I just started a Coopers brand pilsner today

I didnt realize that pilsner is like a lager and should be fermented at a lower temperature. I went ahead with it anyway and stuck it on my basement floor. It may not be cool enough down there but besides being at near freezing temps in my garage , the basement is the coolest place in the house. Anybody have experience with this beer ?

Iwe'll being their lager isn't really a lager, but actually an ale, I'm wondering if it's the same story. What do the instructions say for the fermenting temperature? Was the yeast you used their gold foil package ale yeast or did you switch it out?


Rev.

Rev2010 said:

Iwe'll being their lager isn't really a lager, but actually an ale, I'm wondering if it's the same story. What do the instructions say for the fermenting temperature? Was the yeast you used their gold foil package ale yeast or did you switch it out?


Rev.

Click to expand...

It says 18c to 32c ( 21c to 27c optimum ) . The yeast was in a white foil package that just says " Thomas coopers yeast 7g NET " and thats all. Now that I think about it , that temp. range is not much of a lager temp at all. I guess it should do fine at regular household temperatures.

This kit actually comes with real Lager yeast. The beer should be allowed to ferment in the 10-15 Celcius range.

You do mean the Thomas Cooper's Selection Pilsener kit, right?

If the instructions lists that temp range it can't be lager yeast. From what I've heard all the Cooper's kits come with the same Cooper's ale yeast. I know my wheat kit did. Didn't use it though.


Rev.

Rev2010 said:

If the instructions lists that temp range it can't be lager yeast. From what I've heard all the Cooper's kits come with the same Cooper's ale yeast. I know my wheat kit did. Didn't use it though.


Rev.

Click to expand...

Apparently, they do have a few different yeasts.

I've read but have been unable to verify that the coopers premium lagers come with a mix of lager and ale yeast. To me this doesn't make sense, but that is what I've gathered on several web pages. It may again be another myth.

I've done 2 of their regular lagers and fermenting them in the low 60's worked pretty well. I would also recommend using DME instead of the 2.2lbs of corn sugar they suggest. My first coopers kit was a real ale and I used the 2.2 lbs of sugar and fermented in the 70's as they suggested and it ended up down the drain after 2 months. Fruity, nasty alcohol.

I do like their lager and pils though. Just use DME ans possibly some steeping grains and you'll end up with pretty good beer.

The can just said Thomas Coopers selection Pilsner. They are incredibly vague with their labeling and description. Even the yeast packet pretty much just says "yeast".
Lists brewing notes for pilsner and says it has yeast that behaves differently to the normal coopers yeast. Avoid use of plain white sugar , and prefered brewing temperature is at the low end of the reccomended range ( 21c) . But I have it back in my kitchen at around 70F and the airlock is bubling away normally. Hopefully it will turn out ok just fermented like a regular ale. I did add a small bag of DME to it since I couldnt find the actual "brew enhancer" , was told it will work fine.

I took a look at the yeast that came with the Mexican Cerveza one time and noticed that, while the pack appeared to be identical to all the Coopers gold yeast packs, it was imprinted on the back with faint lettering indicating it was the Intl. Strain. This, combined with online reports supporting it, leads me to believe they do use a couple of different yeast strains.

Made this Coopers Pilsener kit a few times and it has a nice Saaz hop taste/aroma. It does have a 100% pure Lager yeast strain as per the Coopers website link below.

http://www.coopers.com.au/the-brewers-guild/how-to-brew/lager/pilsener

We recommend pitching Lager yeast at 20C then allowing the brew to drop to as low as 13C over the next day or so. Some physical differences when fermenting with Lager yeast: Less foam and barely noticeable scum ring, Less CO2 produced and longer ferment time, May produce an eggy smell (this will dissipate with bottle age), Ferments more thoroughly - Lower FG achieved.

http://www.coopers.com.au/the-brewers-guild/talk-brewing?g=posts&t=1803

The following explains the ink-jetted code on the yeast sachets, supplied with each beer kit:

Sachets carry a Julian date code and may also carry letters to denote the type of yeast. For example, if they were packaged on the 25th of September 2007 = 268th day of 2007:

Original Series:- Ac (26807)

International Series:-
Australian Pale Ale - Ac+L (26807 Int)
Mexican Cerveza - Ac+L (26807 Int)
European Lager - L (26807 P)
Canadian Blonde - Ac (26807)
English Bitter - Ac (26807)

Thomas Coopers Selection:-
Wheat - A (26807 W)
IPA - Ac (26807 IPA)
Irish Stout - A (26807 IS)
Pilsener - L (26807 P)
Australian Bitter - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Heritage Lager - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Sparkling Ale - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Traditional Draught - Ac+L (26807 PS)

Note:
Ac = Coopers ale yeast (our own strain, not the same as the yeast in our commercial ales, developed in-house and propagated under contract).

