HoppyDaze
Well-Known Member
I figured this was the place to share the 'Dry Side Supporters' hop based logo. They're a sub-group of Emerald City Supporters who are based in the 'dry' side of the state, ie east/yakima valley etc.
how unoriginal
The [Horribly Unpopular] Soccer Thread
- Thread starter Reno_eNVy
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how unoriginal
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Reno_eNVy
Well-Known Member
how unoriginal
Oh no, they're somewhat vaguely similar! How dare they.
And the Timbers use plant imagery as well! How unoriginal!
Well, it wasn't pretty, but the USMNT U-23's came away with a positive result in Colombia. Luis Gil netted a nice early goal in the 5th minute and the U-23's pretty much bunkered and countered after that, with only a handful of real chances and gave up something like 80% of the possession. Were it not for a penalty in the second half (a bit of gamesmanship from the Colombian player but a legitimate call) the U-23's would've walked away with an outright win, but a 1-1 draw with the away goal advantage isn't bad either. If the U-23's can keep a clean sheet on US soil they'll be in to the Olympics.
hoppyhoppyhippo
Well-Known Member
Hopefully Yedlin makes the move to the U-23s. Probably would like Brooks too, but the CBs supposedly did well (I was at a dinner
)Looking forward to 3 poiins in Guatemala.
Embarrassing show by the USMNT
Expecting humiliating defeats at the copa this summer.
Has gotten old.
6 of 11 players played out of club position by JK last night. 7 defenders called in, 6 are CBs(iirc). The heat turned up a bit after last summer's gold cup, it is now really high. Anything other than a win Tues and the usmnt as well as JK one would hope, are in trouble.
I saw some wonderful statistics about possession, possession in the attacking 3rd, scoring chances, set piece effectiveness, etc. after the 2014 WC and JK's crew had the worst showing since 98 iirc. Down in virtually every meaningful metric.
This USMNT group isn't great but it is far better than they have shown. I'll say additionally that the player pool has taken a dip but there are a lot of bright young prospects emerging and the coming decade looks exciting. It is almost inexcusable that JK hasn't delivered on anything he's promised or 'talked up'.
I say all of this as someone that supported him for the HC job, while always believing he'd be a better TD than HC and believing there would be some give in order to get the benefit of his bigger vision. After the 2014 WC the US should have gotten a new coach and should have at that time promoted JK to overall TD ... but even that is a huge stretch considering how the youth teams have performed, not in results but style. The program has moved backwards in so many ways and it is the federation's fault more than anything else. Sunil should have some very VERY tough questions to answer.
I saw some wonderful statistics about possession, possession in the attacking 3rd, scoring chances, set piece effectiveness, etc. after the 2014 WC and JK's crew had the worst showing since 98 iirc. Down in virtually every meaningful metric.
This USMNT group isn't great but it is far better than they have shown. I'll say additionally that the player pool has taken a dip but there are a lot of bright young prospects emerging and the coming decade looks exciting. It is almost inexcusable that JK hasn't delivered on anything he's promised or 'talked up'.
I say all of this as someone that supported him for the HC job, while always believing he'd be a better TD than HC and believing there would be some give in order to get the benefit of his bigger vision. After the 2014 WC the US should have gotten a new coach and should have at that time promoted JK to overall TD ... but even that is a huge stretch considering how the youth teams have performed, not in results but style. The program has moved backwards in so many ways and it is the federation's fault more than anything else. Sunil should have some very VERY tough questions to answer.
I went to bed early instead after my hockey game, but I heard the USMNT performance was absolutely horrible, and just about everyone puts it on Klinsmann.
However, England pulled a big comeback in their friendly against Germany, with Tottenham players at the forefront. No Spurs injuries at least. Which is all that matters for a match with no stakes whatsoever. Of course, I was in the midst of judging a competition and wasn't able to watch that either.
And then a tribute to Cruyff at yesterday's France/Netherlands friendly. http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/35862144
It's stupid to play friendlies at this point in the league. Has anyone here pointed that out yet?
However, England pulled a big comeback in their friendly against Germany, with Tottenham players at the forefront. No Spurs injuries at least. Which is all that matters for a match with no stakes whatsoever. Of course, I was in the midst of judging a competition and wasn't able to watch that either.
And then a tribute to Cruyff at yesterday's France/Netherlands friendly. http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/35862144
It's stupid to play friendlies at this point in the league. Has anyone here pointed that out yet?
hoppyhoppyhippo
Well-Known Member
Well, I don't agree with the position thing.
It was basically Cameron and Yedlin really playing out of position.
Someone said Orozco was out of position, but first things first is Orozco was playing because Brooks and Besler couldn't go. If either of them could go, he wouldn't have played. Second is that he's a center back.
Even with Cameron and Yedlin, they've often played and succeeded for the USMNT in the roles they were put out there for. Being "out of position" is an excuse.
Cameron is a flex player, he's played Central defense, Central Mid defense, and rightback for Stoke this year. His biggest strength is he's incredibly flexible as a player.
To get to 6 I'm assuming you're going with Cameron, Yedlin, Bedoya, Bradley, Mix and Orozco.
Bradley and Mix were in the middle. Regardless of if Klinsmann wants one forward and one not, they were in the middle playing with each other. Would I have rather had mix in a true 10 role, yes, but that's not really an option without moving Bradley to CDM and Bradley is way too important to the attacking game for the US to not be. THe goal of Klinsmann having Mix be more defensive is likely to have Bradley paired with someone who'll hold back and let BRadley go forward without fear of leaving the back exposed.
I don't get the Orozco thing, He's beena center back for ages, I don't care if he's started playing out wide as well. He's also talented in that fashion. But he's been a CB for ages.
Which comes to Bedoya. Bedoya was deployed on the left mid. That is different than his club role where he was playing CAM or RAM. Firs tthins first, we do not run a 4-2-3-1 which is seemingly Nantes's chosen formation. Second, he's done this, this wasn't the first time he played on the left side. It's a different game than the right side, but Bedoya's play on the left wasn't why we lost. We lost because of execution. Mix ****ing up the corner, and then whatever in god's name you call that Ruiz goal. That was just a colossal ****up from the Back line.
