Friends paying for beer?!

CornyKegs 728
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IrregularPulse said:
you're not selling commercial and technically you can't charge without a license.
But if it's to the point of them drinking your beer to the point you can't afford to brew for yourself, Put out a mandatory "tip" jar. Or if it's primarily 2-4 friends, then you all 4 can alternate who pays for batches.
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Charge them for hearing your lecture on how to make homebrew. Kind of like buying a map to a party rather than paying for the beer you drink at the party. :fro:
 
cimirie said:
I may be alone here, but if you're gonna share it with them, asking them to pay for it is a bit... tacky. If a buddy of mine pointed to a "tip" jar every time I came over and had a beer, I may actually put in, but I would probably think less of the guy.

I love to share my beer with everybody I meet. If I go through a case in a day with my friends, that's on me. If you don't want them to drink it, don't offer it to them, don't tell them about a new recipe you're psyched about, and don't tell them the progress on your batches.

You don't have to share your homebrew. And if your friends really only come over to drink your brew, then that is a problem. But if you like to make it and you like to share what you've made with others, I think that cost is on you. UNTIL they start making requests. Then you are totally within rights to ask them to poney up. Just my two cents.
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This ^

I put out the tip mug during parties when I know we'll kill nearly 2 batches and I'll have a bunch of people not-so-known to me there, otherwise I feel it's a bit tacky to ask for donations from people I invite over to drink.

As for a situation where you get a regular group that starts to assume that they can come over whenever for free beer, a little chat about the costs involved in that "free" beer is warranted.

In the end, you know what you need to do. But I love reading everybody's limited-view take on it... :tank:
 
I haven't charged a penny yet out of 20 or so batches. But.....the neighborhood is starting to stop by on a regular basis so I think I got everyone hooked!

So, soon enough I can start my plan on using homebrew to make a million dollars and then I can begin my quest to............... take over the World!!!

Mmwahaha, mmmwhahahhahahhahhaaaa!
 
There are no legal loopholes. If you accept money you are selling beer.
If you think I'm wrong, send an email to your state's alcohol control board with your wacky ideas. Then post their response here.

It's a separate question as to whether you would be charged/convicted.
It's a separate question as to whether it's tacky.
 
I recently got my neighbors who are a bunch of younger guys into brewing, well they come over and drink my beer and help clean up. After 4 weeks of brewing every weekend they still love it but at least one of them has passed out before the brew day ends every week! I guess it’s a bad thing having Dogfish Head 120 on tap at 16%+ on brew days! They offered to buy my beer since day one but I really wasn’t interested in selling it. But every week the amount of guys coming over grows and grows. I brew mostly large beers 9% ABV and up so at 10+ gallons per brew the cost is not cheap. So I finally took them up on their offer and told them if they buy a bag of grain every other brew then I will cover the yeast, hops, propane and the brewing equipment and we will split the batch(s) and I will give them a third of each. They also asked how to speed up the process since they haven’t learned to pace themselves yet so I told them I need a plate chiller and pump and I was handed $100 last week and more is being collected. Others that I regularly share my beer with either share their own brew or if they don’t brew they send over some good micros or pay for drinks when we are out and such. I guess I am lucky that so far everyone who has tried my beers have offered some sort of compensation. Gas grass or ass nobody rides for free.
 
I have to agree that the tip jar is a bit... unorthodox. I make homebrew to enjoy and share with my friends. There is an unspoken agreement in our tribe that if you're a beer drinker and you're coming over, and unless otherwise stated that beer will be provided for all, you bring a six/twelve/case to contribute (depending on the size of the crowd). All beer is community property unless specified otherwise -- this way we get to try some new and old favorites of the other drinkers. Again, I may be hanging out with a more considerate crowd than most.

When I started brewing, my original intention was to have a batch or two on hand (paid for out of my own pocket) that I would have as home stock, then split further batches 2 or 3 ways with my more committed friends, dividing the cost of materials evenly and having them contribute labor to help brew/bottle/etc. It has actually evolved into this: I have pretty much paid for and made everything so far. My friends contribute tremendously to my bottle stock -- they are rabid collectors of pop-top beer bottles now, and will tailor their own drinking selections to match my bottle-style needs. They have also contributed a little bit of labor on bottling day (got one buddy who finds it a downright enjoyable zen-like activity). They have enjoyed my beer at the various get-togethers and haven't abused my hospitality.

