Man, I love Apfelwein

My first batch was lavin 71b-1122 and was pretty week. I added 2 teaspoons of citric acid and waited a month and it was great. My second batch is eds exactly and it is GREAT after 4 weeks.

In the first batch I think I could taste the sanitizer until I bottled it. I used sodium metabisulfite.

Thank you,

Wow! Over 600 pages! this stuff has gotta be great. I had a couple questions, can I brew this in a plastic bucket? Has anyone kegged it and carbed it like beer? Or is it better just to keg it and use the CO2 to purge any air to store it then just use CO2 to dispense?

I just kegged and carbed and I think it is better carbed, way better!

akthor said:

Wow! Over 600 pages! this stuff has gotta be great. I had a couple questions, can I brew this in a plastic bucket? Has anyone kegged it and carbed it like beer? Or is it better just to keg it and use the CO2 to purge any air to store it then just use CO2 to dispense?

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Yes,, I use bottling buckets mostly, I just get annoyed cleaning carboys so I just ferment in bottling buckets, then rack by simply hooking up a tube and opening the tap, except for the most trubified of beers this works fine.

I haven't actually carbed it like beer yet, I did try it on some wine I made but the wine was nearly 16% abv and the yeast (ec1118) just didn't have any oomph left and I didn't get so much as a "pfft" even after months in the bottle.

I put my apfelwein in a Tap a Draft and carb it up that way, it's simply wonderful too

That reminds me, I'm OUT OF APFELWEIN guess I'm gonna hit the dollar store today for some juice and sugar!

Grimster said:

That reminds me, I'm OUT OF APFELWEIN guess I'm gonna hit the dollar store today for some juice and sugar!

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So quality of the juice doesn't matter? Apple Juice is apple juice?

akthor said:

So quality of the juice doesn't matter? Apple Juice is apple juice?

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I've tried using Mott's and Walmart brand. To me there was no difference between the two. I don't know about the Tree Top though.

akthor said:

So quality of the juice doesn't matter? Apple Juice is apple juice?

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I buy whatever is on sale that's 100% juice and no artificial flavors. I imagine if you had real apples of different types you could juice yourself I'm sure you could turn out much more exquisite wine but meh, this works and it literally costs less than $30 for a 5 gallon batch of wine and takes roughly 5 minutes to get started, then however long it takes to bottle it, very little muss nor fuss, just the way I like it.

Bembel:
Blowing the foam into the carboy with the yeast cake was a counter-productive move. As long as you do not introduce any microbes into the carboy during the bottling process you should be fine with just pouring the new pasteurized AJ onto the old cake.
You may've killed off a significant number of the viable yeast cells in the cake...perhaps even all.

Until you understand the brewing/fermentation process you shouldn't do anything that hasn't been specifically described as part of the process. I mean this as a friend and fellow Frankfurter.

If the fermentation doesn't start within 2-3 days then pitch a fresh pack of yeast and you should be OK. You might consider adding a bit of YAN to the mix as well. Be careful when doing that as YAN causes a short but CRAZY reaction when added to an already fermenting solution: it will foam up dramatically and overflow your container. Just add it in very small amounts and let the solution settle. By small amounts I mean by the 'messerspitz' i.e. maybe 1/10th of a teaspoon at a time. The whole amount one adds to a 5g carboy is only 1 or 2 teaspoons total.

Priming takes a long time with Stoeffche. I usually wait three weeks. I have 6.5g carboys and I use typically 1 cup dextrose to prime that batch.
I am experimenting with using concentrated AJ in lieu of the dextrose. I added 1 can to my latest batch just before bottling. The sugar content was a bit less than a cup so it should be safe vis-a-vis bottle bombs and I am curious as to how it will effect the apple character of the product.

Wasn't it great to taste Frankfurt again?
Tschuess
bp

Mikeshep:

Make sure you do not start fermentation in a closed container with a tightfitting lid UNLESS you have an airlock...you'll just be making a big bottle-bomb and could endanger yourself and others.

The campden tablet process suggested by others is a good way to go in order to have virtually fool-proof aepfelwein. However, I recommend that you reserve a portion of the juice and leave it unsterilized. One of the things that makes great European wines great is that they use the natural yeasts already present on their grapes. Natural yeasts can create crapola - or they may create something exceptional. That applies to apples as well as grapes.

