Experimental Sour Hefeweizen

6.6lb Wheat LME
2lb Acidulated Malt
2lb Pilson
1b Barley (Flaked)

1oz East Kent Goldings @ 15

2 Hefeweizen IV vials
1 Lactobacillus vial


Keeping the hops low for the style + the acidity. Thoughts?

taylja06 said:

6.6lb Wheat LME
2lb Acidulated Malt
2lb Pilson
1b Barley (Flaked)

1oz East Kent Goldings @ 15

2 Hefeweizen IV vials
1 Lactobacillus vial
Keeping the hops low for the style + the acidity. Thoughts?

Click to expand...

If you use sour malt, why use the lacto? You won't need both. Keep it simple. Replace the acid malt with pilsen malt. Skip the flaked barley.

A lot of the wheat strains intrinsically create a subtle tart finish on their own.

You might save your money by trying just some 88% lactic acid in a glass of finished product before spending the money on the lacto bugs. Make a half batch and see if it sucks or not. Then you can use one vial and maybe pitch a full batch on the cake.

highgravitybacon said:

If you use sour malt, why use the lacto? You won't need both. Keep it simple. Replace the acid malt with pilsen malt. Skip the flaked barley.

Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly. If you're using acid malt just to get the sourness just add lactic acid after fermentation ends. Acid malt is barley sprayed with lactic acid. It's cheaper to add the acid on your own.

If you're curious what this style tastes like -- and you can get it -- Jolly Pumpkin makes a sour hefeweizen called Bam Weizen. Might save you from brewing a beer you dislike.

Not too long ago, I brewed this, and it was fantastic! Seriously one of the best beers I have made to date:

Tangy Hefeweizen
For 5.5 Gallons/Partial Mash:

3 lbs Wheat DME
3 lbs German Pils
1 lb Acid Malt

Yeast: Wyeast Weihenstephan 3068

Hops:
20M: 1 oz German Select
10M: 1 oz German Select
Flameout: 1 oz German Select

The reasoning for the lacto and acidulated malt was to give it some increasing complexity over time, while making it acidic out of the gate. Basically trying to build something that will gradually increase in flavor as it loses some body to the lacto.

Considering the body loss though, I'm thinking of adding caramelized sugar into the secondary to give it some unfermentables / unbreakables to keep the body. Anything else that might be worthwhile to add to give it some flavor? Was thinking possibly peaches.

taylja06 said:

The reasoning for the lacto and acidulated malt was to give it some increasing complexity over time, while making it acidic out of the gate. Basically trying to build something that will gradually increase in flavor as it loses some body to the lacto.

Considering the body loss though, I'm thinking of adding caramelized sugar into the secondary to give it some unfermentables / unbreakables to keep the body. Anything else that might be worthwhile to add to give it some flavor? Was thinking possibly peaches.

Click to expand...

This is confusing. If you're going to let it age, why does it matter if its acidic immediately? If you're not going to let it age, why does it matter if its acidic down the line?

The yeast and the grain are the source of "flavor". No need to dress it up with all sort of other things. Here's something to consider. If you've never made one before, you don't really know how it will turn out. Make it, and then if there's a problem like no body, dress it up a bit. But let the problem manifest before fixing it.

It doesn't "lose" body to the lacto any more than it loses body to the yeast. Lacto ferments the beer as does yeast. It's not some super bug. It's actually kind of puss.

Well the problem was noted here: http://***********/stories/beer-styles/article/indices/11-beer-styles/659-flanders-red-ale

having to do with the use of bugs and the "resulting loss of body is one potential problem. Eventual gushing and, on the extreme end exploding bottles, is another. Be certain you have a stable gravity to your beer and enough acid production before bottling." So I was trying to correct for that, really.

taylja06 said:

Well the problem was noted here: http://***********/stories/beer-styles/article/indices/11-beer-styles/659-flanders-red-ale

having to do with the use of bugs and the "resulting loss of body is one potential problem. Eventual gushing and, on the extreme end exploding bottles, is another. Be certain you have a stable gravity to your beer and enough acid production before bottling." So I was trying to correct for that, really.

Click to expand...

Its the multi-organism flora that can result in decreased mouthfeel. In the case of Flanders Red, the article mentions not just lacto, but brettanomyces, pediococcus, acetobacter, yeast, and lacto. Unless you are profoundly unsanitary, or pitching a flanders mix, you won't find these organisms in your beer.

acidrain23 said:

Not too long ago, I brewed this, and it was fantastic! Seriously one of the best beers I have made to date:

Tangy Hefeweizen
For 5.5 Gallons/Partial Mash:

3 lbs Wheat DME
3 lbs German Pils
1 lb Acid Malt

Yeast: Wyeast Weihenstephan 3068

Hops:
20M: 1 oz German Select
10M: 1 oz German Select
Flameout: 1 oz German Select

Click to expand...

Hmmm...... Been interested in trying something like this for a while now. Might be something fun for me to try in the near future.

Haven't used acid malt to sour something yet. Is 1 lb enough to actually make this very tart?

Well that makes more sense. I've used a flanders blend every time before, so not used to straight lacto.

Haputanlas said:

Hmmm...... Been interested in trying something like this for a while now. Might be something fun for me to try in the near future.

Haven't used acid malt to sour something yet. Is 1 lb enough to actually make this very tart?

Click to expand...

Very tart? No, it's more of a slightly tart edge, which came out good and balanced in this recipe. I would try the lacto bacteria or even add lactic acid for a very tart brew as per the OP. I got the original idea after trying Two Brother's hefe, which is a little tart as well.