I think overall the game was showing that we didn't ahve the right defenders and that's on Klinsmann, I don't know why Evans or Chandler, or someone else wasn't called in. He's using yedlin at RM because he's not ready to be a RB yet, but he wants to play him. IMO if he's not ready to be RB he should be on the bench. But that's my opinion. I also don't think Yedlin was our problem.
When I step away from the game and think about it, it reminded me a lot of the loss to Jamaica. We played the better technical game, but lost becuase of critical mental lapses. I didn't watch the whole match (fell asleep in the middle of it like an old man) but what I saw we were the more dangerous side, We had the lion's share of possession (63/37) we took more shots and more importantly had more on target. THey just had the ones that counted.
Now to look at the optimistic side of things. we win out we still win the group. Beating Guatemala would give them a max 12 points. Beating T&T would give them a max 13. But we have a massive goal differential advantage over T&T so far as they barely beat St. Vincent who we shelacked.
Grannyknot
Well-Known Member
I actually thought the Germany/England game was one of the best international matches i've seen in a long long time. Definitely the best friendly i've ever seen. Sort of renewed my interest in the international competitions.
I wish I would have had time to watch it. But, like most people with a vested interest in players I end up hoping for lack of injury more than anything else.
Glad to see another club over country type. I like national team soccer because of the boys from the neighborhood feel and to see how my leagues players progress(MLS). That u.s. citizens can beat guatemalans or frenchmen is of little concern to me. There is a strong thread of jingoistic nationalism in such soccer and Olympic Games that is very unhealthy/unappealing. Don't get me wrong I follow and care enough to analyze and post but I subscribe to the George carlin line of thinking in regard to nationalism.
HoppyDaze
Well-Known Member
Grannyknot
Well-Known Member
I wouldnt say i'm club over country or the opposite.
But i do enjoy international matches.
The first game I ever went to was an England game.
Just a little more coherent from the USMNT tonight. And by little, I mean a lot.
hoppyhoppyhippo
Well-Known Member
I want to say, Klinsmann played at least 3 guys out of position. fire him. Why wasn't Bradley a holding mid? Or Gyasi on the left side? or WOod striking? Or Graham as a RW or RAM?
Jurgen needs to stop playing guys out of position, obviously we'll never have success.
Jurgen needs to stop playing guys out of position, obviously we'll never have success.
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Reno_eNVy
Well-Known Member
Just being a weirdo
And yes. They lose, they're out.
Bradley seems to thrive in a CAM role for the Yanks. I think the position suits him for the nats.
hoppyhoppyhippo
Well-Known Member
BRadley is a CM. He is probably best as a true box to box. He can play CAM or CDM, but he's best when he's got freedom. The whole playing people out of position excuse is one I'm just tired of. Every NT coach has a different system than pretty much every player's club team. Either in formation, style etc. It's about fitting each players skills into your team. Position doesn't amtter. The way Bedoya or Zusi plays wide will be different than Green or Dempsey, or Donovan or any other wide player.
A solid win by the USMNT, not much more to say other than the fact that we won when we should have and that it's great that we cap-tied Christian Pulisic. I'd like to focus on something else though: the USMNT U23 failure to qualify for the Olympics yet again. The oddest thing about this is that the U-17 and U-20 teams have done somewhere between okay and great, getting into their respective World Cups with the U-20's actually getting to the quarter finals...so what's going on here?
The Kids Are All Right...Until College
In the US, getting kids properly trained is difficult enough; most academies are still pay to play and MLS teams don't start actively scouting and training until age 14 at the earliest. Still, perhaps due simply to the size of the pool that we have compared to many countries, we manage to put together a decent U-17 team on a regular basis, a team that just won the 44th Mondial Football de Montaigu tournament. The U-20 team got to the quarterfinals of the U20 World Cup.
So what happens in between? In a word? College. For most of the rest of the world, the next step after turning 17 is to go pro (if you're good enough), for the US players, that is, by and large, college. The NCAA US men's system is absolutely horrible for developing players, games are only 60 minutes long and there are 6 subs allowed, even allowing players to be subbed out and back in. The season is also much shorter than a professional's nearly year long slog. While most of the U23's we saw last night have a team now, they've spent at least some time in college, the most famous example being Jordan Morris. As Alejandro Moreno pointed out last night, most of Colombia's starters have over 50 professional matches under their belts, but only 2 of the US starters could say the same.
For me, one moment encapsulated the problem more clearly than anything else, Jordan Morris was on the break and paused to look around to try to put a cross in...and was surprised to see the Colombia player had kept up with him. As a Sounders fan I've seen this play out several times already and it's glaring; Morris' competition in college was usually so inferior that he could put a lot of distance between him and other players and get a clear cross off, but true professionals won't be fooled. College is equivalent for the USMNT to the police baton to Nancy Kerrigan's legs.
MLS Should Be More Helpful
If college is the crippling blow then MLS is the long, slow recovery, but this recovery is slowed down by the stodgy traditionalism of MLS coaches. Generally speaking, MLS coaches prefer to play "veteran" players to young ones, guys who are battle-tested and "gritty". Teams like the LA Galaxy and Seattle Sounders, who field some of the oldest teams in MLS and are coached by the stodgiest of veteran coaches and old rivals, Bruce Arena and Sigi Schmid, will generally only field young guys when they're clearly better than anything else available on the roster by a great deal. The Galaxy's response to losing to Seattle in the playoffs last year was to get older, bringing in guys like Ashley Cole to bolster an already creaky roster filled with guys like Robbie Keane and Steven Gerrard. The Sounders have struggled to score lately, particularly the young subs like Darwin Jones and Oalex Anderson, players that look to be good (on paper) and have been spent time with national teams and the Sounders response has been to sign the 33 year old Hercules Gomez instead of trying to figure out why these fast young kids aren't able to score for them. There's nothing wrong with having some veterans on your team, but when that's just about all you've got? There's a problem there, because eventually the kids will need to play for you to have a player pool.
Some teams have changed, motivated by big payoffs from kids like Deandre Yedlin and Matt Miazga going overseas, and also by the fact that young kids are cheaper than veterans; coaches like Oscar Pareja, Gregg Berhalter and Jesse Marsch have thrown players in the deep waters consistently and gotten them to swim. It's difficult to tell if this is a passing trend or the future of MLS, though I suspect with teams building their academies it might be. The fact remains that MLS doesn't play young kids often enough for them to get real experience.