If you choose to do as I suggest, then all I would add is some yeast nutrients, available at your local homebrew store. That's it. No sugar, or at best maybe a a cup or so to 5 gallons. Natural yeasts may not be as robust as those breed and cultured in a lab... so adding nutrients helps keep them healthy so that they do not create off-flavors from struggling too hard to survive. Natural yeasts also do not have the ability to deal with high alcohol levels so adding the amount of sugar in Ed's recipe would have a negative effect on the product if you are hoping to truly replicate the German dry style of hard cider. What happens is the the yeast goes crazy eating up all that sugar and converting it to alcohol and eventually the alcohol level becomes too high for the yeast to live in and they die before they are able to eat ALL the sugar. Commercial yeasts like EC-1118 have a very high tolerance of alcohol (up to about 18% abv), but natural yeasts may only tolerate half that, or less.

Finally, don't be disturbed if the natural yeast fermentation produces some off-odors, in particular H2S (rotten egg smell). It is a sign that the yeast needed more nutrients to thrive...so add more next time. This usually blows off after a couple days and doesn't impact the flavor (unless the natural yeast is just plain awful or the environment for them was too out of whack). There are effective ways to remove the smell, should it persist, during the the bottling process which I can explain in another post if needed.

Good luck!
bp:rockin:

Made batch in Aug 2009 and it sat there in a carboy for over a year !
Whenever we had empty bottles there was always something else that seem to get priority and got bottled ahead of the apple. Well this weekend there was 50 emptly bottles so i finally bottled 24 Apfelwein tasted REALLY good, but then its already bulk aged for a year so it appears that the lack or priority to bottle it was a blessing........
time to start another batch or two !!

Is there anyway to get rid of the yeast residue from the priming / carbonation process, (other than champagne style aka , freezing the bottle necks and popping out icy lees)?

I want a clear product when finished, not a Heffe-wine?

Or is it easier to just use C02 and a keg?

Id LIKE to be able to carbonate bottles but have them lees free in the final stage ( as gifts, cant give everyone a 5 gallon keg)


Thoughts?

Thanks

We are approaching fall here in the northeast which means the apple orchards all around me will start making cider.

Has anyone made this with fresh apple cider? Would this be good or bad?

Just tried a bottle of some I brewed in june, it was my first batch. I didnt really care for it, it was pretty dry. Taste was ok, but a little harsh, maybe with some time.

I kegged up 5 gallons last night. I sweetened it with two cans of apple juice concentrate, some preservative, and force carbed it. I drank the two glasses that wouldn't fit in the keg. I liked it.

So is this pretty good after 2 months? I know it is better with time but 6 or 8 months? I can put some away for that long but I really want some sooner for football season.

bembel said:

Is there anyway to get rid of the yeast residue from the priming / carbonation process, (other than champagne style aka , freezing the bottle necks and popping out icy lees)?

I want a clear product when finished, not a Heffe-wine?

Or is it easier to just use C02 and a keg?

Id LIKE to be able to carbonate bottles but have them lees free in the final stage ( as gifts, cant give everyone a 5 gallon keg)


Thoughts?

Thanks

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Mine pours very clear until the bottom of the bottle. If you leave a little in the bottle along with the dregs/lees you can pretty easily get a very clear beverage. That's the problem giving any kind of homebrew as gifts if people don't realize that they have to decant. On the other hand, many of my friends just swig the homebrew from the bottle and don't seem bothered by the yeast.

the local homebrew shop is having a weekend event where they are pressing apples. 6 gallons for 36$, think I might try it out.

milldoggy said:

the local homebrew shop is having a weekend event where they are pressing apples. 6 gallons for 36$, think I might try it out.

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You should. That is a good price for fresh apple cider. That's cheaper than I can find apple juice for in the store.

steinsato said:

You should. That is a good price for fresh apple cider. That's cheaper than I can find apple juice for in the store.

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I realized I'm OUT OF APFELWEIN last night (oh the horrors) so I made 6 gallons. Star Market had their store brand 100% apple juice for $1.78 per half gallon.

So 12x1.78x1.085 = $23.175
added 5 pounds of white sugar and 4 pounds of dark brown sugar, OG=1.110 should be one ass kicker of a batch of apple wine.

FYI

Trader Joes sells Organic, unfiltered cider year round for about $6 a gallon, if you cant get the local stuff!

the apples are JUST starting to fall here in New England, cant wait to try local as well

36 dollars for 6 gallons is a rip off. Check local orchards. I have seen orchards advertising 50 gallons for 90 dollars 30 gallons for 60 and offers to fill carboys and demijohns price unspecified. but at 2 dollars per gallon at the 30 mark I cant see it going anywhere above 3 dollars per gallon, if you are getting at least 5

Just an FYI regarding juice prices: Anyone with a Stop & Shop nearby might want to check out their store brand apple juice. The one near me (central NJ) is selling it for $3.79/gallon, regular price. That's the cheapest I've seen around here anyway. Surprisingly, for a cheap store brand it has no preservatives except the acceptable ascorbic acid.

