Just tried my first lambic

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Sithdad

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My wife came home with a bottle of Framboise's Raspberry Lambic today. Apparently a coworker of her's liked the homebrew I gave him so he decided to return the favor.

I have to say it was nothing like I was expecting. I had this notion that the beer was going to be like drinking a Sour Patch Kid candy, or something like that. Instead, I was treated to, what I would call a sparkling wine. I was very impressed and so was SWMBO. Especially since she doesn't like beer and is a wine drinker. Perhaps I need to look into making a lambic now. I never would have thought I would be trying a lambic.
 
Lindermans Framboise is good, but it is kind of the BMC of the lambic world. For true lambic sour flavor try a Gueuze. Then get your hands on anything by Cantillon. It is well worth the money.
 
Lindermans Framboise is good, but it is kind of the BMC of the lambic world. For true lambic sour flavor try a Gueuze. Then get your hands on anything by Cantillon. It is well worth the money.

Is there anywhere in GF that sells Cantillon Fife?
 
My wife came home with a bottle of Framboise's Raspberry Lambic today. Apparently a coworker of her's liked the homebrew I gave him so he decided to return the favor.

I have to say it was nothing like I was expecting. I had this notion that the beer was going to be like drinking a Sour Patch Kid candy, or something like that. Instead, I was treated to, what I would call a sparkling wine. I was very impressed and so was SWMBO. Especially since she doesn't like beer and is a wine drinker. Perhaps I need to look into making a lambic now. I never would have thought I would be trying a lambic.

yes, as mentioned above, you did not try a lambic. it would be about the same to say that miller lite is a pilsener.
 
Cantillon Rose. My wife loves it, and isn't the easiest to find to buy in case form. In Philly, Monk's Cafe and Eulogy have it. I am thinking stocking stuffer.
 
Lindemans is not lambic.

Dont listen to the label, its a lie.
You must be joking, Lindemans has been brewing traditional lambics for going on 200 years. Just because something is backsweetened does not mean it isn't a lambic. The base of that beer is indeed a true lambic, if your personal tastes sway towards the funkier, more sour and dry lambics they do make a gueuze called Cuvee Rene that you might like.

For anyone who is a fan of Lindemans check out this video, they visit the brewery at about 7:30 and there is some pretty rad footage.
http://www.trilulilu.ro/pauzadebere/6b2664406d6eaa?video_google_com=#
 
You must be joking, Lindemans has been brewing traditional lambics for going on 200 years. Just because something is backsweetened does not mean it isn't a lambic. The base of that beer is indeed a true lambic, if your personal tastes sway towards the funkier, more sour and dry lambics they do make a gueuze called Cuvee Rene that you might like.
video_google_com=#[/url]

He's not the only one who feels this way, Jean van Roy of Cantillon has been quoted as saying that it isnt lambic, he goes on to say that a lambic CANNOT be sweet it must be dry and acidic

Article with quote
http://www.saveur.com/article.jsp?ID=8728

Maybe the base beer for lindemans was a lambic, cuvee renee is a pretty decent gueuze, but that does not mean the Framboise should be considered a fruit lambic, it just isnt representative of the style, its more of an alcopop thing.
 
You must be joking, Lindemans has been brewing traditional lambics for going on 200 years. Just because something is backsweetened does not mean it isn't a lambic. The base of that beer is indeed a true lambic, if your personal tastes sway towards the funkier, more sour and dry lambics they do make a gueuze called Cuvee Rene that you might like.

For anyone who is a fan of Lindemans check out this video, they visit the brewery at about 7:30 and there is some pretty rad footage.
http://www.trilulilu.ro/pauzadebere/6b2664406d6eaa?video_google_com=#

Cuvee Rene is pretty good.

And no, a Pasteurized, sweetened lambic is not a lambic any more than a pasteurized, sweetened real ale is still a real ale.

Lindemans Ferments in "wood-conditioned vats" (ss vats with wooden slats suspended in them), pasteurizes their base beer, and back-sweetens it with fruit juice.
 
Cuvee Rene is pretty good.

And no, a Pasteurized, sweetened lambic is not a lambic any more than a pasteurized, sweetened real ale is still a real ale.