Will Things Improve?
Ultimately, with the homegrown program MLS has implemented and the increasingly better US academies, I think the U23's will catch up...but it might not be in the next 4 years when Olympic qualifying comes around again. If anything, hope for the collapse of the NCAA, perhaps due to the growing belief that kids shouldn't destroy their bodies playing 2nd tier football or basketball without receiving a salary, to speed up the process.
The Kids Are All Right...Until College
In the US, getting kids properly trained is difficult enough; most academies are still pay to play and MLS teams don't start actively scouting and training until age 14 at the earliest. Still, perhaps due simply to the size of the pool that we have compared to many countries, we manage to put together a decent U-17 team on a regular basis, a team that just won the 44th Mondial Football de Montaigu tournament. The U-20 team got to the quarterfinals of the U20 World Cup.
So what happens in between? In a word? College. For most of the rest of the world, the next step after turning 17 is to go pro (if you're good enough), for the US players, that is, by and large, college. The NCAA US men's system is absolutely horrible for developing players, games are only 60 minutes long and there are 6 subs allowed, even allowing players to be subbed out and back in. The season is also much shorter than a professional's nearly year long slog. While most of the U23's we saw last night have a team now, they've spent at least some time in college, the most famous example being Jordan Morris. As Alejandro Moreno pointed out last night, most of Colombia's starters have over 50 professional matches under their belts, but only 2 of the US starters could say the same.
For me, one moment encapsulated the problem more clearly than anything else, Jordan Morris was on the break and paused to look around to try to put a cross in...and was surprised to see the Colombia player had kept up with him. As a Sounders fan I've seen this play out several times already and it's glaring; Morris' competition in college was usually so inferior that he could put a lot of distance between him and other players and get a clear cross off, but true professionals won't be fooled. College is equivalent for the USMNT to the police baton to Nancy Kerrigan's legs.
MLS Should Be More Helpful
If college is the crippling blow then MLS is the long, slow recovery, but this recovery is slowed down by the stodgy traditionalism of MLS coaches. Generally speaking, MLS coaches prefer to play "veteran" players to young ones, guys who are battle-tested and "gritty". Teams like the LA Galaxy and Seattle Sounders, who field some of the oldest teams in MLS and are coached by the stodgiest of veteran coaches and old rivals, Bruce Arena and Sigi Schmid, will generally only field young guys when they're clearly better than anything else available on the roster by a great deal. The Galaxy's response to losing to Seattle in the playoffs last year was to get older, bringing in guys like Ashley Cole to bolster an already creaky roster filled with guys like Robbie Keane and Steven Gerrard. The Sounders have struggled to score lately, particularly the young subs like Darwin Jones and Oalex Anderson, players that look to be good (on paper) and have been spent time with national teams and the Sounders response has been to sign the 33 year old Hercules Gomez instead of trying to figure out why these fast young kids aren't able to score for them. There's nothing wrong with having some veterans on your team, but when that's just about all you've got? There's a problem there, because eventually the kids will need to play for you to have a player pool.
Some teams have changed, motivated by big payoffs from kids like Deandre Yedlin and Matt Miazga going overseas, and also by the fact that young kids are cheaper than veterans; coaches like Oscar Pareja, Gregg Berhalter and Jesse Marsch have thrown players in the deep waters consistently and gotten them to swim. It's difficult to tell if this is a passing trend or the future of MLS, though I suspect with teams building their academies it might be. The fact remains that MLS doesn't play young kids often enough for them to get real experience.
Will Things Improve?
Ultimately, with the homegrown program MLS has implemented and the increasingly better US academies, I think the U23's will catch up...but it might not be in the next 4 years when Olympic qualifying comes around again. If anything, hope for the collapse of the NCAA, perhaps due to the growing belief that kids shouldn't destroy their bodies playing 2nd tier football or basketball without receiving a salary, to speed up the process.
In case you haven't heard, the USWNT team is suing US Soccer over pay, part of a long running feud and countersuit to US Soccer in a pay dispute. Before anything else, even if you have no interest in the women's game keep in mind this could affect the USMNT, if the women strike and boycott the Olympics, the US Soccer federation would be suspended by FIFA while the men are going through crucial world cup qualifiers. Here's an article on the news from ESPN. US Women Sue US Soccer Now, admittedly the suit is about more than just pay, it's also about the state of the soccer fields and other issues. In those issues, I think most soccer fans agree with them fully.
Where things get stickier is pay. The numbers put out by the women paint US soccer as paying the USWNT significantly less, let's dive into that a bit more though, let's start with the revenue projections USWNT is relying on. For one, the projections are based on the USWNT winning the Olympics and then having another "victory tour". For another, the revenues are strictly based on butts in seats and does not project for things like jersey sales or TV revenues (which is hidden in SUM, US Soccer's marketing arm). Copa America money is marked separately, but at least some of that is men’s revenue (and realistically, the Copa wouldn't be here if we didn't have a men's team). Finally, the revenue projection is based on the afterglow of the Women's World Cup and expected Olympic vitories, that isn’t likely to last as the USMNT get deeper into WCQ and the women’s game essentially goes back to sleep mode for another two years. Overall, the men still bring in more cash, period.
As far as the bonuses, those are also deceptive, because the women probably cost more overall. Unlike the USMNT, the women are paid a 5-6 figure salary that gets bigger if they play in the NWSL, they also get benefits and maternity leave at 50% salary. A USWNT player can not step on the field all year and still make a decent living, but a USMNT player only makes money from playing for the USMNT if they play.I’m pretty sure US Soccer would be happy to increase those bonuses, even make them higher than the men, if the women drop the salary and benefits.
Overall, I think it's a ploy by the US women, they know that to disprove their allegations US Soccer would have to divulge earnings via SUM and other revenue streams they don't disclose, and want to for US Soccer to the negotiating table. This will likely get settled sooner rather than later.
Where things get stickier is pay. The numbers put out by the women paint US soccer as paying the USWNT significantly less, let's dive into that a bit more though, let's start with the revenue projections USWNT is relying on. For one, the projections are based on the USWNT winning the Olympics and then having another "victory tour". For another, the revenues are strictly based on butts in seats and does not project for things like jersey sales or TV revenues (which is hidden in SUM, US Soccer's marketing arm). Copa America money is marked separately, but at least some of that is men’s revenue (and realistically, the Copa wouldn't be here if we didn't have a men's team). Finally, the revenue projection is based on the afterglow of the Women's World Cup and expected Olympic vitories, that isn’t likely to last as the USMNT get deeper into WCQ and the women’s game essentially goes back to sleep mode for another two years. Overall, the men still bring in more cash, period.