EDIT: 100th post...I feel so...grown up...

Hell, I pay $5 a gallon for the Treetop Juice and that's when it's on sale. I'm going to have to make a trip up north to the orchards and see what they sell their juice for. I have an apple tree that is loaded right now but do not have a press of anysort. Anyone know of a makeshift way to press apples that isn't a complete pain in the a$$?

You might want to add some pectinase to the fermentation when using fresh unfiltered juice to help clear it up. The orchards around here usually cold pasteurize their pressed juice so you don't have to mess with campden tablets or anything if used quickly. If it sits too long, though, it usually spontaneously ferments maybe due to airborne yeast/bacteria and usually gets pretty nasty.

That said, many references extol the virtues of ciders made with wild yeasts..but it can be hit or miss, I guess while a nice packet of healthy Montrachet or EC-1118 takes the guesswork out.

Well, on a MOST HAPPY NOTE

The Trader Joes Cranberry-Raspberry test gallon is simply incredible, HIGHLY RECOMMEND, the raspberry is so subtle and the color is like a fine Rose from Provence ( the taste not to dissimilar either)

FYI Ingredients wise its apple, grape, cran and rasp, in that order, so technically, it is still an applewine

OK QUESTION TIME!!!

my attempt at the hydrometer reading left me with a AG of .996

but the stem of the hydrometer was touching the sides ( I use a Wine Thief)

all the FAQs, Wikis, etc I read stated that you can't get a good reading when the Hydrometer stem touches the side of the sample jar???

Ummmmm, with a Wine Thief how can you NOT touch the sides, its ALWAYS touching the side, AND it clings to the side when wet???

forgive me it this is a newb. question, but am i missing something?

Danke Schnitzel!

steinsato said:

Hell, I pay $5 a gallon for the Treetop Juice and that's when it's on sale. I'm going to have to make a trip up north to the orchards and see what they sell their juice for. I have an apple tree that is loaded right now but do not have a press of anysort. Anyone know of a makeshift way to press apples that isn't a complete pain in the a$$?

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$5 a gallon for Treetop sounds like mango slushee and out of date milk! Those prices would make even my local 7-11 manager blush!

try a box store ( god bless you brothers Aldi) or as others have suggested, its getting close to harvest time, get the real stuff from an orchard in bulk

one the crush your own, however, I am ALL EARS, would love any ideas as well!

I have made my first batch of Apfelwein. Its been fermenting at 78 degrees for 3 weeks, it is nice and clear and the airlock has nearly no activity.

I'd like to let it sit another week, but I have a dear friend visiting for a week in about ten days. She is a drinker, but recently allergic to beer. So she loves cider....

I would like to get this batch conditioned for when she comes into town and as mentioned, Monty is a lazy yeast.

Any recommendations for getting this 6.5 gallons of barely ready to bottle Apfelwien to a fizzy hard dry cider in 7-10 days?

Tom.

tomlivings said:

I have made my first batch of Apfelwein. Its been fermenting at 78 degrees for 3 weeks, it is nice and clear and the airlock has nearly no activity.

I'd like to let it sit another week, but I have a dear friend visiting for a week in about ten days. She is a drinker, but recently allergic to beer. So she loves cider....

I would like to get this batch conditioned for when she comes into town and as mentioned, Monty is a lazy yeast.

Any recommendations for getting this 6.5 gallons of barely ready to bottle Apfelwien to a fizzy hard dry cider in 7-10 days?

Tom.

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sadly, apfelwein needs a lot of time to mellow and smooth out... month-old apfelwein could properly be called "hooch", it won't taste nice and the hangovers will be legendary...

my first batch was 2 months old and was imho, very nasty.... i didn't give up though, my second try sat for 6 months and was better, but my third and current attempt (1 year) turned out fantastic.

unless someone knows a shortcut, i don't know of any way to speed up the process..

marzsit said:

sadly, apfelwein needs a lot of time to mellow and smooth out... month-old apfelwein could properly be called "hooch", it won't taste nice and the hangovers will be legendary...

my first batch was 2 months old and was imho, very nasty.... i didn't give up though, my second try sat for 6 months and was better, but my third and current attempt (1 year) turned out fantastic.

unless someone knows a shortcut, i don't know of any way to speed up the process..

