Nervous about my 1st AG -- pls comment on my general plan

After reading, reading, watching videos, reading, and more reading; building an MLT and buying some ingredients; and then reading some more -- I'm ready.

But as I'm developing my game plan; it can't be THIS simple, can it?

1) mash
2) lauter
3) boil
4) add hops at the schedule
5) chill
6) pitch yeast

okay, I now it's a little more involved, but seriously, here's my plan (using Ed's Haus Ale ingredients)

1) RDWHAHB while adding hot water to MLT (and then draining)
2) heat strike water to about 169* (@ 1/5 qts/lb).
3) dough in; stirring well
4) cover
5) RDWHAHB
6) check temp after 5 min -- panic when it's off 1-2 degrees <----- RDWHAHB
7) let rest for 60 min.
8) starch conversion test -- panic <----- RDWHAHB
9) panic because I forgot to start heating sparge water <----- RDWHAHB
10) vorlauf
11) drain mash
12) double sparge with 180* water (vorlaufing both times)
13) stir well (1st - 3rd runnings)
14) measure pre-boil volume and gravity (adj. for temp.) for efficiency calc.
15) add pot to boiler <----- RDWHAHB
16) clean up boil over while adding hops <----- RDWHAHB
17) boil & hop according to schedule <----- RDWHAHB
17a) add irish moss (thanks Orfy)
18) chill using immersion chiller and brew pot in ice bath
19) aerate wort
20) measure post boil gravity (adj. for temp.)
21) pitch yeast
22) add to sterilized fermenter
23) close lid tightly
24) insert airlock
25) RDWHA-6-HB
26) finalize notes
27) post on HBT -- help! It didn't go as planned
28) get many posts back saying it's fine and RDWHAHB

I didn't read all the steps but I think it looks good :fro:. One huge problem though, with all that RDWHAHB you'll be sure to screw it up as you'll be seeing two mash tuns.

17a - Irish Moss ?

yup -- it's in the fridge, and now on the list. thx orfy.

zoe - if I screw up too bad, I can blame it on the over consumption of home brew and not incorrect technique!

But perhaps the most important consideration: what's the recipe?

flyangler18 said:

But perhaps the most important consideration: what's the recipe?

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https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=31793

Ed's Haus Ale

An excellent choice! I brewed that same beer last Sunday!

You will be fine, you look well prepared. I think it took me at least one batch before I had a great AG. So go through with it, you wont know for a few weeks anyway. Next weekend brew another with what you learned this brew. That way you have backup brew just in case.


-DIG

This should be fun! I am looking fwd to venturing forth into the all-grain realm!

The weekend was shot with crappy weather and other crap, but me and Brew_MU's 1st AG adventure starts in 2 hours! more to follow with pics...

Sounds like a great plan. Let us know how the .. err, I mean brew session turns out.

alright, we're halfway through the mash (and 2 RDWHAHB's in); things are looking good. 5 minutes after dough in, the temp of the mash was 153!

one small mishap - the brass plug on the end of the braid popped off when we added the strike water. oops. but, a quick adjustment and went ahead with the dough in.

heating the sparge water, getting the hop schedule sorted out, and getting ready for the boil.

hope all goes well. But 6 beers in let's find out .

AZ_IPA said:

alright, we're halfway through the mash (and 2 RDWHAHB's in); things are looking good. 5 minutes after dough in, the temp of the mash was 153!

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one small mishap - the brass plug on the end of the braid popped off when we added the strike water. oops. but, a quick adjustment and went ahead with the dough in.

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Oops! Yeah I think we all have one or two of those, that's half the fun of building your own gear. :cross:

Hope all is going well. My first AG batch, I was nervous as all get out. Thanks HBT for the support, I am now on number 3 and don't think anything of it!

alrightie, just racked to the fermenter....

I'll post the final #'s tomorrow as we're a little

but, other than the early mishap, things went smooth. Only recovered about 1.8 gallons from the 1st runnings, but had 5 gallons heated ready to sparge if we needed all of it (and we did).

