Belgian Golden Strong Ale-Timeline?

I am looking to brew a belgian golden strong ale to have for two graduation parties in May (Wife is graduating from Nursing school, youngest brother is graduating from highschool). I have a number of other brews I will be brewing for the event, but I wanted to have something different on hand for some of my friends and family that are beer heads. I love belgian beers and I have a little over 3 months till the parties which is what led me to the golden strong ale. (the high abv of this brew does not bother me, I am not planning on kegging this, this one will be bottled and passed out to select few.

This is the recipe I have been eyeing, unless someone can talk me out of it and provide another recipe. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/dirty-monk-belgian-golden-strong-ale-80621/

I am planning on brewing on tuseday, and the brew will need to be ready by May 4. That gives me months and 5 days to have this ready, and this is where I am looking for suggestions on my timeline.

The recipe says 2 weeks primary followed by 6 weeks secondary. Space and storage is not a concern, since the entire basement is my brewery (one of the few pros to having an unfinished basement). Basically I am asking what would you do, to make the best brew possible with a 3 month timeline?

1 month primary followed by 1 month secondary then bottle and prime for the last month?

Or shorter primary, shorter secondary and bottle longer?

Or some variation in between?

Tia for the help

Alex

Let me preface this: I have not brewed this style. However, most my beers are over 10% or slightly under.

I would follow the recipe, primary for 2 1/2 to 3 weeks, secondary for 5 weeks then bottle.

Sounds good. This will be my biggest beer yet and the first beer I will bottle. I started brewing and went straight to the kegs. With a big beer like this and a 8 week timeline before bottling, will I need to re pitch any yeast to get the bottles darned in time? I would not be very happy with myself to plan a brew out like this and not allow enough time to bottle carb it up.

The recipe is complicated. It could be simplified greatly without any ill effect on the beer. Drop the aromatic, go with one hop or two hops not three. Go with a single infusion at 149F.

Plan on using a fining like gelatin to clear the beer in a timely fashion. Make sure you have an ample starter. Keep the fermentation controlled. Start cool, like 62-64 for the first two days and ramp up to 80F. Make sure you oxygenate ideally with pure O2.

This beer will not clear in a reasonable time without the gelatin. If you primary for 3 weeks, transfer to secondary, cold crash at 27F for two weeks, gelatin for a week, bottle, and then let them prime there's about 7-8 weeks. Then you have a month to let the bottle do their magic.

You could add some yeast at the end of fermentation before bottling. If you go with 100,000 cells per ml that's maybe 7-15ml of slurry.

I'm currently brewing Jamil's Belgian golden strong, so I feel you on the slow flocculating yeast.

I'll say this - brew NOW if you want any hope of this being ready by May 4. From what I understand, BGS is a style that really benefits from some extended aging.

highgravitybacon said:

The recipe is complicated. It could be simplified greatly without any ill effect on the beer. Drop the aromatic, go with one hop or two hops not three. Go with a single infusion at 149F.

Plan on using a fining like gelatin to clear the beer in a timely fashion. Make sure you have an ample starter. Keep the fermentation controlled. Start cool, like 62-64 for the first two days and ramp up to 80F. Make sure you oxygenate ideally with pure O2.

This beer will not clear in a reasonable time without the gelatin. If you primary for 3 weeks, transfer to secondary, cold crash at 27F for two weeks, gelatin for a week, bottle, and then let them prime there's about 7-8 weeks. Then you have a month to let the bottle do their magic.

You could add some yeast at the end of fermentation before bottling. If you go with 100,000 cells per ml that's maybe 7-15ml of slurry.

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Thanks. I picked up some whirfloc for the boil and gelatin to use later on.

If a single infusion at 149 will work without any change, than I will just do that. No need to reinvent the wheel if I do not have to.

As for the Aromatic grain, I already ordered some so I will probably just use it, and the same is true for the hops unless you think the 3 hops and the aromatic will have a negative effect? Again, first timer on a beer like this that I hope to serve to friends-so I am hoping for a final product I can be proud of.

I do not have access to pure o2, but I did buy one of those mix stir's for the drill, which seems to be working pretty well. I will sit there and whip it back and forth for awhile. I usually aerate, once cooled, both pre and post pitching of the yeast for a 3 min.