They are getting the itch to make some for themselves, now. They will buy the ingredients and save up bottles for themselves. Since I own the gear, and have the know-how, they will come to my place and brew under my tutelage, doing the lion's share of the work. Every stage of the process will involve their hands. At the end of it all, they will take home 2+ cases of their own beer, paid for by them, using their own bottles. The agreement is that I don't store anything that they themselves own... the bottles (empty or full), for example.

If this goes well, I can see this eventually leading to them buying a primary and a secondary fermenter of their own so as to not disrupt my capacity to brew, and borrowing what they need to do the rest. If that goes well, I see them buying the rest of the gear, bit by bit, to do it all themselves. This is the best evolution I can envision toward bringing others who aren't as zealous as I am into the homebrewing fold. It builds a greater appreciation for the work and expense that goes into the process, as well as expanding my immediate community of brewers.

Soon, we take over the world! Mwa-ha-ha. *cough*
 
DmentD said:
I have to agree that the tip jar is a bit... unorthodox. I make homebrew to enjoy and share with my friends. There is an unspoken agreement in our tribe that if you're a beer drinker and you're coming over, and unless otherwise stated that beer will be provided for all, you bring a six/twelve/case to contribute (depending on the size of the crowd). All beer is community property unless specified otherwise -- this way we get to try some new and old favorites of the other drinkers. Again, I may be hanging out with a more considerate crowd than most.

When I started brewing, my original intention was to have a batch or two on hand (paid for out of my own pocket) that I would have as home stock, then split further batches 2 or 3 ways with my more committed friends, dividing the cost of materials evenly and having them contribute labor to help brew/bottle/etc. It has actually evolved into this: I have pretty much paid for and made everything so far. My friends contribute tremendously to my bottle stock -- they are rabid collectors of pop-top beer bottles now, and will tailor their own drinking selections to match my bottle-style needs. They have also contributed a little bit of labor on bottling day (got one buddy who finds it a downright enjoyable zen-like activity). They have enjoyed my beer at the various get-togethers and haven't abused my hospitality.

They are getting the itch to make some for themselves, now. They will buy the ingredients and save up bottles for themselves. Since I own the gear, and have the know-how, they will come to my place and brew under my tutelage, doing the lion's share of the work. Every stage of the process will involve their hands. At the end of it all, they will take home 2+ cases of their own beer, paid for by them, using their own bottles. The agreement is that I don't store anything that they themselves own... the bottles (empty or full), for example.

If this goes well, I can see this eventually leading to them buying a primary and a secondary fermenter of their own so as to not disrupt my capacity to brew, and borrowing what they need to do the rest. If that goes well, I see them buying the rest of the gear, bit by bit, to do it all themselves. This is the best evolution I can envision toward bringing others who aren't as zealous as I am into the homebrewing fold. It builds a greater appreciation for the work and expense that goes into the process, as well as expanding my immediate community of brewers.

Soon, we take over the world! Mwa-ha-ha. *cough*
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i really wish i had known a brewer like you when i started out. Borrowing equiptment before i had to shell out the cash for my own would have been great.

As it is, none of my (current) friends are mooches. My good buddy has even helped brew a few batches, and covered the cost of ingredients too. When i did have the guzzlers over to my house, the byob was an unspoken rule. I love to share my homebrew, but in limited quantity.
 
cimirie said:
I may be alone here, but if you're gonna share it with them, asking them to pay for it is a bit... tacky. If a buddy of mine pointed to a "tip" jar every time I came over and had a beer, I may actually put in, but I would probably think less of the guy.

I love to share my beer with everybody I meet. If I go through a case in a day with my friends, that's on me. If you don't want them to drink it, don't offer it to them, don't tell them about a new recipe you're psyched about, and don't tell them the progress on your batches.