As far as the bonuses, those are also deceptive, because the women probably cost more overall. Unlike the USMNT, the women are paid a 5-6 figure salary that gets bigger if they play in the NWSL, they also get benefits and maternity leave at 50% salary. A USWNT player can not step on the field all year and still make a decent living, but a USMNT player only makes money from playing for the USMNT if they play.I’m pretty sure US Soccer would be happy to increase those bonuses, even make them higher than the men, if the women drop the salary and benefits.
Overall, I think it's a ploy by the US women, they know that to disprove their allegations US Soccer would have to divulge earnings via SUM and other revenue streams they don't disclose, and want to for US Soccer to the negotiating table. This will likely get settled sooner rather than later.
Another week of MLS, another week of crazy stuff.
Brek Shea Scored a Pretty Goal
Just look at this goal:
That's one of the nicest goals you'll see all year. This was just one part of a very good night for Orlando City and a very bad night for the Timbers. The champs seem to be reeling in their first few weeks back after winning MLS Cup, they sit second to last in the west, it could be bad luck or it could be the fact that everyone has studied their tapes and their new formation. Either way, take nothing away from OCSC who stomped the Timbers 4-0 en route to becoming the top of the eastern conference, they're scary and they're legit.
Jesse Marsch Mad
The Red Bulls lost on Friday after New England scored a goal when Kemar Lawrence went down injured during a sequence of play and coach Jesse Marsch was not happy, calling New England "shameful" for playing through Lawrence's injury. You can see Lawrence go down at 1:48 here: Revolution vs Red Bulls Highlights, the play is extremely quick as you'll note from the replays, and Agudelo and Fagundez both said they had no idea Lawrence was hurt. Let's be honest though, if the roles were reversed, Marsch would have been incensed if his players had played the ball out when a defender went down just outside of the penalty box; an unwritten rule of football is that you play the ball out if someone looks to be seriously injured, but that does't apply during quick attack sequences like the one Lawrence was injured on. Marsch is just complaining to distract from the Red Bulls' awful start, NYRB are currently sitting in third in the east.
FC Dallas Pick Up Where They Left Off
Last year FC Dallas was, I felt, the best overall team in the league. They didn't pick up the Supporter's Shield or the MLS Cup, but they ended top of a very contentious western conference and looked like the real deal after beating the Seattle Sounders. Dallas may have tied on Saturday but they still have the best overall record in the league at 3-1-1 and they're just as good as they were last year. Could this be their year? I think it might be, but time will tell.
Brek Shea Scored a Pretty Goal
Just look at this goal:
That's one of the nicest goals you'll see all year. This was just one part of a very good night for Orlando City and a very bad night for the Timbers. The champs seem to be reeling in their first few weeks back after winning MLS Cup, they sit second to last in the west, it could be bad luck or it could be the fact that everyone has studied their tapes and their new formation. Either way, take nothing away from OCSC who stomped the Timbers 4-0 en route to becoming the top of the eastern conference, they're scary and they're legit.
Jesse Marsch Mad
The Red Bulls lost on Friday after New England scored a goal when Kemar Lawrence went down injured during a sequence of play and coach Jesse Marsch was not happy, calling New England "shameful" for playing through Lawrence's injury. You can see Lawrence go down at 1:48 here: Revolution vs Red Bulls Highlights, the play is extremely quick as you'll note from the replays, and Agudelo and Fagundez both said they had no idea Lawrence was hurt. Let's be honest though, if the roles were reversed, Marsch would have been incensed if his players had played the ball out when a defender went down just outside of the penalty box; an unwritten rule of football is that you play the ball out if someone looks to be seriously injured, but that does't apply during quick attack sequences like the one Lawrence was injured on. Marsch is just complaining to distract from the Red Bulls' awful start, NYRB are currently sitting in third in the east.
FC Dallas Pick Up Where They Left Off
Last year FC Dallas was, I felt, the best overall team in the league. They didn't pick up the Supporter's Shield or the MLS Cup, but they ended top of a very contentious western conference and looked like the real deal after beating the Seattle Sounders. Dallas may have tied on Saturday but they still have the best overall record in the league at 3-1-1 and they're just as good as they were last year. Could this be their year? I think it might be, but time will tell.
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hoppyhoppyhippo
Well-Known Member
Yeah it's a dumb dumb complaint.
Uh oh. FIFA might need a new president already. Infantino's name is signed to a document with a known World Cup bribery figure.
Infantino Panama Papers
And UEFA's offices were just raided...
UEFA Raided
Meet the new boss, same as the old one.
Infantino Panama Papers
And UEFA's offices were just raided...
UEFA Raided
Meet the new boss, same as the old one.
carloscede2
Well-Known Member
Cant believe wolfsburgo is kicking madrid's ass lol
A controversial week of MLS action, let's dig into it.
Vancouver Are Probably Pretty Bad
Vancouver lost to DC United 4-0 on Friday, but that's not the only reason I'm saying that they might be bad, after all anyone can have a bad day at the office. Vancouver's two wins have come off of questionable refereeing calls and their lone tie came off of a goalless draw against a Keane-less LA Galaxy. From a looks perspective, the bunker and counter of last year seems to be just bunker now, with only occasional rampaging attacks forward, if you're going to counter you really need to do so with a lot of numbers. What's more, Vancouver don't seem to be pressing to get the ball back on the flanks, pretty much allowing opposing teams to cross all day long. You can't win the game if you don't get the ball at least some of the time. For DC United, the relief is palpable, the first win of the season and the first goals of the season for both Fabian Espindola and Alvaro Saborio, their two best strikers.
Plata is Carrying Real Salt Lake
Every season there's an MLS team that has a surprise breakout striker that seems to drag them into the playoffs despite their other flaws, this year it appears that man is Joao Plata. I had thought that Yura Movsisyan would be the bright spot for RSL, but it appears that I was mistaken. Not only is Plata in the lead for the Golden Boot (with 4), he's second in assists (with 3) and his efficiency is excellent, putting 7 of his 11 shots on target and 4 of those in the back of the net. Plata makes RSL a real threat in the western conference, and as long he continues on this streak they'll continue to be a team people don't want to face.