I like the looks of the time line you posted. Since I have the room in my fridge-would a week long cold crash at the end of the 3 week primary be helpful?

homebrewdad said:

I'm currently brewing Jamil's Belgian golden strong, so I feel you on the slow flocculating yeast.

I'll say this - brew NOW if you want any hope of this being ready by May 4. From what I understand, BGS is a style that really benefits from some extended aging.

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I am planning on brewing tomorrow. Mondays and tuesdays are my days off from work now, and it took my lhbs a few weeks to get a sack of belgian pils malt in. I am hoping it will make it by that first week in may.

Still trying to iron out all the details for tomorrow, but either way im sure it will turn out.

Thanks again for the help everyone
Alex

Another question for everyone on the hop additions-

Being that the recipe posted is from 2008, the AA's of the hops used and mine are quite a bit different. The recipe posted has and estimated Ibu of 34.4, and if I plug the numbers in it gives me an estimated ibu of 45.5. Is this a big enough difference to notice? If I back down the two Saaz and Tettnang additions to .75 instead of a full ounce, it drops my ibu down to 35. Is this what you would do?

Double check your AA percentages to be sure that they match - you may not be comparing apples to apples. Also note that the recipe may be assuming a different IBU scale than you are (Tinseth vs Ranger, etc).

My BGS is in the upper 20s for IBUs, with an OG of 1.072; Beersmith says that the style upper limit is 35 (Tinseth). 45 sounds high to me.

Doesn't mean that 45 *is* too high, however. You may enjoy a hoppier BGS. Yay for homebrew creative freedom.

Stovetop535 said:

Thanks. I picked up some whirfloc for the boil and gelatin to use later on.

If a single infusion at 149 will work without any change, than I will just do that. No need to reinvent the wheel if I do not have to.

As for the Aromatic grain, I already ordered some so I will probably just use it, and the same is true for the hops unless you think the 3 hops and the aromatic will have a negative effect? Again, first timer on a beer like this that I hope to serve to friends-so I am hoping for a final product I can be proud of.

I do not have access to pure o2, but I did buy one of those mix stir's for the drill, which seems to be working pretty well. I will sit there and whip it back and forth for awhile. I usually aerate, once cooled, both pre and post pitching of the yeast for a 3 min.

I like the looks of the time line you posted. Since I have the room in my fridge-would a week long cold crash at the end of the 3 week primary be helpful?

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Very. It will help clear your beer dramatically. A >8% beer wont freeze until 27-28. I don't have a fridge so I actually stuck it outside in a shed for a few days until the temps got really cold. That helped but not as much as a proper lagering would. It also drops a profuse amount of haze, though the Euro pils I used is lower in protein than some. Nothing looks better than an 8-9% beer that could pass for a pils in the glass.

The gelatin works very well. I had great luck using it in a cider that just wouldn't quit, and just plopped some in a tripel that wont clear. There is something in my brew process I need to straighten up because it seems like this shouldn't be happening with this frequency.

I'm sure the malt and hops will work just fine that you ordered.

Hop #'s from the recipe are
@90 min = 1 oz Saaz 5.8%
@90 min = 1 oz Hallertauer 4.2%
@15 min = 1 oz Tettnang 6.0%

My packages say

Saaz 7.6%
Hallertauer 3.9%
Tettnang 4.7%

Still a new guy to brewing, so I was not even aware of the different IBU scales. I will have to read up on that some more. I want this to be pretty true to category, and I am far from a "hop head", so I may scale back a little. I would imagine it would be best to scale back the two 90 min additions, rather than the 15?

I will definitely cold crash the primary before racking. The basement fridge sets right at 34*, so getting it down another couple degrees will not be a problem-especially since all I store in there is brewing stuff. I bought a temp controller to lager beers with and still have not used it. Looks like I now have a reason to hook it up.

Even though this is not a lager beer, it will still age correctly if its in the fridge for 4 weeks?

Just wanted to update this--just finished the cleanup from this brew today. Got a week later start than I wanted due to work, but thats just how it goes.

I purchased a copy of beersmith for this recipe, and I have to say, it made scaling and changing the recipe much easier. I went with a single infusion @149 for 60 min followed by a single sparge. I did back the hop additions back a little in order to keep it true to style. The sample I tasted before pitching the yeast was pretty good, I am looking forward to this one. Now just the waiting game. I need to get some labels made up since I plan on bottling this batch instead of kegging.