No other problems after the boil -- just like full boil extract at that point. used an IC and ice bath and chilled from 202* to 74* in 12 minutes! gotta love the cold tap water in northern Arizona.

overall, I'm excited; everything went relatively smooth; the efficiency is probably a little low, but I'll know more when I run the numbers tomorrow.

I'm sweating like I just ran a couple miles, but I was well prepared thanks mainly to the folks on HBT! :rockin:

p.s. start to finish in just over 4 hours. I'm happy with that!

Thanks again to everyone on this forum. You all have been very helpful and not arrogant or condescending to us n00bs at all!

AZ_IPA Welcome to AG, looks like things went really smoothly. It's nice when a plan comes together, especially when the outcome is BEER.

Thanks Kauai and others

I just calculated the efficieny at 62%. A little lower than I had hoped for, but not bad for my first AG batch, as I was hoping for above 60%.

That is, if I calculated right:

potential SG=total PPG/gallons collected in primary
efficiency=post-boil OG/potential SG

I'm at a loss for how to get the efficiency up, as I'm pretty sure my technique was pretty good. (other than buying a grain mill to ensure a better grind)

3.3 gallon dough-in @ 169* (with a pre-heated MLT)
1 hour mash @ 153* (8lbs 2-row, 2-lbs vienna, 0.5lbs Crystal-10)
5 gallon double sparge @ 180*

6.5 gallons in the pot, 1 hr. boil, 5.5 gallons into the fermenter @ 1.042

We'll see what happens with the next batch. It was sure a fun experience making this batch!

You did good.

You could try a 90 minute mash, and check for conversion.
You may also want to check your PH, see if you may need to adjust.
Stir very well in each batch sparge, and wait 10 minutes to allow diffusion of the sugar into the water.
Otherwise, .042 will make a nice beer, BTW that is what I got the first AG I made with that same recipe. Tasted great.

the prep



the dough-in



the first runnings

Kauai_Kahuna said:

You could try a 90 minute mash, and check for conversion.
You may also want to check your PH, see if you may need to adjust.
Stir very well in each batch sparge, and wait 10 minutes to allow diffusion of the sugar into the water.
Otherwise, .042 will make a nice beer, BTW that is what I got the first AG I made with that same recipe. Tasted great.

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conversion looked good after 60; I do need to read up more on pH adjustment; and I probably could be a little more patient with my sparging...

The wort tasted great right before we closed the lid!

one other thing - I drained with the valve 100% open; in hindsight I'm thinking maybe a slower drain speed will allow for a little better sugar extraction?

all grain is the best and you chose a great recipe for your first. My first AG went fairly well. My FG never went down all the way and stayed the same for 2 weeks. But it tastes good and has enough alcohol and it's sitting in the secondary waiting for the kegs to come. good luck!

AZ_IPA said:

conversion looked good after 60; I do need to read up more on pH adjustment; and I probably could be a little more patient with my sparging...
The wort tasted great right before we closed the lid!
one other thing - I drained with the valve 100% open; in hindsight I'm thinking maybe a slower drain speed will allow for a little better sugar extraction?

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Kaiser has a number of threads on mashing, and he and others have stated that the crush, and batch sparge speed should not really matter. I'm new to AG myself so I'm not going to disagree.
There are a number of threads about how to take a reading on your first runnings, and determining your mash efficiency based on the SG, the grain and water volume. Once you have that down, then it is a sparging / sugar extraction issue.

All in all, what matters is the beer, everything else is just room for improvement. It sounds like you have the process down, and your volumes right on. :rockin:

Best of luck, and I hope you love your first AG as much as I did.

yeah I took gravities of the 1st thru 3rd runnings. But, I took 'em hot - between 147* and 158* and I noticed Palmer's temp correction only goes up to 120*.

I'll do some more searches and hopefully fire up the MLT again this weekend. I gotta start kegging now!

AZ_IPA said:

yeah I took gravities of the 1st thru 3rd runnings. But, I took 'em hot - between 147* and 158* and I noticed Palmer's temp correction only goes up to 120*.

I'll do some more searches and hopefully fire up the MLT again this weekend. I gotta start kegging now!

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When I take my pre boil gravities I put it in a pint glass and stick them in the fridge for a few minutes to get the temps down.