What Goes Around...
The New England Revolution were upset that Toronto didn't play the ball out for an injured player on a piece of play that resulted in a goal. Pot called kettle black.
Reality Sets in for Patrick Vieira
NYCFC fired coach Jason Kreis after one season and put in their up and coming coach who had previously been coaching one of Manchester City's youth team. Vieira went into the season feeling very positive that he could do better and NYCFC's powers that be seemed to feel the same way. After 5 games NYCFC is more or less where it was under Kreis, just barely in the range of a playoff spot. NYCFC's lone win of the season came against their opponents tonight, the Chicago Fire but they played a listless and frustrating goalless draw in New York City tonight. With reality sinking in for the coach that winning in MLS isn't that easy, are the owners realizing that too now? The ownership group that included Manchester City and the Yankees seems to have come in with the idea that if you just throw money at a team in MLS the wins will come, but the fact of the matter is that MLS isn't structured that way. Butts in the seat seem to be dwindling as the luster of watching a team in New York City not win has worn off, with attendance hovering at about 22,000 people. The reality seems to be that the big money guys are still going to see the field if they are healthy and that Vieira is tasked with making sure they do, even if that isn't the best way forward. Chivas USA II anyone?
Nigel De Jong is a Dirty Player
Anyone that has watched soccer, whether international or club level, for the last decade or so is well aware that Nigel De Jong is a dirty player, but he just proved it again tonight. The man infamous among the USMNT fans for crippling Stuart Holden may have done it again, this time to Darlington Nagbe.
Nigel De Jong Stomp
De Jong stomped on Nagbe's ankle, forcing the midfielder off of the field, with announcers saying he could not walk under his own power even after receiving treatment. It's very possible that Nagbe's ankle is broken, which not only hurts the Timbers but also the USMNT. The disciplinary committee will no doubt hand out a multiple game ban for the ankle stomp, but the fact that Alan Chapman didn't give out a red given the supposed emphasis on cutting out dirty tackles to referees is a problem. If a less dangerous, not deliberately malicious tackle deserves a red card why doesn't this one?
Vancouver Are Probably Pretty Bad
Vancouver lost to DC United 4-0 on Friday, but that's not the only reason I'm saying that they might be bad, after all anyone can have a bad day at the office. Vancouver's two wins have come off of questionable refereeing calls and their lone tie came off of a goalless draw against a Keane-less LA Galaxy. From a looks perspective, the bunker and counter of last year seems to be just bunker now, with only occasional rampaging attacks forward, if you're going to counter you really need to do so with a lot of numbers. What's more, Vancouver don't seem to be pressing to get the ball back on the flanks, pretty much allowing opposing teams to cross all day long. You can't win the game if you don't get the ball at least some of the time. For DC United, the relief is palpable, the first win of the season and the first goals of the season for both Fabian Espindola and Alvaro Saborio, their two best strikers.
Plata is Carrying Real Salt Lake
Every season there's an MLS team that has a surprise breakout striker that seems to drag them into the playoffs despite their other flaws, this year it appears that man is Joao Plata. I had thought that Yura Movsisyan would be the bright spot for RSL, but it appears that I was mistaken. Not only is Plata in the lead for the Golden Boot (with 4), he's second in assists (with 3) and his efficiency is excellent, putting 7 of his 11 shots on target and 4 of those in the back of the net. Plata makes RSL a real threat in the western conference, and as long he continues on this streak they'll continue to be a team people don't want to face.
What Goes Around...
The New England Revolution were upset that Toronto didn't play the ball out for an injured player on a piece of play that resulted in a goal. Pot called kettle black.
Reality Sets in for Patrick Vieira
NYCFC fired coach Jason Kreis after one season and put in their up and coming coach who had previously been coaching one of Manchester City's youth team. Vieira went into the season feeling very positive that he could do better and NYCFC's powers that be seemed to feel the same way. After 5 games NYCFC is more or less where it was under Kreis, just barely in the range of a playoff spot. NYCFC's lone win of the season came against their opponents tonight, the Chicago Fire but they played a listless and frustrating goalless draw in New York City tonight. With reality sinking in for the coach that winning in MLS isn't that easy, are the owners realizing that too now? The ownership group that included Manchester City and the Yankees seems to have come in with the idea that if you just throw money at a team in MLS the wins will come, but the fact of the matter is that MLS isn't structured that way. Butts in the seat seem to be dwindling as the luster of watching a team in New York City not win has worn off, with attendance hovering at about 22,000 people. The reality seems to be that the big money guys are still going to see the field if they are healthy and that Vieira is tasked with making sure they do, even if that isn't the best way forward. Chivas USA II anyone?
Nigel De Jong is a Dirty Player
Anyone that has watched soccer, whether international or club level, for the last decade or so is well aware that Nigel De Jong is a dirty player, but he just proved it again tonight. The man infamous among the USMNT fans for crippling Stuart Holden may have done it again, this time to Darlington Nagbe.
Nigel De Jong Stomp
De Jong stomped on Nagbe's ankle, forcing the midfielder off of the field, with announcers saying he could not walk under his own power even after receiving treatment. It's very possible that Nagbe's ankle is broken, which not only hurts the Timbers but also the USMNT. The disciplinary committee will no doubt hand out a multiple game ban for the ankle stomp, but the fact that Alan Chapman didn't give out a red given the supposed emphasis on cutting out dirty tackles to referees is a problem. If a less dangerous, not deliberately malicious tackle deserves a red card why doesn't this one?
Well, Leicester does it again. Really hoping the former (and current) Tottenham boys up in Sunderland could get it done, but no such luck.
However, we also took a very fun 3 points against Manchester United. It was a tense first half, but after Alli broke the stalemate, Man U reeled, and we scored an additional two in quick succession afterwards. Man U regained their footing and held us off for the remainer (and nothing for Harry Kane), but still a very clear decisive 3-0 victory at White Hart lane. We can win the rest of our matches the same, but it won't matter unless Leicester drops points, which I don't know if it will happen. They seem to have a knack for keeping slim margins despite opposing sides playing just as well.