A = ale yeast and L = lager yeast (these strains are commercially available dry yeast and their details are held in confidence).


Cheers
PB2 - Coopers Brewery

fiat84 said:

Made this Coopers Pilsener kit a few times and it has a nice Saaz hop taste/aroma. It does have a 100% pure Lager yeast strain as per the Coopers website link below.

http://www.coopers.com.au/the-brewers-guild/how-to-brew/lager/pilsener

We recommend pitching Lager yeast at 20C then allowing the brew to drop to as low as 13C over the next day or so. Some physical differences when fermenting with Lager yeast: Less foam and barely noticeable scum ring, Less CO2 produced and longer ferment time, May produce an eggy smell (this will dissipate with bottle age), Ferments more thoroughly - Lower FG achieved.

http://www.coopers.com.au/the-brewers-guild/talk-brewing?g=posts&t=1803

The following explains the ink-jetted code on the yeast sachets, supplied with each beer kit:

Sachets carry a Julian date code and may also carry letters to denote the type of yeast. For example, if they were packaged on the 25th of September 2007 = 268th day of 2007:

Original Series:- Ac (26807)

International Series:-
Australian Pale Ale - Ac+L (26807 Int)
Mexican Cerveza - Ac+L (26807 Int)
European Lager - L (26807 P)
Canadian Blonde - Ac (26807)
English Bitter - Ac (26807)

Thomas Coopers Selection:-
Wheat - A (26807 W)
IPA - Ac (26807 IPA)
Irish Stout - A (26807 IS)
Pilsener - L (26807 P)
Australian Bitter - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Heritage Lager - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Sparkling Ale - Ac+L (26807 PS)
Traditional Draught - Ac+L (26807 PS)

Note:
Ac = Coopers ale yeast (our own strain, not the same as the yeast in our commercial ales, developed in-house and propagated under contract).

A = ale yeast and L = lager yeast (these strains are commercially available dry yeast and their details are held in confidence).


Cheers
PB2 - Coopers Brewery

Click to expand...

I never found this information. Thanks for the info. It appears that on some of the kits they do provide a mix of ale and lager yeast as I had read. Interesting.

If you look on page 7 of the instructions paper that comes with that kit under the lid it says it uses a different yeast than the other coopers kits and that it can be used with temps at 13 degrees Celsius so I think it is a larger yeast. I just made that beer 4 days ago. I ended up buying a pilsner lager yeast by Wyeast.

Will there be a significant taste difference if fermenting at 60 to 70F ? Seems like if its within the guidelines it should be ok.

It will be less clean at the warmer temps, i.e., more esters. It doesn't mean the beer will taste bad, but it will be less like a true pilsener.

The active fermentation has slowed considerably , in fact I havent heard any bubbling from it for atleast a day. The directions say to check the final gravity at 4 to 6 days and bottle it. Is it just me or does that seem like not enough time ? That would be a verrrryyyy quick brew time at 4 to 6 days.

Do NOT listen to the Cooper's instructions. That is too soon. Give it two weeks or so, I'd check the gravity at day 12 or so then again on day 14. If it's steady or extremely close you can bottle.


Rev.

The Coopers Original series 'lager' comes with ale yeast but the international series lagers comes with lager yeast. I picked up a can of Coopers European Lager the other day and the instructions say "The yeast ... is a true lager strain ... Coopers European Lager yeast can ferment as low as 13C ... Lower fermentation temps extend the fermentation perios. Ensure fermentation has finished before bottling ... Allow at least 12 weeks in the bottle before consuming."

However the generic instructions give fermenting temps and times for ales with a note that says 'see page 7 for European Lager' - so it is understandable that people get confused.

I will probably shoot for 14C when I brew mine.

I am on day 8 and the airlock has been motionless for a few days now. I was gonna just go ahead and bottle but decided to put it in a secondary first , if that starts up any motion from the airlock I will let it sit a while longer but if nothing happens then I will bottle tomorrow.

