Lemon Verbena in beer..thanks for disproving this idea Stone

16th anniversary IPA is terrible and the more you drink the worse it gets.

Making 5 gallons of bad beer feels bad enough, I wonder how they cope with making hundreds of barrels...

Now that I'm thinking about it, probably by laughing all the way to the bank.

So what makes it terrible?

I have to agree. I usually love all that Stone has to offer and we frequent the brewery often, but the 16th anniversary was bad. I couldn't even finish my bomber. It has this soapy, herby flavor that is really not good, especially in the IPA base.

planetscott said:

So what makes it terrible?

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The first taste you can pick out some nice hop flavor but then it has this medicinal cough drop flavor that builds the more you drink it. By the end its all you can taste.

It was better on tap than when I had it via bomber, but still a miss. Especially after having Ruination 10th Anniversary come out only a few months beforehand...drool.

Funky Gold Verbena from Jackie O's
Ron Jeffries' Blonde recipe in BLAM

Just because one of the most overated craft breweries made a bad beer with it, don't be a verbena-hater!

*steers away from the "overrated" comment*

Ultimately I was left with the taste of lemon pledge from 16th... wasn't my favorite.

Agreed. Was VERY let down by this beer.

Can't believe they didn't do something awesome; like double the dry hop on the reg recipe. That would have been oh-so-delicious!

TNGabe said:

Funky Gold Verbena from Jackie O's
Ron Jeffries' Blonde recipe in BLAM

Just because one of the most overated craft breweries made a bad beer with it, don't be a verbena-hater!

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Out of curiosity what are "appropriately rated" breweries?

I was yelled at on another thread for thinking this beer was terrible. I agree with all you. The taste was like some kind of chemical flavoring. Did they try any test batches before distributing this crap nationally? I think I paid 12 bucks for a bomber! Probably one of the worst commercial craft beers I have ever had. This is right up there with shandys. I wonder how the pretentious d bag running stone defends this?

No offense, Gabe, but TN isn't really the best place to get your hands on fresh Stone beers... Not saying that they are the best brewery out there, but they are surely on the forefront of bringing damn good west-coast style beers to the market. Aggressive, yes - but most of these super hopped beers really need to be consumed fresh, and some of their other beers can't be found outside of SoCal.

It's not the style for everyone, but if you're a hop-head, or into unique brews there is really no place like the Stone Brewery. Definitely not over-rated IMO!

To each their own though - sometimes every brewery just doesn't quite hit the mark... this one is a good example for me...

OCBrewin said:

No offense, Gabe, but TN is really the best place to get your hands on fresh Stone beers... Not saying that they are the best brewery out there, but they are surely on the forefront of bringing damn good west-coast style beers to the market. Aggressive, yes - but most of these super hopped beers really need to be consumed fresh, and some of their other beers can't be found outside of SoCal.

It's not the style for everyone, but if you're a hop-head, or into unique brews there is really no place like the Stone Brewery. Definitely not over-rated IMO!

To each their own though - sometimes every brewery just doesn't quite hit the mark... this one is a good example for me...

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Well I dunno about stone being overrated but I think saying are on the forefront of west coast beers are a bit much.

Alpine, Alesmith, Port, and Ballast point say that Stone isn't even in the top 3 breweries in San Diego county. I might even include Green Flash in that group, but since I dont personally care for Summit hops its hard for me to do it.

Xpertskir said:

Well I dunno about stone being overrated but I think saying are on the forefront of west coast beers are a bit much.

Alpine, Alesmith, Port, and Ballast point say that Stone isn't even in the top 3 breweries in San Diego county. I might even include Green Flash in that group, but since I dont personally care for Summit hops its hard for me to do it.

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Agreed completely that those are all fantastic breweries (lets not forget, Mission, Lost Abby, and my new personal favorite - Societe). But we have to temper their great beers and the general fantastic SD beer community with the fact that Stone really helped bring the recognition to the area and are still serving up good unique beers. I also see what you're saying about Green Flash - I really want to love their beers, but they just don't quite do it for me... 'Le Freak' comes closest though...

I haven't tasted this beer, but I did make a white ipa with lemon verbena and it was quite pleasant mixed with citrus hops( cascade, centennial and citra)

OCBrewin said:

No offense, Gabe, but TN is really the best place to get your hands on fresh Stone beers...