Thanks for the advice. I plan on leaving it in the basement for 3-4 days and then bringing it upstairs to finish before putting it in the fridge. This will give me a temp swing from about 63 to 70. Still havent decided if I will mess with heating to bring it up to the high 70's or not.

Stovetop535 said:

Just wanted to update this--just finished the cleanup from this brew today. Got a week later start than I wanted due to work, but thats just how it goes.

I purchased a copy of beersmith for this recipe, and I have to say, it made scaling and changing the recipe much easier. I went with a single infusion @149 for 60 min followed by a single sparge. I did back the hop additions back a little in order to keep it true to style. The sample I tasted before pitching the yeast was pretty good, I am looking forward to this one. Now just the waiting game. I need to get some labels made up since I plan on bottling this batch instead of kegging.

Thanks for the advice. I plan on leaving it in the basement for 3-4 days and then bringing it upstairs to finish before putting it in the fridge. This will give me a temp swing from about 63 to 70. Still havent decided if I will mess with heating to bring it up to the high 70's or not.

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I'd recommend against trying to ramp up to the high 70s. Starting at 63F is very good--pitching cool tends to suppress fusel formation, which is imp't in the big beers. After that, going up to 70F should make the yeast more active to help them finish all those sugars.

I hope you made a big starter and/or pitched multiple vials/packs of yeast. Great beer is made in the fermenter!

Yeah Made a starter following one of the online calculators. Pitched the entire 2L starter.

I had read a little about the higher fermentation temps towards the end of fermentation with some beers. I do not have a heater to warm the beer with, so the natural temp upstairs will have to do.

Stovetop535 said:

Yeah Made a starter following one of the online calculators. Pitched the entire 2L starter.

I had read a little about the higher fermentation temps towards the end of fermentation with some beers. I do not have a heater to warm the beer with, so the natural temp upstairs will have to do.

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An older, non auto shutoff, electric blanket works well. That's what I use. It only takes about 45 watts and will get a carboy to the mid 80s in a 54F baserment. I had good luck with this style of beer ramping to 82F over a week, starting at 62F.

So the gradual temp raise is meant to help fermentation finish and to add more flavors to the beer from the yeast? But getting it too warm and I have the potential for off flavors-correct?

Keep it cool early on to avoid off flavors. Big Belgians can benefit from warming them later on - say, once you get 50% or more of the way to final gravity - the yeast starts to slow down, and this can help them squeeze out those last few points in a more timely manner. By this point, you're not really worrying about off flavors.

Following Jamil's advice, I got my BGS up to 80 with a heating pad - but only at the very end. the majority of my active fermentation was in the low 60s.

Stovetop535 said:

So the gradual temp raise is meant to help fermentation finish and to add more flavors to the beer from the yeast? But getting it too warm and I have the potential for off flavors-correct?

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In general, you have it. Most of the problems with fermenting (aside from sanitation) arise during the initial phases, and that's when it's better to keep things cool to keep them under control. By 36-48 hours of active, healthy fermentation, the growth phase is largely done and you can start to think about ramping up temperatures because there's much less chance of producing higher alcohols (painful headaches & "hot" flavors) or extreme esters.

After that initial danger phase, just keep in mind that heat = energy, so warming the yeast gives them the last push to finish as much as they're going to. My standard practice is to ferment cool (mid- to upper 60s) for 3-4 days and then let it rise to 70F or so.

Awesome. This morning when I went down stairs to check temps it was all but blowing vodka out the airlock. I could see a nice krausen ring outline on the bucket. I glad I put it in the bucket and not the 6 gal bb. I think I would have had a mess with the bb and no blowoff.

The basement is 62 deg and according to wlp's webpage optimum ferm temps for wlp 570 is 68 to 75. Anyone have experience with this yeast in particular?

Stovetop535 said:

Awesome. This morning when I went down stairs to check temps it was all but blowing vodka out the airlock. I could see a nice krausen ring outline on the bucket. I glad I put it in the bucket and not the 6 gal bb. I think I would have had a mess with the bb and no blowoff.

The basement is 62 deg and according to wlp's webpage optimum ferm temps for wlp 570 is 68 to 75. Anyone have experience with this yeast in particular?