You don't have to share your homebrew. And if your friends really only come over to drink your brew, then that is a problem. But if you like to make it and you like to share what you've made with others, I think that cost is on you. UNTIL they start making requests. Then you are totally within rights to ask them to poney up. Just my two cents.
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I tend to agree with you on this. I'm not going to charge my friends that come over and have a few beers. By the sounds of it, the friends aren't just stopping by whenever they please to drink. I just can't see inviting someone over and charging them to drink my beer. I'm sure that over time the cost to homebrew will even out with something that they paying for when they host parties. If you want to save money, don't have them over as often. That's just my $.02.
 
Wacky, no.
Wacky would be buying claiming that the grain was for dog bicuits and the beer provided was free.

But there is a clear relationship between purchased ingredients and beer sales. I mention this because that is specifically how excise taxes are audited.

Obviously, it's not worth anyone's time on a small scale, but you can see where it would land you in trouble if say things got a little more enterprising even if the pints of beer were free. If a PR firm provided ingredients to you for weekly beer parties, etc.
 
I agree taking money for beer is illegal. However, I really think honestly it's not different then making something say a pie and selling it at a bake sale........

Problem isn't with the act, it's the law that is wrong. But it's the law. So I'm in bama where it's still illegal to brew it so what's another law or two.......

Rock on & Brew on, as long as your friends and you are cool with what you decide to that is all that matters...........
 
Couldn't you avoid the legal issues by calling it a "tip jar" and making tips "optional".

And by optional, I mean that you are widely recognized as a freeloading prick for drinking like a fish and not contributing to the time and monetary costs. People generally respond well to shame. Perhaps not while they are drunk, but certainly the day after. Ask anyone who's woken up with a throbbing headache and some hazy regrets.
 
I've gotten a buddy into brewing... he's done 4 batches on my equipment he's hooked now and is getting all his own stuff. all it took was 1 of my milk stouts and he was in! He pays for his own ingredients, cleans the equipment and bottles his own. only takes up one of my three buckets. about once every other month

invite them over for a brew day have them pony up for ingredients (or help them make a recipe and have them order everything they need) and say "this one is yours" all 5 gallons" make them bottle and clean all equipment... show your pain. drink your "share" for equipment rental and it comes out right (I usually drink several of his beers as they age and get a full 6-pack for equipment "rental" which works out fair. If some don't help brew have some domestic swill on hand... LOL bud light wheat while others are drinking a great home brewed hefe!

"teach your children well" as the old song goes...
 
My friends always want to pay me and I just say "your money isn't good here". Really I wish they would drink more so I had more reason to brew more. It's fun being the beer guy in the bunch.
 
I hear ya bear! but this guy is getting "walked on". I brew enough that I can bring out a bunch of homebrews and i don't care. I'm going camping in july and I'll have a mixed case of home brews that I plan on doing a tasting with. all on me.

I've had plenty of times I've been offered money but I'm just happy to have good beer newbs taste what good ales really are. But if they are abusing that privilage... make them work for it!
 
skidaddytn said:
I'm saying +1 to making friends bring over some food... buy me some burgers to go with that beer!
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hey that works too! my campsite share has been covered by my buds that know I'm bringing a whole mixed case of MY homebrew! They can't wait to try my Imperial smoked porter!

I'm also doing a little "dogs and brews" tasting in a few weeks I'm buying the dogs and bringing out a dozen or so home brews... everyone else is bringing sides and session beers... Mine are pretty big beers so it all comes out in the end... they are just looking to have about 2 each of mine and fill in the gaps with what commercials they bring... should be a nice night
 
I started brewing smaller batches, 3 gal and 1 gal. Then I say, "Sorry, it's a small batch, I can't share as much."
 
wow, brewers most relate to this topic!

Great discussion. I wanna enjoy brewing and drinking, so ill just do that, no stress, if anyone abuses i can always not invite that person in the future.
 
Sounds like a lot of problems are in the sharing of the hard "earned" bottles. When I used to bottle, I'd always think of all the work that went into producing that one bottle and my heart would sink a little when I heard one open. Now there's something nice about sharing beer on tap. Unless your "friends" bring over growlers, there's not a to-go option.

