Hello all I am trying to embark on a new adventure in sour brewing. I have had a roselare pack and old ale pack sitting in my fridge for a while but was scared of infecting my equipment and also did not know if I really even liked sour beer. Hate to admit to date I have only tried Oro de calabasa and Orval (if that counts) but I did love the jolly pumpkin beer am going to make a point to try more. Sorry to ramble anyway I was wondering those of you that pitch bottle dregs say from jolly pumpkin, do you only need to pitch one bottle worth of dregs or several? And does jolly pumpkin ferment most of the beer with regular yeast then use the bugs to finish out? I saw Jamil's flanders red and that was the method he outlined is this the best way to do it or is it better to ferment completely with the bugs? Also say I keep trying my beer and am happy with the sourness of it how do I stop it from souring any further? Thanks for any help I plan to get one of these sour beers started soon as they seem to take a really long time.
Newbie to sour beers need some help
- Thread starter jtejedor
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For one, Jamil doesn't claim his method is "the best," he just mentions that he doesn't like his sours as sour as some of us. In order to dial back the sourness, he ferments with WY1056 initially, then has the bugs sour it up - instead of having the bug sour from the onset.
I've had much better luck pitching dregs/bugs in primary along with the primary yeast. I made Jamil's Flanders Red and was really disappointed by the slight tartness.
Jolly Pumpkin dregs are great, they bottle their beer pretty young so the microbes are healthier than those in many other sours. A couple bottles worth is good insurance, but you could get away with one especially if you are pitching the Roeselare. I would also pitch some ale yeast just to make sure you have a healthy primary fermentaiton (I've had bad luck just using blends for primary since they don't have as much brewers yeast as a regular pack).
I believe JP pitches their primary strain and then do something like run their ventilation system in reverse to run outside air over the wort, then the beers go into barrels that previously held beer to get more microbes (Jamil did a couple great interviews with the brewer for Can You Brew It).
Jolly Pumpkin dregs are great, they bottle their beer pretty young so the microbes are healthier than those in many other sours. A couple bottles worth is good insurance, but you could get away with one especially if you are pitching the Roeselare. I would also pitch some ale yeast just to make sure you have a healthy primary fermentaiton (I've had bad luck just using blends for primary since they don't have as much brewers yeast as a regular pack).
I believe JP pitches their primary strain and then do something like run their ventilation system in reverse to run outside air over the wort, then the beers go into barrels that previously held beer to get more microbes (Jamil did a couple great interviews with the brewer for Can You Brew It).
I think i read around here that once you refrig the beer, it puts the bugs to sleep, thus curtailing further souring. Can anyone comment on that - i could be way off?
Slows them down, doesn't stop them. The only way to kill them are heat, chemicals, or filtration. The easiest way to adjust the acidity is to do some blending at serving time.
Along your lines of using bottle dregs. I have had some good success and especially with Jolly Pumpkin dregs.
I pitched one bottle into one gal of medium gravity wort. It was fermeting quickly with their sacc strain they use (WLP530) and had a nice pellicle after a couple months. I recently tasted this batch and it was over the top sour. Which I am a fan of but will probably blend to make it a more drinkable beer.
More info with pictures here:
http://jeffreycrane.blogspot.com/2010/08/dreg-series-black-jolly-sour.html
So I don't really know how many bottles you need for 5 gallons but Old Sock's advice is good that you would be safe with a couple. Especially if you are planning to pitch the Roeselare pack.
I also suggest pitching more sacc yeast than is in the Roeselare blend because my Oud Bruin took way too long to show activity with only the Roeselare. And a beer that is goign to age this long is not worth risking the chance that other worse tasting bugs take over.
For stopping the bugs here is a good threaad. Actually Old Sock (Mike T) comments about his results.
http://www.babblebelt.com/newboard/thread.html?tid=1108752780&th=1223631341&pg=15&tpg=1&add=1
I pitched one bottle into one gal of medium gravity wort. It was fermeting quickly with their sacc strain they use (WLP530) and had a nice pellicle after a couple months. I recently tasted this batch and it was over the top sour. Which I am a fan of but will probably blend to make it a more drinkable beer.
More info with pictures here:
http://jeffreycrane.blogspot.com/2010/08/dreg-series-black-jolly-sour.html
So I don't really know how many bottles you need for 5 gallons but Old Sock's advice is good that you would be safe with a couple. Especially if you are planning to pitch the Roeselare pack.
I also suggest pitching more sacc yeast than is in the Roeselare blend because my Oud Bruin took way too long to show activity with only the Roeselare. And a beer that is goign to age this long is not worth risking the chance that other worse tasting bugs take over.
For stopping the bugs here is a good threaad. Actually Old Sock (Mike T) comments about his results.
http://www.babblebelt.com/newboard/thread.html?tid=1108752780&th=1223631341&pg=15&tpg=1&add=1
That beer is still stable, so no issues with long term storage.