That gets me closer to the temps needed for an accurate measurement.

mmb said:

When I take my pre boil gravities I put it in a pint glass and stick them in the fridge for a few minutes to get the temps down.

That gets me closer to the temps needed for an accurate measurement.

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Yeah, that's what I'll do this weekend.

here's my uncorrected gravities of the three runnings, and based on them, I think my lauter efficiency was good, so I'm wondering if pH (& mash efficiency) is the issue?

1st runnings - 1.066 (147* = 1.8 gallons collected)
2nd runnings - 1.038 (144* = 1.7 gallons collected)
3rd runnings - 1.000 (158* = 3 gallons collected)
pre boil - 1.028 (150* = 6.5 gallons)
post boil - 1.040 (74* = 5.5 gallons)

* Update *

racked the beer to the bright tank yesterday and harvested the Notty yeast into 4 pints (since the stuff is rare these days).

The gravity reading is now at 1.007 (OG = 1.042)

The sample tasted delicious, and I can see why this is Ed's Haus Ale!

gotta get some more ingredients and start some more brews!

Kauai_Kahuna said:

Kaiser has a number of threads on mashing, and he and others have stated that the crush, and batch sparge speed should not really matter.

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Not to get all weird here, but the crush is certainly plays a role in efficiency. Batch sparging though, the runoff speed is not terribly important from what I understand. Fly sparging otoh, the runoff is crucial to achieving maximum efficiency.

AZ_IPA said:

Yeah, that's what I'll do this weekend.
2nd runnings - 1.038 (144* = 1.7 gallons collected)
3rd runnings - 1.000 (158* = 3 gallons collected)
pre boil - 1.028 (150* = 6.5 gallons)
post boil - 1.040 (74* = 5.5 gallons)

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AZ_IPA - I would recommend splitting your 2nd and 3rd batch sparge volume evenly, and use water at around 180F to get the grain bed up to around 165F to 168F. You want your third runnings above 1.010.

As far as the crush goes, I did not say I agreed, I simply stated I did not have a strong enough background to disagree. In any case, right now I would just recommend brewing a few more batches, figure out your process then you can up the recipe grain bill if needed.

I did Orfy's Mild last weekend. I sparged with 185 water and STILL didn't get my grainbed warm enough (due to such a small grain bill I only got to 155*F) so my efficiency ended up 5% lower than usual. I usually am 165-170*F by the last runnings.

Now... get that pipeline full!

I don't know why people are so scared of simple batch sparge AG brewing. Once you get the vocabulary down, it's pretty easy. IMO the hardest part is keeping my 7 gallon brewpot from boiling over.

On efficiency, my 1st AG was about 65%. I crushed a little tighter on the next one, slowed my sparge, and let both of my batch sparges sit for about 6-10 minutes after stirring before draining. I calculated 85% on my 2nd AG.


Mike

Kauai_Kahuna said:

AZ_IPA - I would recommend splitting your 2nd and 3rd batch sparge volume evenly, and use water at around 180F to get the grain bed up to around 165F to 168F. You want your third runnings above 1.010.

As far as the crush goes, I did not say I agreed, I simply stated I did not have a strong enough background to disagree. In any case, right now I would just recommend brewing a few more batches, figure out your process then you can up the recipe grain bill if needed.

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Thx Kauai. I do need to get the sparge water hotter. On my 2nd AG, I heated it to 185 in the brew kettle, then poured into a smaller kettle to carry to the MLT. Of course I lost A LOT of heat when I poured into the smaller (cool) kettle.

I also forgot to mention that my gravity readings were taken with the hot samples and are uncorrected for temp. I learned - and now am chilling the samples down to ~60 prior to reading.

blk94f150 said:

I don't know why people are so scared of simple batch sparge AG brewing. Once you get the vocabulary down, it's pretty easy.

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Mike - it is easy. Just fear of the unknown for me! I've done 2 batches now and it's not bad at all.

Heck, in some ways it's easier than extract brewing - I hate scraping all that extract out of the bucket and getting everything sticky.

I had the same feelings at first. After I did it though, I didn't know what the fuss was all about.



Mike