe a couple electric elements may work.

Click to expand...

Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.

Fingers said:

Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.

Click to expand...

http://home.chattanooga.net/~cdp/boilnew/boilnew.htm

Yes, I believe you are right, and this article touches on that, too. I'm going to look further into the "extra low watt density" mentioned...

Also, any thoughts on if a constant stirrer (like the one shown in the article) may be enough to prevent scorching?

Fingers said:

Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.

Click to expand...

Lots of brewers in the UK use direct heat from electric elements.
I know a of few who use kettle elements.

Fingers said:

Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.

Click to expand...

In theory I guess this could happen but not in my experience. I use two 3kw elements in my boiler and have never scorched my wort.

As far as cleaning goes, I leave the wet hops in the boiler after brewing and clean it out the next day. The acidity cleans the elements withut me having to do anything.

/Phil.

Hey Phil.
I've just been mooching around your website.
Followed the link from Jim's place.

Glad you liked it Orfy.

/Phil.

Seveneer said:

In theory I guess this could happen but not in my experience. I use two 3kw elements in my boiler and have never scorched my wort.

As far as cleaning goes, I leave the wet hops in the boiler after brewing and clean it out the next day. The acidity cleans the elements withut me having to do anything.

/Phil.

Click to expand...

What size boil?

5isnotenough said:

What size boil?

Click to expand...

Follow his signature. It's there in detail.

I aim for 10-11 Imperial gallons or 50 litres although I often get more like 56 litres.

/Phil.

how about using a burner like most of us do, but putting a couple of pipes like the one in your diagram that start at the bottom and exit out the sides? It makes for the best of both worlds. As others have said, a burner and a big pot works, it just takes a long time and a lot of propane to get there. You're gonna have a pretty cool and innovative system by the time you're done. I'm really looking forward to hearing about more about it

Can I just ask how much experience you have welding with aluminum? It is very different from welding steel, the metal will literally liquify if you don't know what you are doing. I hope you have a good TIG welder, or know someone who can help you. I wouldn't go with aluminum by the way, if you are building something this big go with quality material, and make sure you know how you are going to clean and sanitize it.

I have a newer MIG setup that actually welds aluminum amazingly well. I stay away from the fluxcore no gas stuff with it though (I've heard that doesn't work well at all). I've done plenty of TIG with stainless and aluminum, but I'm not THAT good of a welder to make the aluminum TIG work very well. Like I get it right for a while, then screw up a couple dots or blow through, then do good for a while again. Obviously a good welder can TIG aluminum without any problems, and the welds come out top notch; I'm just not that good. Anyways, it worked for that project, but water tight, cleanable, sanitizable welds are a different story. The aluminum welds I've gotten out of the MIG are surprisingly good, and with some settings tweaks and a little more practice with this machine, I bet I could get a really smooth one. I guess I'm just trying to say that it is possible.... difficult for sure, but still possible for someone anal enough to make it right. Still from a durability/braggability standpoint I see the benefits of SS. To build something like this, I'd start by going to the local scrap yard and looking around. You may find pipes or tanks the right sizes. There's a place here in Cincinnati that charges a tiny premium over the scrap price they pay, and the guys that work the yard are always happy to help you dig something out, or use the cutting torch to cut something up for ya. Bring 'em a homebrew or two; I bet that'll really bring 'em around to helping you out

over 10 or 15 gallons you are past what propane and nat. gas can do in your home setup, so you have to go electric, by what I've read. review this site: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/heating-elements . Pics and lots of info, so you can build your own large home boiler. 25 gallons...that's a lot of beer.