I actually like to share my brews. It allows me to go through more beer quicker than I can drink it (and stay out of Betty Ford anyway) and allows me to brew more often to perfect the craft.

Rather than charging for the beer, pull a frat party move and charge for the cup. Or start your own mug club in your garage.
 
I like to keep some strong barley wine around to slow any heavy drinkers down. I usually have the few friend that I brew for buy all the ingredients and a little extra for the time.
 
drat said:
It's only illegal if you get caught. But if you do get caught...ouch!
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That's what the inmates would always say, back when I worked in a prison. And I would always respond with "How's that working out for you?" :D
 
I'm really surprised at how many people give away their homebrew "to-go". Even when I bottled, that was very rarely an option. I only give it away to other beer people who I trade with. I don't look at my homebrew as as beer so-to-speak, not even as a little better-than-normal beer. I look at it as an experience. If you want my beer, you get it when I invite you over. I also have never been into the open-door policy as far as my house goes, never been my thing. Everyone knows this and so no one ever just shows up. People come to my house when me or my wife invite them. So therefore, if you are over, you are offered a few beers. Even on brew days when a few friends come to hang out and help, no one really goes overboard. My cousin, who is a heavy drinker, is too used to BMC products to drink a lot of mine. He loves all of it, but thinks its "heavy". And guess what? He'll always think it is heavy because I won't teach him otherwise! Works in my favor.

I always laugh when people talk about "converting" other people. Why would you do that? All that means is more people who want your homebrew and more competition for the craft beers in the beer store. I would say I could careless what other people drink, but I'd be lying, because I'd actually prefer them to drink BMC ;)
 
wow dude you have to compete for beer at the beer store? that must be tough, what's the competition of choice? thumb wrestling? scrabble? the octagon out back:D i with you though, i am not trying to convert anyone...if they show some interest so be it, i've never given any togo packs before, but i will, if i don't get the bottles back plus some they won't be getting anymore...my bottles represent the hardest part of brewing for me.
 
Airborneguy said:
I always laugh when people talk about "converting" other people. Why would you do that? All that means is more people who want your homebrew and more competition for the craft beers in the beer store. I would say I could careless what other people drink, but I'd be lying, because I'd actually prefer them to drink BMC ;)
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Sociologists have noted that women generally bond by intimacy/trust, but men bond by doing things together (just generalizing here). If you can get someone you like to do your hobby with you, then it turns into a social gathering and theoretically it should become more enjoyable than doing it alone. Humans do need some level of social interaction, and with as much time as we spend brewing it's nice to multi-task and relate to our fellows at the same time.

I guess you female-types can share secret recipes -- I dunno what you ladies get up to when you're alone. :D

Another benefit of converting others to the hobby is that you can have the experience of brewing more often without bearing the cost, and also the burden of finding a good home for all the brew you've been making. :cross:

Also, when its time to buy a filter for SWMBO's wine (ok, I admit I like it too), having more brewers to potentially share the *use* of a piece of equipment means more brewers to share the *cost* of that equipment, and how is that not awesome, I ask you? ;)
 
olllllo said:
Wacky, no.
Wacky would be buying claiming that the grain was for dog bicuits and the beer provided was free.

But there is a clear relationship between purchased ingredients and beer sales. I mention this because that is specifically how excise taxes are audited.

Obviously, it's not worth anyone's time on a small scale, but you can see where it would land you in trouble if say things got a little more enterprising even if the pints of beer were free. If a PR firm provided ingredients to you for weekly beer parties, etc.
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Yea, sounds to me like a bunch of college age ppl in the OP. Where i see someone caring is when one of the hardcore guys goes a little nutty and gets the attn of the local PD..... noise,vandalism etc.... those type of ppl always seem to be the first to point a finger if it can get them out of trouble.

Conversation goes like this.... (cop to drunk) where u been tonight? Drunk to cop, At an awesome party drinking hombrew, its really cheap....

irritated cop...(he's been getting late night calls in this neighborhood for years) O really, how cheap?
 