Lindemans Ferments in "wood-conditioned vats" (ss vats with wooden slats suspended in them), pasteurizes their base beer, and back-sweetens it with fruit juice.
You said that Lindemans does not make lambic, which is outrageously incorrect. Here is a brewery who brews a spontaneously fermented wheat based ale, is a founding member of HORAL and has been making these beers for longer than any other Belgian brewery I know of. If you want to say that specifically their line of fruit beers is nontraditional then I completely agree, but you should specify that instead of claiming that "Lindemans is not lambic."

I don't think the real ale correlation works at all. Real ale is by definition an unfiltered and unpasteurised live product at the point of delivery, pasteurizing would break the very definition of it therefor making just a regular ale. Lambic is by definition a wheat based spontaneously fermented ale, sweetening may break tradition but it does not break the definition.

Out of curiosity where do you draw the line? Is it the pasteurizing or the sweetening of the lambic that makes it no longer a lambic in your mind? Although pasteurizing will change the way the beer evolves over time it won't dramatically change the way the beer tastes immediately and the majority of people would never know. To me backsweetening is what makes it a completely different beer, and I would always go out of my way to point out that it is not a traditional lambic, but I would not completely seclude it from the lambic family.
 
He's not the only one who feels this way, Jean van Roy of Cantillon has been quoted as saying that it isnt lambic, he goes on to say that a lambic CANNOT be sweet it must be dry and acidic

So their major competitor says it doesn't fit style? How surprising.
 
http://www.bjcp.org/styles04/Category17.php#style17F

Funny, the style guidelines do not cite any lindemans beers as examples of the fruit lambic style.

"A low, complementary sweetness may be present, but higher levels are uncharacteristic"



Lambic is Acidic and dry by definition. Lindemans takes what may be considered lambic and puts it through a process by which it is no longer lambic.

If anything, they should call it Fruit Faro.
 
I don't care what the heck Lindeman's is defined as, I for one think it tastes great. Now if the bar didn't serve it in a champane flute I would be able to feel good about ordering it. I want to brew a sour or a lambic, can somebody let me know what I need to try before taking that step. I have some pretty good beer stores and a Flying Saucer nearby.
 
http://www.bjcp.org/styles04/Category17.php#style17F

Funny, the style guidelines do not cite any lindemans beers as examples of the fruit lambic style.

"A low, complementary sweetness may be present, but higher levels are uncharacteristic"



Lambic is Acidic and dry by definition. Lindemans takes what may be considered lambic and puts it through a process by which it is no longer lambic.

If anything, they should call it Fruit Faro.
That's because the BJCP is not an all encompassing beer style encyclopedia, it's guidelines to help judges know the characteristics of the styles most commonly brewed by homebrewers. I think fruit Faro is an acceptable description of them, but Faro is still a substyle of lambic. Note how Faro is a well documented style of beer, however the BJCP does not have a category for it. This is because it's not a style often enough brewed by homebrewers to require it's own judging category and is simply placed in the Belgian Specialty category...which is where you will find the Lindemans fruit beers listed as classic examples.
 
I don't care what the heck Lindeman's is defined as, I for one think it tastes great. Now if the bar didn't serve it in a champane flute I would be able to feel good about ordering it. I want to brew a sour or a lambic, can somebody let me know what I need to try before taking that step. I have some pretty good beer stores and a Flying Saucer nearby.

Your not going to be able to make something that tastes like lindemans using a lambic base at home, that is unless you kill the bugs/yeast and sweeten in the keg, bottling is not an option


We can argue back and forth about what Lindemans is, but its very deceiving to people who dont know about beer when the drink a framboise lindemans, and think WOW i like lambic beer, well when they go out and try a real lambic (not pasteurized and backsweetened) they are gonna be in for an eye opener
 
I have no problems kegging or killing the yeast, hell I will have quite awhile to research what to do. I would love to make a clone of the Framboise that Lindeman's makes. I am sure the wife and I would love drinking on that one. What real Lambics should I try to see if I really want to make a lambic style ale?
 
I have this feeling that they liked the lambic they tried because of the way it tasted. What is the "you are not supposed to like that, try something else"?

I had a snob of an employee try a beer he thought was mine. He really liked it and even commented on specific things that he liked. He told me it was very good and he wouldn't change the recipe. When I told him it was Budweiser American Ale, he told me "I wish I would have known that first, I am not supposed to like that beer."

It is ok that they like the Lindemans, most people do. This does not take anything away from the "true lambics". Lambics do not have to taste like bile.

Forrest
 
Thank you for the comment Forrest! Sometimes we forget that we brew because we enjoy the beer we brew. I like fruit beers, Ciders, and apparently a Lambic that is back sweetend. I also enjoy some porters, stouts, lagers, and hefeweizen's, and just about everything else I taste from a quality brewmaster.
 