Well I transfered to secondary bucket and am drinking the better part of some of the sludge off the bottom. Smells more like wine than beer , flavor is a little weak. Its not the worst Ive ever tasted but definately not a good "beer" flavor. I know it will get better with time so Im not complaining in the least , just sharing my findings with the rest of you. I really cant taste the hops though , hopefully it will come through in the flavor as it matures. This is my first coopers beer so I am not sure what I think of them yet , I do like how easy it is though. I have my eye on a can of canadian blonde from coopers that I want to try next.

So, you you bottled after 8 days despite the recommendations. Guess there was no point for me to post, "Do NOT listen to the Cooper's instructions. That is too soon. Give it two weeks or so, I'd check the gravity at day 12 or so then again on day 14. If it's steady or extremely close you can bottle."

Another recommendation, maybe skip out on the Cooper's cans and go with a kit from Northernbrewer, Midwestsupplies, or AHS - it will be waaaay better, especially if you get a kit with steeping grains. But don't bottle it too darn early!


Rev.

Rev2010 said:

So, you you bottled after 8 days despite the recommendations. Guess there was no point for me to post, "Do NOT listen to the Cooper's instructions. That is too soon. Give it two weeks or so, I'd check the gravity at day 12 or so then again on day 14. If it's steady or extremely close you can bottle."

Another recommendation, maybe skip out on the Cooper's cans and go with a kit from Northernbrewer, Midwestsupplies, or AHS - it will be waaaay better, especially if you get a kit with steeping grains. But don't bottle it do darn early!


Rev.

Click to expand...

Ummmm,.........nope, didnt bottle it yet. I said I transfered it to the secondary bucket. I am thinking I may bottle tomorrow if it really appears that the fermentation has stopped. I have a cheapie hydrometer that I am not really sure how to use yet , so I never took an initial reading and I have been just going by visual signs so far as to what stage the beer is at. But with the flavor and smell closer to wine than beer ( alcohol content ) , and the airlock being dead for days , I know its gotta be close. I have done 2 brewers best kits already , I just decided to try the coopers cans since they are cheap. When I bought the coopers pilsner I actually thought I had the canadian blonde I was looking at and didnt realize what I had until I got home. A tall glass of this stuff has given me a buzz that usually takes a 6 pack , so if thats any indication of where it is at then it really might be about time to bottle.

ohiochris said:

Ummmm,.........nope, didnt bottle it yet. I said I transfered it to the secondary bucket.

Click to expand...

Aaah ok. I seemed to have misread your prior post, could've sworn it said, "I'm just gonna go ahead and bottle it". My bad!


Rev.

even if the batch is done fermenting, it will be still be benificial to leave the batch in primary another week or so, the yeast will still be active and "clean up" many off flavors.

edb23 said:

even if the batch is done fermenting, it will be still be benificial to leave the batch in primary another week or so, the yeast will still be active and "clean up" many off flavors.

Click to expand...

Im not doubting you at all , but there really isnt any off flavor. There is a lack of flavor , or actually more of an alcohol flavor than beer flavor , shouldnt that clean up as the bottles age ?

yeah as the bottles age it will clean up and gain a more distinct flavor and less of a watered down feel, but leaving it in the fermenter for an extra week or two will do wonders with that as well. A cheeseburger is great without bacon, but if you can put bacon on it why not? let it sit for 2 to 3 weeks and then another three in bottles and you'll thank yourself later

I botteled at 8 days my first beer and I had to wait like 6 weeks+ to get the green gone.Would have been better to just let it sit for a few more weeks.Now i let them 3 weeks minimum for good tasting beer after a few weeks in the bottle Like 2-3+ weeks.

ohiochris said:

Im not doubting you at all , but there really isnt any off flavor. There is a lack of flavor , or actually more of an alcohol flavor than beer flavor , shouldnt that clean up as the bottles age ?

Click to expand...

Drop an oz. of Saaz hops in your fermenter (using a muslin bag) for 5 days or so for additional flavor. What temps did you ferment at? The Pils uses a true lager yeast.

It fermented somewhere between 60 and 70 degrees F. After 1 week fermenting and a second week in secondary it tasted better , and I bottled it. After a week or two in the bottles it has turned into one heck of a delicious beer !! Excellent carbonation and head with a strong imported beer flavor a lot like Heineken but not skunky at all , and it keeps getting better the more time goes by. Still has a bitter aftertaste like I had in my first 2 brews that I am starting to think may be from my tapwater but in this case , even though it might be better without it I think it adds character to the beer. I am definately gonna brew some more of it