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Well, I guess it's store-bought hangovers for my friend then.

marzsit said:

my first batch was 2 months old and was imho, very nasty.... i didn't give up though, my second try sat for 6 months and was better, but my third and current attempt (1 year) turned out fantastic.

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When you say your 2nd batch sat for 6 months, do you mean it sat in primary on the yeast for that long or did you rack it to a secondary after a month or two and then let it condition longer off of the yeast cake?

2 out my 3 batches sat in Primary for 2-3 months. After a 10-14 day bottle conditioning they were quite drinkable. I cracked some 6 month old stock and honestly couldn't tell much difference. Saving some for the 1 year mark as well. I did notice that the stuff I had NOT carbonated but bottled Still got much darker with time. This was from a Grolsch type closure maybe the seal wasn't 100% and some oxidation occurred, but these type of closures have been fine for the carbonated stuff. Have to open one of the corked wine bottles I bottled still to see how that is.

The third batch sat in primary for 2.5 months as well and just passed 7 days conditioning. Will crack one of these open soon to see if it is 'there' yet. This one used EC-1118 while the first 2 used Montrachet.

I have made dozens of batches of Apfelwein, mostly original recipe. I recently encountered a clinker and would like to know what the community thinks or if anyone has had a similar experience.

The batch proceeded normally (orig recipe) I bottled after 2.5 months in the fermenter. No unusual or different juice source, temeperature conditions or brewing procedures. Usuallt it clears very nicely after 6 weeks or so. This batch remained quite cloudy, even after 2.5 months. After bottling, it failed to carb in the uusal time frame. And finally . . . . it tastes like crap. Extrtemely sour and very unappealing. I will probably waste it.

Anyvody know what might have happened or have a similar experience?

How much head room does Apfelwein need? I just got 4 free food grade 5 gallon buckets with lids from the bakery. Can I use them for apfelwein?

Edwort states you can fill it to bottom of the neck but I allow more room. I usually only put in about 4.5 to 4.75 gallons of juice. I've had blowoffs using both Montrachet and EC-1118 champagne yeast. In fact my champagne yeast blew off 2 days after I pitched it, settled down for a day then blew off again about 5 days after pitching. So personally, I no longer put all 5 gallons into a 5 gallon carboy.

steinsato said:

When you say your 2nd batch sat for 6 months, do you mean it sat in primary on the yeast for that long or did you rack it to a secondary after a month or two and then let it condition longer off of the yeast cake?

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first batch sat in primary for 1 month, then in keg for another month before tasting. that keg went away slowly.. even after 4 months it was still a bit harsh. to get rid of it it ended up getting mixed up into punch at a sci-fi convention party, where nobody was sober enough to notice

second batch in primary for 2 months, kegged for 4 months. much better, actually drinkable. i figured the longer time in primary really helped so i let the third batch (started 1 month after the second batch) sit in primary for 6 months. it then sat in kegs for another 6 months while batch #2 was being consumed.

i really think the longer you let it sit in primary, the better it gets. the only reason i stopped batch #3 at 6 months was because the airlocks were starting to look nasty.. nothing is supposed to be able to grow in vodka, but this looked like some sort of algae or bacteria, stringy yellow-brown stuff..

What if you add more dextrose will you get a higher acohl content or just screw everything up?

hellbender said:

I have made dozens of batches of Apfelwein, mostly original recipe. I recently encountered a clinker and would like to know what the community thinks or if anyone has had a similar experience.

The batch proceeded normally (orig recipe) I bottled after 2.5 months in the fermenter. No unusual or different juice source, temeperature conditions or brewing procedures. Usuallt it clears very nicely after 6 weeks or so. This batch remained quite cloudy, even after 2.5 months. After bottling, it failed to carb in the uusal time frame. And finally . . . . it tastes like crap. Extrtemely sour and very unappealing. I will probably waste it.

Anyvody know what might have happened or have a similar experience?

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Infection of some sort.

akthor said:

What if you add more dextrose will you get a higher acohl content or just screw everything up?

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Higher alcohol to a point, then the yeast will be overwhelmed and you'll just have more tasteless carbs (dextrose doesn't really taste like anything).

So how much is too much?

Hegh said:

Higher alcohol to a point, then the yeast will be overwhelmed and you'll just have more tasteless carbs (dextrose doesn't really taste like anything).

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akthor said:

So how much is too much?

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You'd have to look up the yeast alcohol tolerance on the manufacturer's web site.