I have this feeling that they liked the lambic they tried because of the way it tasted. What is the "you are not supposed to like that, try something else"?

I had a snob of an employee try a beer he thought was mine. He really liked it and even commented on specific things that he liked. He told me it was very good and he wouldn't change the recipe. When I told him it was Budweiser American Ale, he told me "I wish I would have known that first, I am not supposed to like that beer."

It is ok that they like the Lindemans, most people do. This does not take anything away from the "true lambics". Lambics do not have to taste like bile.

Forrest

applause.gif


Great insight, Forrest!!!! :mug:
 
I have this feeling that they liked the lambic they tried because of the way it tasted. What is the "you are not supposed to like that, try something else"?

I had a snob of an employee try a beer he thought was mine. He really liked it and even commented on specific things that he liked. He told me it was very good and he wouldn't change the recipe. When I told him it was Budweiser American Ale, he told me "I wish I would have known that first, I am not supposed to like that beer."

It is ok that they like the Lindemans, most people do. This does not take anything away from the "true lambics". Lambics do not have to taste like bile.

Forrest

Here Here !!Prost to Forrest!!

and to some you , how about we dial the snobery back a few clicks.
drinking something that most people people think taste like puke does not make you elite, and calling lindermans BCM is just about the dumbest thing i have ever heard here (got some no-rinse peepee sanitzer to go with that) for my self, and I think many of the better informend brewers here, The distain for Bud-BCM is because of the monopolistic strangle hold over the American beer market they have spent billions of dollors mantaining, and the predatory nature they pursued to crush competition, diversity, and consumer choice. I dont dislike them just because they make a lousy beer that would be silly, and in fact the do make many high quality products , myself I have a weekness for Michelob Lager, I think on tap it is just wonderfull but you dont see it much.

Cheers
 
FWIW, I like Lindemans and I like lambics that taste like "bile and puke" as well ;) Same as I like sweet stouts and IIPA's.

I've had good luck -- according to my wife, at least, who loves Lindemans -- at just fruiting the heck out of a pLambic. It's not gonna be sweet, but the "fruitiness" is still there. I've had the best luck with using pure Brett L. and mixed berries. It's got a nice "bite" but is slightly dry and "refreshing." I'm more a fan of "funk" than "sour" and the pure Brett seems to work for me. Also, in my experience, all brett beers are ready to drink much, much quicker. Yes, they get more "complex" with age, but an all brett "fruit beer" can be ready to drink in 6 months or so.

YMMV.
 
I'm curious where in this thread I said that lindeman's was not good.

I said it was not a lambic.

There is a big difference.

This does not take anything away from the "true lambics". Lambics do not have to taste like bile.

The above quote is much more snobbish and down-putting than anything I have said in this thread.

I agree that Lindemans is tasty, but It is not lambic, and if you go out to a beer store and buy a Kriek Boon expecting that it is going to be sweet because it is a lambic, then you are in for a big, probably unpleasant, surprise.

Labeling lindemans as a lambic is about as misleading as labeling J.W. Lees as an IIPA
 
I guess the question is whether Lindeman's has yeast added to the brew or rather it is spontanisoutly (spelling) fermented.
 
and calling lindermans BCM is just about the dumbest thing i have ever heard here

Cheers

Please don't warp my words. I didn't call Lindermans BMC. I called it "kind of the BMC of the lambic world". Big difference. Of course Lindermans isn't sold or marketed like BMC but it is by far the most well distributed in the "lambic world" largely because of its very fruity flavor that makes it appealing to a wider market. Just like the "drinkability" of BMC makes it appealing to a wider market. Lindermans is so common anymore that I can get it in my local grocery store in middle of nowhere Montana. I'm very happy for Lindermans success, but I wasn't wrong to encourage the poster to try other lambics that have smaller market appeal and therefore much more complexity.
 
I'm curious where in this thread I said that lindeman's was not good.

I said it was not a lambic.
Yes, you did say that...in fact you continue to post the exact same thing in this thread over and over and every time it is just as wrong as it was previously.
 
I don't care what you call it, I want a Lindemann's clone. Anyone have a good recipe?

Besides, I was told by someone that you can't really call it lambic if it came in a bottle. It has to be cask conditioned and served in a cafe in Brussels in order to be called Lambic.