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None taken. TN isn't a great place to get your hands on any beers. It's probably been close to 10 years since I drank a Stone beer. How can you be on the forefornt of west coast IPAs? That's so 2002.

Forgive me father, for I have trolled.

Haha, I like the response! I just re-read what I wrote and I hope that I didn't come off as pretentious or anything. Not meaning to say they ARE on the forefront, just that they perhaps WERE and definitely were putting out beers that pushed the limits and introduced a lot of people to what IPA's could be. I guess some limits are there for a reason, since this 16th anniversary was just undrinkable in my opinion. Now go back to the 11th anniversary brew, the one that turned into Sublimely Self Righteous, now that is a GREAT BEER - probably one of my favorites.

Either way, I am 100% convinced that the best IPA's are coming out of my garage brewery thanks to the community and knowledge base here on HBT.com!!! haha

No worries, OCB. You can't not come off as pretentious, you mention living in Orange County in you name

But seriously, it's an internet forum. I have no life and I don't get upset, hard to imagine the folks who do!

Great - glad to hear that not everyone takes the interweb so seriously.

Just remember that there is a lot more to a place than what comes through some d-bag's persona on TV. There are far more cities in OC than just those were the housewifes and Kobe live... (plus, I was transplanted here for work when I finished school - born and raised in San Diego, probably 5 miles from the brewery in the subject of this post now resides...)

Happy brewing

I think they just muddled the flavor a little too much with too many ingredients. It's not terrible- it's just "eh"- simple is often best.

Too many different types of hops, rye, specialty malts, lemon verbena, and lemon oil. There are too many flavors and aromas competing for recognition that they turn into a muddy mess.

Maybe my palate is off, but I had one of these and quite enjoyed it. Not one of my top favorites, but a far cry from the worst craft beer I have ever had (victory's headwater ipa takes that medal)... I found the verbena to integrate nicely. The only note I have is that I found it a bit over-carbed.

All tasting has a time, place, and mood, so perhaps I was just in a good place when I tried it.

I had it on draft here in Chi-town and I felt that it was quite enjoyable. I am way beyond the normal hophead and often just eat cones off my brother's vines. I can see how some got a chemical cough-drop medicinal flavor, but my palate interpreted that same flavor as anasthetic in quality and felt that my tongue was being lulled to sleep by the complexity of flavor. I do however agree that they overdid it with the numerous different types of hops. It's really hard to pick out any specific flavor of hop or discern any of the individual varieties present in this brew. I would say I give it a B-, but seeing as it's still on tap just around the corner from my apt, I feel I'll give it another shot at only $7 a tulip.

I drank 3 of the bombers and each time I hoped I had been wrong on the previous ones, but every time I hated it. I think I still have one bottle left, but I'm not looking forward to it. This is only the second Stone release that I've really disliked (the first being Bottleworks 13th, which was a muddled mess), so I'll forgive them (I'll forgive them even more if they bring back Ruination 10th as a seasonal release).

This is a bit out of left field because it has nothing to do with Lemon Verbena, but if you like lemon in an IPA you should try out Hellhound On My Ale. It uses dried lemon and is mighty tasty.

By the way, what's up with Lemon Verbena? Is this the "new thing" or something? I've never even heard of it. Is it similar in flavor to lemongrass?

Lemon verbena is wonderful.... I grow it in the garden every year since it is a pretty plant and helps keep pests away. It makes a great ingredient for baking. Also makes some lovely cocktails (I make a "lemon julep" with lemon verbena rather than mint... great in a tom collins, too).

As for flavor, it is less spicy lemon than lemongrass and more herbal lemon. The primary flavor is lemon with nice herbal notes. I really enjoyed it in this beer. I thought the lemon was nicely integrated and the herbal flavors complemented the hops nicely. I guess this one is a love-it-or-hate-it kind of thing.

So I read a bunch of bad reviews of the 16th IPA and opened it expecting to dislike it. I didn't, though. I thought it was a little muddled, as others have mentioned, but not offensive. To each his own, I guess.

That said for some reason last summer beers w/ chamomile were popping up all over the place, and it's safe to say that I haven't had a beer with chamomile that I enjoyed.