Airborneguy said:
I always laugh when people talk about "converting" other people. Why would you do that? All that means is more people who want your homebrew and more competition for the craft beers in the beer store. I would say I could careless what other people drink, but I'd be lying, because I'd actually prefer them to drink BMC ;)
Click to expand...

Seems to me, the more people that buy commercial craft beer would increase the need for the brewer to produce more, resulting in a brewer with a more stable economic base, which increases the likelihood that the brewer will stay in business longer producing your favorite craft beer. Also, the increased demand, and resulting increased revenue would mean greater distribution capacity -- more available in the local market, and an expanded geographic range of availability. Think of all those hot-to-trot brews that are only available on, say, the West Coast, that folks are going ga-ga for and having friends and family ship them to Timbuktu and beyond, suddenly available in your home town.

Also, think about the competing breweries working that much harder to keep a presence in the market by creating higher quality, and more interesting brews, constantly one-upping one another. Free trade and a strong market can be a good thing. A larger commercial craft brewing community also means more voices to be heard by the gov't (not that they listen all that much, anyway), and that means a stronger lobby for the brewers, and that means a louder voice for homebrewers too.

'Course, I could be full of carp, too. *grins*
 
DmentD said:
Seems to me, the more people that buy commercial craft beer would increase the need for the brewer to produce more, resulting in a brewer with a more stable economic base, which increases the likelihood that the brewer will stay in business longer producing your favorite craft beer. Also, the increased demand, and resulting increased revenue would mean greater distribution capacity -- more available in the local market, and an expanded geographic range of availability. Think of all those hot-to-trot brews that are only available on, say, the West Coast, that folks are going ga-ga for and having friends and family ship them to Timbuktu and beyond, suddenly available in your home town.

Also, think about the competing breweries working that much harder to keep a presence in the market by creating higher quality, and more interesting brews, constantly one-upping one another. Free trade and a strong market can be a good thing. A larger commercial craft brewing community also means more voices to be heard by the gov't (not that they listen all that much, anyway), and that means a stronger lobby for the brewers, and that means a louder voice for homebrewers too.

'Course, I could be full of carp, too. *grins*
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Don't forget that it also means a higher turnover of the beers (or the ingredients at your LHBS) which seems like a good thing rather than stale items collecting dust waiting for only you. :)
 
+1 on DementD. basic economic theory: more demand means more supply, and, often as a way of ensuring company survival, higher variation in product. I want more people drinking craft brew in my area, maybe the LCBO will start opening their eyes to the fact that people want interesting beer made in THEIR country, and even moreso their province. I hate the LCBO...

As to the topic of the thread (ie: money for homebrew), in Ontario there are places that allow you to go in and "make" beer or wine. All you really do is throw in the yeast and they do everything else. They get around the laws against selling booze without a liscence with the idea that they aren't even making the booze, more providing ingredients and facilities for fermentation and bottling. It's essentially like selling wort, space and yeast, no beer. If you did it like that, you could probably get off on the same sort of technicality, get your friends to pitch and bottle/keg, and afaik you'd be golden.
 
I guess I can't imagine charging but then again I don't really have any moochers that hang around. They never pitch in with beer money but most everyone I know will pitch in with something they can contribute to the friendship. Car work, tool loans, computer help, sports tickets, whatever. Anyone who came over to drink and never added anything back to the friendship wouldn't last long. A number of my friends either brew or are beer geeks so they bring their own beer to the equation too (either homebrew or good commercial.)

At the point I feel the need to charge my friends I'll probably just quit brewing or at least quit sharing.
 
I only invite my best beer buds to drink at the house... If they share buying rounds at the pub, I'm sure they'll kick in a donation at the house in appreciation for the quality libations. Otherwise meet em at the steakhouse and convenently leave the wallet at home!
 
Maybe I'm just used to partying with folks who have a particular demeanor towards the subject, but I'm surprised every single time I gently and subtly ask for donations. Normally, I just put out a large glass mug in a prominent location of the house (kitchen, usually, since everyone tends to congregate there) with a single dollar bill tossed into it. By the end of the day, the hint has lead to enough donations to cover, on average, 75%-120% of my personal expenditures for the party, food and brews.

That might be something to consider if you don't want to be direct. :)
 

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