In any event, it's enough to make second seem relatively secure with Arsenal and City still far enough behind that even with a game in hand they can't overtake us unless we screw up. As Chelsea has improved, they are a potential threat, as are Southampton. But that's not say I fear either, and even less so with Stoke, Newcastle, and West Brom. It's perfectly feasible to see us take 15 points from our remaining fixtures, although I expect 13, allowing a couple draws. Meanwhile Leicester still has Man U, who now must be getting desparate with 4th place still a possibility, and Chelsea as well, not to mention a relatively capable West Ham who are in the same boat as Man U. So while I'd say our title hopes are slim, they are not extinguished. If we win the remainder, and Leicester stumbles against those three, we may be able to pull it off.
Onward! Come On You Spurs!
However, we also took a very fun 3 points against Manchester United. It was a tense first half, but after Alli broke the stalemate, Man U reeled, and we scored an additional two in quick succession afterwards. Man U regained their footing and held us off for the remainer (and nothing for Harry Kane), but still a very clear decisive 3-0 victory at White Hart lane. We can win the rest of our matches the same, but it won't matter unless Leicester drops points, which I don't know if it will happen. They seem to have a knack for keeping slim margins despite opposing sides playing just as well.
In any event, it's enough to make second seem relatively secure with Arsenal and City still far enough behind that even with a game in hand they can't overtake us unless we screw up. As Chelsea has improved, they are a potential threat, as are Southampton. But that's not say I fear either, and even less so with Stoke, Newcastle, and West Brom. It's perfectly feasible to see us take 15 points from our remaining fixtures, although I expect 13, allowing a couple draws. Meanwhile Leicester still has Man U, who now must be getting desparate with 4th place still a possibility, and Chelsea as well, not to mention a relatively capable West Ham who are in the same boat as Man U. So while I'd say our title hopes are slim, they are not extinguished. If we win the remainder, and Leicester stumbles against those three, we may be able to pull it off.
Onward! Come On You Spurs!
carloscede2
Well-Known Member
Have a buddy that is a fan of Manchester, tried to tease hin but Barcelona didnt win either. He was still pretty pissed though
I love to mock my Liverpool supporting friend, but as Chelsea have done after sacking Mourinho, Liverpool have improved greatly under Klopp after sacking Rodgers, and it's hard to besmirch recent results. They're still not perfect, but we weren't under Poch last go around either. I think once Klopp has some time to exert influence over the tools at his disposal, Liverpool will be a serious top 4 contender next season.
Unfortunately I think it's too little too late for Manchester United. LVG will be gone come the summer, that should be without doubt at this point, unless he miraculously is able to squeak out top 4. And I doubt someone new is going to have the time to get it right for next season (even if JM comes in), so I'd expect a little improvement, but mostly much of the same, figure 4th-6th finish, 3rd if they're lucky.
I doubt Leicester's run will continue in seasons to come. I expect them to be beaten bloody and run ragged by the Champions Leauge (although I worry the same will happen to us, as our matches against Dortmund showed), and their Premier League performance to suffer as a result. Back down to mid table next season. When they then sell off Vardy, Mahrez, Drinkwater, Schmeicel, and probably others, and eventually fall back to their barely above relegation place in following seasons, if not back down to Championship.
Unfortunately I think it's too little too late for Manchester United. LVG will be gone come the summer, that should be without doubt at this point, unless he miraculously is able to squeak out top 4. And I doubt someone new is going to have the time to get it right for next season (even if JM comes in), so I'd expect a little improvement, but mostly much of the same, figure 4th-6th finish, 3rd if they're lucky.
I doubt Leicester's run will continue in seasons to come. I expect them to be beaten bloody and run ragged by the Champions Leauge (although I worry the same will happen to us, as our matches against Dortmund showed), and their Premier League performance to suffer as a result. Back down to mid table next season. When they then sell off Vardy, Mahrez, Drinkwater, Schmeicel, and probably others, and eventually fall back to their barely above relegation place in following seasons, if not back down to Championship.
BrewSavage
Well-Known Member
qhrumphf,
Are you conceding the title to Leicester?
Are you conceding the title to Leicester?
Nope. Not until it's over. We've got an easier final run in and a motivated side. If we win out, and they fumble to motivated ManU and in form Saints and Irons, it could still happen. Odds are certainly in their favor, but a chance is a chance.
Meanwhile a rough 5-0 loss on the pitch today. Couldn't maintain possession, slaughtered in midfield, and we only had a couple decent chances, all fired wide. At least i got an alright shot a hair wide.
Come On You Irons!
One of the few times you'll hear that from me. That, and hopefully a few Leicester reds, injuries, and suspensions.
One of the few times you'll hear that from me. That, and hopefully a few Leicester reds, injuries, and suspensions.
Thank the football gods for Andy Carroll!
And there's still time, plus Vardy's red card. There's hope for a Spurs title yet!
And there's still time, plus Vardy's red card. There's hope for a Spurs title yet!
I'm forever blowing bubbles!
Well that was a rollercoaster end to the match. A point is better than 3, but I'd still rather tail by 4 than 5. Onward to the Potters tomorrow then.
Aston Villa is being relegated and that means Brad Guzan, who was our presumed "next goalie up" for the USMNT is either out of a job or going to the 2nd tier of the English leagues. Where should he go from here? I have a vaguely informed opinion!
Staying in England
Let's start off by being frank, Brad Guzan has not had a good year, nobody at Aston Villa really has but Guzan's issues have been glaring. From his flubs at the Gold Cup to his flubs at Aston Villa, at times Guzan has looked downright awful. Realistically, no EPL team is likely to pick him up as their starting keeper, unless it's one of the Championship sides about to be promoted (I don't know much about tier 2 English soccer). He could stay in England and keep playing for Aston Villa...but I wouldn't recommend it. Aston Villa is a mess on the backend, even if they can afford and want to pay Guzan's roughly $2.4 million salary (1.7 pounds sterling) it's probably best to jump ship like a rat than sink, I don't think Villa is coming up for a few years at least. So staying in England probably means playing for a Championship side of some sort, personally I don't think that's going to get Guzan the experience to cement him as the USMNT #1 keeper.