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If your basement is 62, the beer is probably fermenting at 67-70 degrees. Within specs, for sure.

This yeast is a notoriously slow flocculator, but when I peeked at my carboy at 2 weeks 1 day, it had already cleared.

As for how the final beer turns out... That has yet to be seen.

Just wanted to update this...

Checked the gravity today after 2 weeks and it was down to 1.006 from 1.079. Beersmiths predicted final gravity was 1.015, definitely flew right by that. Could the lower final gravity be due to me missing my mash temps slightly high? I did not loose as much heat as anticipated and ended up mashing around 153 instead of 149.

Stovetop535 said:

Just wanted to update this...

Checked the gravity today after 2 weeks and it was down to 1.006 from 1.079. Beersmiths predicted final gravity was 1.015, definitely flew right by that. Could the lower final gravity be due to me missing my mash temps slightly high? I did not loose as much heat as anticipated and ended up mashing around 153 instead of 149.

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The simple sugars are hard for the brewing programs to figure. It is safe to assume 87-90% attenuation for the 570/1388 yeast with 15-20% by weight simple sugars.

Mashing at 153 tends to give you more, not less, residual sugars that are not typical fermented by yeast.

I love this blog, Woodland Brew. Here's some data on mash temp vs. fermentables worth reading:
http://woodlandbrew.blogspot.com/2013/01/mash-temperature-theory.html

Stovetop535 said:

Just wanted to update this...

Checked the gravity today after 2 weeks and it was down to 1.006 from 1.079. Beersmiths predicted final gravity was 1.015, definitely flew right by that. Could the lower final gravity be due to me missing my mash temps slightly high? I did not loose as much heat as anticipated and ended up mashing around 153 instead of 149.

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Be happy. BSGA with a FG of 1.015 would be disgustingly sweet IMO.

highgravitybacon said:

The simple sugars are hard for the brewing programs to figure. It is safe to assume 87-90% attenuation for the 570/1388 yeast with 15-20% by weight simple sugars.

Mashing at 153 tends to give you more, not less, residual sugars that are not typical fermented by yeast.

I love this blog, Woodland Brew. Here's some data on mash temp vs. fermentables worth reading:
http://woodlandbrew.blogspot.com/2013/01/mash-temperature-theory.html

Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. That's a good read.


And I am not complaining at all with the gravity numbers. I was just a little surprised at the difference between the predicted in beer smith vs my actual readings.

Just racked the other day and added some gelatin. Had to put the carboy in the garage since the fridge is full in the basement. Already had a lot more yeast drop out after racking. There is a lot more in the bottom than I thought there would be.

Keep in your time line, if you bottle, they may take 8-10 weeks to properly carbonate!

I've got a Belgian IpA that came in at 9.5 % and is going on 9 weeks at 72F and still about 10 days away!

Yeah I was debating on kegging and force carbing and then bottling out of the keg that way I would not have to wait for it to bottle carb. I have 1 liter flip tops to bottle with, so I would not have that many bottles to fill out of the tap.

duboman said:

Keep in your time line, if you bottle, they may take 8-10 weeks to properly carbonate!

I've got a Belgian IpA that came in at 9.5 % and is going on 9 weeks at 72F and still about 10 days away!

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Add fresh yeast and it's no more than 2 weeks.

Add in some of the 570 that I used orignially? I washed some and have it in a mason jar. Or do you mean add in a different, neutral strain to carb?

highgravitybacon said:

Add fresh yeast and it's no more than 2 weeks.

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Not in my experience, the high alcohol content hinders the yeast activity.

I've done it both with and without fresh yeast on large beers and notice no major difference in time

Stovetop535 said:

Add in some of the 570 that I used orignially? I washed some and have it in a mason jar. Or do you mean add in a different, neutral strain to carb?

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Either. Just a little is all that's needed. I used about 20 ml of slurry in the bucket.

I always re-yeast with the same strain but it really doesn't matter... Going to try a Tripel I bottled 14 days ago tonight. Usually ready in 14 days... but has taken as long as 21 days to fully carb...

Just wanted to add some info on this already great thread. I tried to make this beer with the safbrew t-58 dried yeast option. I would not recommend taking this yeast up to 82 degrees. It has a very harsh solventy ester profile. I was trying to save money and I ruined this batch. From now on it's WL or Wyeast starters for me...