Why was this beer snob any less right than some of the other beer snobs on this thread?
 
I don't care what you call it, I want a Lindemann's clone. Anyone have a good recipe?

Besides, I was told by someone that you can't really call it lambic if it came in a bottle. It has to be cask conditioned and served in a cafe in Brussels in order to be called Lambic.

Why was this beer snob any less right than some of the other beer snobs on this thread?

Not to rain on your request, but cloning a spontaneously fermenting beer is like winning the lottery.

One word... Terroir
 
Ok I read all four pages of this thread allow me to summarize;

Linemans Framboise is not a TRADITIONAL fruit Lambic.
It is however a very good example of a lambic base that has been sweetened with fruit juices.

So let us move on to something more interesting and creative. ie how could somebody clone this beer at home?

I think you could do it if you were kegging as you could pasturize and add a raspberry juice or syrup, but any ideas for bottling?

Prime a pLambic with raspberry juice and pasturize after 2wks, 3wks?
 
So let us move on to something more interesting and creative. ie how could somebody clone this beer at home?

I think you could do it if you were kegging as you could pasturize and add a raspberry juice or syrup, but any ideas for bottling?

Prime a pLambic with raspberry juice and pasturize after 2wks, 3wks?

brew up a sweet wheat beer, add lots of raspberries and lactic acid, then bottle and enjoy
 
Isn't lindemans a brand name?

To say 'lindemans is not a lambic' is like saying 'young's is not a bitter'.

Are you talking about lindeman's framboise, lindeman's kriek, lindeman's gueze, lindeman's faro.....

I wouldn't rely on the BJCP guidelines as the ultimate resource for defining a style either.

Sweetening doesn't stop it being a lambic - it just makes it a sweetened lambic. Yes there are some other lambics that are not sweetened and will taste different. Someone may get a surprise. Doesn't make it any less a beer based on spontaneous fermentation brewed according to certain traditions from a specific part of the world. It's also a good introductory beer to people wishing to expand their palate into the world of sour.

To make one read this:

http://www.brewery.org/library/LmbicJL0696.html

and join this:

http://www.babblebelt.com/newboard/forum.html?tid=1108752780&pg=1
 
I have no problems kegging or killing the yeast, hell I will have quite awhile to research what to do. I would love to make a clone of the Framboise that Lindeman's makes. I am sure the wife and I would love drinking on that one. What real Lambics should I try to see if I really want to make a lambic style ale?

Well since everyone else is too angry to answer I'll go for it. Here are some I've enjoyed, but there are plenty more out there to try.

Geueze: Any of the Cantillon products are good (Lou Pepe Geueze, 100% Classic Geueze etc.), Hanssens Artisanaal's Oude Geueze is great as well. Lindmans Cuvee Rene is good (don't want to argue about it, try it for yourself)

Flemish/Flanders Sour Ales: Rodenbach Grand Cru (pretty inexpensive nowadays), Monk's Cafe Sour Flemish, Duchesse de Bourgogne (just bought a case of this liquid gold), Bacchus by Castle Brewery Van Housenbrouck (Kasteel), De Proef Zeutzuur (sweet and sour)

Fruit Lambic: Cantillon Kriek (and Lou Pepe Kriek), Cantillon Rose de Gambrinus, Cantillon Framboise...I haven't tried too many fruit lambics other than the Cantillon offerings, but these are all authentically sour and great.


Then you have your American Wild Ales like Allagash's Confluence or Interlude , Russian River's Temptation, Consecration, Supplication etc. All good.


Take your time trying these, they tend to be on the pricey side. I recomend cracking each with a good meal and paying attention to how they change with rising temperature. If you have some to spare, the acidity is phenominal for vinagrettes and marinades. Happy drinking!
 
Here is a link to a supposed Lindemans clone recipe.

http://***********/stories/recipes/...ian-lambic-and-sour-ale/1781-lindemans-lambic

I'm currently right in the middle of brewing this, my plan is to secondary in half gallon growlers and try different fruits (think I'll leave one of just the original Belgian wheat as well).
 
FWIW. Faro is a traditional Lambic that is back sweetened with candi sugar before bottling. I like big puckering sours and wilds but the sweetness to a faro is very nice aswell.

If you like the Lindemann's, try to find some clones of New Glarus Wisconsin Belgian Red or their Raspberry Tart. They only distribute in WI but they have a soft tartness from the fruit more that from wild bacteria and other critters.
 
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