The Rest of Europe
There's more to European soccer than just the premier league, and there are a lot more options out there. The Eredivisie has been pretty friendly to American imports, and in a league where you'll see lots of shots on goal a good keeper is a nice thing to have. The Bundesliga is, I think, out, Germany is producing plenty of talented keepers right now so there's not a lot of spots open. Spain, outside of teams from Barcelona or Madrid, is probably an option. Italy has, on occasion, been friendly to US imports as well. Chances are good Guzan could find a starting spot somewhere in a top league in Europe, and I think this would be the best option if he wants to become a true top-quality keeper.
Back to MLS
Guzan only played 3 seasons in MLS for the now defunct Chivas USA, just long enough for him to make an impression and get signed by Aston Villa. Guzan could go back to MLS...but I don't see it as being ideal. For one thing, while I think he'll take a "haircut" on his salary no matter what happens, I can't see an MLS team spending big on Guzan like the Rapids did for Tim Howard; he doesn't have the same sort of draw and legendary status that makes Howard a good business decision as a designated player (even if he isn't a great competitive decision). That means Guzan needs to come in as a player either under the salary maximum ($450k) or at the least somewhere near where it's easy to "buy down" his contract with allocation money so he isn't on the books as a designated player, basically $750k or less, less than a 1/3rd of his current salary. What's more, due to the funky rules of MLS, any team that might want to pay for Guzan also has to first trade for the top allocation spot, currently held by the Chicago Fire, and the fire might not give that spot up cheaply (though I suppose it's possible the Fire could want to hire him, Guzan is originally from Illinois and played in their U-23 squad). Lastly, Guzan returning to MLS would look like a failure, tucking his tail and running back home after Villa gets relegated; it's unlikely anyone in Europe would give him another look unless he played lights-out amazing football. I love MLS, but I don't think going back to MLS is a smart move for Guzan.
The Rest of the World
Travelling to Liga MX is a possibility, Guzan does already have ties to Chivas via his time in their US team after all, and Liga MX does get some attention from Europe in a way that MLS often doesn't. A trip to South America seems unlikely to me, but I could be wrong. Chinese teams have been splashing some cash, buying Guzan might get some American eyeballs on their matches. Overall, outside of Liga MX I think it's unlikely Guzan lands anywhere except MLS or Europe, but it's a wide world and it could happen.
Staying in England
Let's start off by being frank, Brad Guzan has not had a good year, nobody at Aston Villa really has but Guzan's issues have been glaring. From his flubs at the Gold Cup to his flubs at Aston Villa, at times Guzan has looked downright awful. Realistically, no EPL team is likely to pick him up as their starting keeper, unless it's one of the Championship sides about to be promoted (I don't know much about tier 2 English soccer). He could stay in England and keep playing for Aston Villa...but I wouldn't recommend it. Aston Villa is a mess on the backend, even if they can afford and want to pay Guzan's roughly $2.4 million salary (1.7 pounds sterling) it's probably best to jump ship like a rat than sink, I don't think Villa is coming up for a few years at least. So staying in England probably means playing for a Championship side of some sort, personally I don't think that's going to get Guzan the experience to cement him as the USMNT #1 keeper.
The Rest of Europe
There's more to European soccer than just the premier league, and there are a lot more options out there. The Eredivisie has been pretty friendly to American imports, and in a league where you'll see lots of shots on goal a good keeper is a nice thing to have. The Bundesliga is, I think, out, Germany is producing plenty of talented keepers right now so there's not a lot of spots open. Spain, outside of teams from Barcelona or Madrid, is probably an option. Italy has, on occasion, been friendly to US imports as well. Chances are good Guzan could find a starting spot somewhere in a top league in Europe, and I think this would be the best option if he wants to become a true top-quality keeper.
Back to MLS
Guzan only played 3 seasons in MLS for the now defunct Chivas USA, just long enough for him to make an impression and get signed by Aston Villa. Guzan could go back to MLS...but I don't see it as being ideal. For one thing, while I think he'll take a "haircut" on his salary no matter what happens, I can't see an MLS team spending big on Guzan like the Rapids did for Tim Howard; he doesn't have the same sort of draw and legendary status that makes Howard a good business decision as a designated player (even if he isn't a great competitive decision). That means Guzan needs to come in as a player either under the salary maximum ($450k) or at the least somewhere near where it's easy to "buy down" his contract with allocation money so he isn't on the books as a designated player, basically $750k or less, less than a 1/3rd of his current salary. What's more, due to the funky rules of MLS, any team that might want to pay for Guzan also has to first trade for the top allocation spot, currently held by the Chicago Fire, and the fire might not give that spot up cheaply (though I suppose it's possible the Fire could want to hire him, Guzan is originally from Illinois and played in their U-23 squad). Lastly, Guzan returning to MLS would look like a failure, tucking his tail and running back home after Villa gets relegated; it's unlikely anyone in Europe would give him another look unless he played lights-out amazing football. I love MLS, but I don't think going back to MLS is a smart move for Guzan.
The Rest of the World
Travelling to Liga MX is a possibility, Guzan does already have ties to Chivas via his time in their US team after all, and Liga MX does get some attention from Europe in a way that MLS often doesn't. A trip to South America seems unlikely to me, but I could be wrong. Chinese teams have been splashing some cash, buying Guzan might get some American eyeballs on their matches. Overall, outside of Liga MX I think it's unlikely Guzan lands anywhere except MLS or Europe, but it's a wide world and it could happen.
I would have hoped that AV players would try and at least show some heart (Guzan included) to audition for new clubs, jumping ship with the relegation. But it doesn't seem they even care to do that much. I suppose if they really want to just lay down and die, they deserve to go down with the ship.
Also apparently Vardy got lippy with Moss after being sent off and may receive additional punishment on top of the one game suspension for the red card (I hope I hope I hope). http://cartilagefreecaptain.sbnatio...tion-fa?_ga=1.121690059.1993576613.1441377342
Different sources claim different things, but it seems consistent that he made at least SOME aggressive remark at Moss, even if not necessarily "f***ing c***" as the (obviously biased) link above says.
I cannot congratulate Leicester for the title when one of their key producers behaves like this, not even including his past bigoted remarks.
The sport doesn't need another Diego Costa.
