Dunkelweizen Question

So I am fairly new at this beer brewing (about 8 months). I have had some GREAT success with kits and with all grain. My problem lately has been that every batch of Dunkelweizen I have tried to brew, has turned out bad.

One batch never achieved good carbonation and tasted like vinegar and the other one was carbonated out the whazoo and tasted like cider!! Lets refer to them as Batch 1,2 & 3.

Batch 1, my daughter kept pulling out the airlock so I moved it out of her reach and during the fermentation process, the temperature in the room reached almost 80 degrees because my wife turned off the AC during the day when we were not at home. So, I am assuming the failure there was O2 during the fermentation process and higher temperatures?? I typically ferment my beers for 3-4 weeks assuring there is no more activity and any particles are settled. ANY SUGGESTIONS?

Batch 2, I was careful about the location of my 5gal bucket so my 2yo daughter could not rip out my airlock. I was also good about keeping the temperature in the room about 70.0 - 72.0 during fermentation. When I 2nd racked the beer, I noticed there were allot of air bubbles in my transfer tube, but did not think much of it. Found out later that my Siphon tube had a crack in it and was introducing allot of O2 into the beer when I 2nd racked it. THAT could explain the cider taste...but OMG the amount of carbonation in these beers was out of this world. ANY SUGGESTIONS??

Batch 3 is currently in the 2nd day of fermentation. I have it in a water bath to maintain the a temperature of 68.0F during the fermentation process. I have a new siphon and plan to do a 2nd racking in about 4-5 more days. The bucket is well out of reach of little hands that would play with the airlock. I will let you know what happens.

ANY HELP or SUGGESTIONS with this would be greatly appreciated.

Vinegar/Cider combined with gushers.... Sounds like an infection to me. What are you sanitizing with, how are you sanitizing, and did you get a new siphon tube?

First 2 batches were infections, simple as that. Sanitize better.
With a good recipe, good yeast management, and good sanitation you shouldn't get poor or excessive carbonation, and definitely not cider or vinegar flavors.

veritas524 said:

Vinegar/Cider combined with gushers.... Sounds like an infection to me. What are you sanitizing with, how are you sanitizing, and did you get a new siphon tube?

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I am sanitizing with one step and warm water. After I brew, I run my utensils and equipment through the dishwasher with some one step, then run the cycle again with just water.

I did get a new siphon and hose before I brewed this last batch. I had to bottle my previous batch of American Red Amber and needed the siphon anyway for that process.

pdxal said:

First 2 batches were infections, simple as that. Sanitize better.
With a good recipe, good yeast management, and good sanitation you shouldn't get poor or excessive carbonation, and definitely not cider or vinegar flavors.

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Thank you. The volcanic eruptions after I popped the top was pretty odd...it acted like champagne and tasted like cider. I waited almost 45 days after bottling to test my sample and I figured after that amount of time in the bottle it should not taste/act like that.

Sadly I had to dump the batch (insert TAPS here)

Go buy star San, it will help your sanitation issues.

veritas524 said:

Go buy star San, it will help your sanitation issues.

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I just got back from 5th Season and bought some Star San there. Thanks for the advice, it helps allot.

kicary said:

Batch 3 is currently in the 2nd day of fermentation. ... I have a new siphon and plan to do a 2nd racking in about 4-5 more days.

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This might be the problem with #2 if you fermented for 6-7 days and then racked. Do NOT do that. I don't care what your recipe sheet or old "How To Brew" guide say, you should let that beer sit in the primary for 2-3 weeks without touching it. Hell, if it started fermenting normally, don't even bother with a gravity reading for the first 2 weeks.

Beer #2 might have been racked early, then kicked up again in the bottles, resulting in gushers. Racking sometimes has the effect of stalling out the yeast, for whatever reason. They prefer you to leave them the hell alone until they have eaten all that delicious wort, and have had a few days or a week or so to just sit at final gravity and clean up their biproducts.

One Step is a cleaner, not a sanitizer. There's your problem!

Also, for a dunkelweizen, just do a 14 day primary and call it good no need to secondary.

ghpeel said:

This might be the problem with #2 if you fermented for 6-7 days and then racked. Do NOT do that. I don't care what your recipe sheet or old "How To Brew" guide say, you should let that beer sit in the primary for 2-3 weeks without touching it. Hell, if it started fermenting normally, don't even bother with a gravity reading for the first 2 weeks.

Beer #2 might have been racked early, then kicked up again in the bottles, resulting in gushers. Racking sometimes has the effect of stalling out the yeast, for whatever reason. They prefer you to leave them the hell alone until they have eaten all that delicious wort, and have had a few days or a week or so to just sit at final gravity and clean up their biproducts.

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I am just a HUGE fan of Dunkelweizen that I am on my 3rd try. I went out today and bought a 5gal keg, hoses, taps and fridge. I hope to have this tasty brew in the keg in about 2-3 weeks and in my glass about 2 weeks after that!!

AmandaK said:

One Step is a cleaner, not a sanitizer. There's your problem!

Also, for a dunkelweizen, just do a 14 day primary and call it good no need to secondary.

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I was sadly mislead that OneStep was a sanitizer...SHEESH I was wrong. Should have looked into this more clearly. Thanks for the advice about the primary. I was told today at my local home brew shop exactly what you suggested. Give it 14 - 17 days....put it into the keg, add the priming sugar, wait 7-10 days, apply CO2 stick it in the fridge and start pouring!!

kicary said:

I was sadly mislead that OneStep was a sanitizer...SHEESH I was wrong. Should have looked into this more clearly. Thanks for the advice about the primary. I was told today at my local home brew shop exactly what you suggested. Give it 14 - 17 days....put it into the keg, add the priming sugar, wait 7-10 days, apply CO2 stick it in the fridge and start pouring!!

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Or you could keg it, stick it in the fridge, apply co2 and wait 14 days...

Sounds like you clean/sanitize right after brewing. Your siphon and other equipment could get infected while waiting for their next use. Don't forget to sanitize right before you use the pieces of equipment to prevent infection.

UPDATE: We are on day 7 of batch #3 of the Dunkelweizen. The fermentation process has slowed to a crawl...getting some bubbles in my airlock every 20 min or so. It has been sitting in a water bath, maintained at 68-F. I can smell the banana tones and it smells incredible! I bottled my American Red Amber and it has settled quite well. I will wait 7 more days until I prime it, keg it then drink the $%^&*& out of it!!