Also apparently Vardy got lippy with Moss after being sent off and may receive additional punishment on top of the one game suspension for the red card (I hope I hope I hope). http://cartilagefreecaptain.sbnatio...tion-fa?_ga=1.121690059.1993576613.1441377342
Different sources claim different things, but it seems consistent that he made at least SOME aggressive remark at Moss, even if not necessarily "f***ing c***" as the (obviously biased) link above says.
I cannot congratulate Leicester for the title when one of their key producers behaves like this, not even including his past bigoted remarks.
The sport doesn't need another Diego Costa.
A week of wild weather in MLS brought some wild results. Starting to get a bit heated out here.
Jermaine Jones as a #10?
Jermaine Jones played his first game back after serving a 6 game suspension for an altercation in the playoffs last season, now playing for a new team, the Colorado Rapids. Paublo Mastroeni bizarrely put Jones in the #10 slot in a 4-5-1 with two wingers and two defensive mids. It worked, as it so turned out, with Jermaine Jones getting the game winner in a snow game (Side Note: This shows exactly how stupid the idea that MLS should be on a European schedule is.) not unlike the one that made him a household name in the US. Their opponents, the New York Red Bulls, are bizarrely at the bottom of the eastern conference with a lone win, time to hit the panic button and splash some cash I think. Colorado also beat Sporting KC on Wednesday.
You Can All Relax, Jordan Morris Scored a Goal
A lot of hand-wringing has been done over Jordan Morris, the much-hyped US striker, not scoring goals since moving to the Sounders. (Imagine the problem this would be if he had gone to Germany...) Fortunately for the US and the Sounders, he scored the game winner against Philadelphia and overall looked much, much better than he has so far this season. Critics might point out that he did it against 10 man, but his outside of the right boot shot when being double-teamed is still pretty damn impressive. For the Union, this is their third loss and they've yet to get a draw all year, but with 3 wins they have a nice enough points padding to not care too much.
FC Dallas Make a Statement
FC Dallas got two huge wins this week, first against the Portland Timbers 3-1 midweek in Portland and then in a lightning-threatened Dallas against the always rough and tumble Sporting KC. Dallas now sits atop MLS and having beaten most of the western conference teams in the playoff spots right now, has to feel pretty confident. The only challenger would seem to be Real Salt Lake, who have played two fewer games, but the teams won't meet until late June, by which time the standings will likely have changed.
The Fastest Penalty in MLS
In the very first play of Orlando City vs New England Julio Baptista got into the box within 15 seconds and drew the penalty, which Kaka converted at 1:37 for the fastest penalty goal in MLS history (by time of scoring). Now I bring this up because it's interesting, but also because it highlights what a tough job referees have and why they need to get it right. The announcers disagreed with the call initially (particularly Taylor Twellman) but on further review the New England defenders had their hands and legs all over Baptista and it looks like there is a small trip. Unfortunately for Baldomero Toledo, he ended the game with two horrendous bits of refereeing. The first occurred on the second goal that Orlando scored, in which Cyle Larin used his shoulder and then his forearm to a control a ball, put it at his feet and score. Mere minutes later, New England got a penalty call for a phantom handball in the box off a chested pass, meaning that Toledo and his team screwed up two handball-related calls in a half, infuriating both coaches. It sucks to be a referee, but never forget that Toledo also sucks as a referee.
Jermaine Jones as a #10?
Jermaine Jones played his first game back after serving a 6 game suspension for an altercation in the playoffs last season, now playing for a new team, the Colorado Rapids. Paublo Mastroeni bizarrely put Jones in the #10 slot in a 4-5-1 with two wingers and two defensive mids. It worked, as it so turned out, with Jermaine Jones getting the game winner in a snow game (Side Note: This shows exactly how stupid the idea that MLS should be on a European schedule is.) not unlike the one that made him a household name in the US. Their opponents, the New York Red Bulls, are bizarrely at the bottom of the eastern conference with a lone win, time to hit the panic button and splash some cash I think. Colorado also beat Sporting KC on Wednesday.
You Can All Relax, Jordan Morris Scored a Goal
A lot of hand-wringing has been done over Jordan Morris, the much-hyped US striker, not scoring goals since moving to the Sounders. (Imagine the problem this would be if he had gone to Germany...) Fortunately for the US and the Sounders, he scored the game winner against Philadelphia and overall looked much, much better than he has so far this season. Critics might point out that he did it against 10 man, but his outside of the right boot shot when being double-teamed is still pretty damn impressive. For the Union, this is their third loss and they've yet to get a draw all year, but with 3 wins they have a nice enough points padding to not care too much.
FC Dallas Make a Statement
FC Dallas got two huge wins this week, first against the Portland Timbers 3-1 midweek in Portland and then in a lightning-threatened Dallas against the always rough and tumble Sporting KC. Dallas now sits atop MLS and having beaten most of the western conference teams in the playoff spots right now, has to feel pretty confident. The only challenger would seem to be Real Salt Lake, who have played two fewer games, but the teams won't meet until late June, by which time the standings will likely have changed.
The Fastest Penalty in MLS
In the very first play of Orlando City vs New England Julio Baptista got into the box within 15 seconds and drew the penalty, which Kaka converted at 1:37 for the fastest penalty goal in MLS history (by time of scoring). Now I bring this up because it's interesting, but also because it highlights what a tough job referees have and why they need to get it right. The announcers disagreed with the call initially (particularly Taylor Twellman) but on further review the New England defenders had their hands and legs all over Baptista and it looks like there is a small trip. Unfortunately for Baldomero Toledo, he ended the game with two horrendous bits of refereeing. The first occurred on the second goal that Orlando scored, in which Cyle Larin used his shoulder and then his forearm to a control a ball, put it at his feet and score. Mere minutes later, New England got a penalty call for a phantom handball in the box off a chested pass, meaning that Toledo and his team screwed up two handball-related calls in a half, infuriating both coaches. It sucks to be a referee, but never forget that Toledo also sucks as a referee.
Well, aside from a very bad error from Alli (dribbles past the keeper, literally nothing between him and the goal, and he hits the woodwork and out. Would expect it from Benteke but not Alli) that had both him AND Pochettino face down on the ground in frustration, that was a lot of fun (and of course he scored twice beyond that anyway, alongside two more for Kane as well).
And that's why I'm not conceding the title to Leicester.
Fox hunting season is still on.
And that's why I'm not conceding the title to Leicester.
Fox hunting season is still on.
