No Chill vs Chill in the Fermenter

After spending nearly two hours and two trips to the gas station for ice to chill my first All Grain BIAB, I am ready to explore a No Chill method. Actually, what I was thinking of doing is just dumping the wort into the fermenter directly, and allowing it to chill over night. I'd then aerate and pitch the following night.

My reasoning:
1. Traditional "No Chill" requires a cube that has to be cleaned and sanitized.
1a. I am lazy.
2. I am not going to be storing my wort for more than a day before pitching.
3. Hot side aeration appears to only be a real concern for large commercial breweries and not homebrewers.

Note that 3 is probably redundant as even the wiki for No Chill doesn't mention anything about HSA being an advantage of that method. I am just mentioning this because it was the first thing that came to mind before I starting looking into No Chill.

How come I don't read much about over night chilling in fermenters? Am I missing something that could potentially effect my beer if I "no chill" in a fermenter? Also, is there a keen term for "no chill in a fermenter"?

Thanks in advance!

Don't do that into glass. It will shatter.

I think the main concern is that is when the wort is most susceptible to contamination and the quicker one gets the yeast working the less the chance of anything else taking over.

That and to lock in hop goodness.

I do exactly that. I brew, do a quick whirlpool and then straight into my 10g stainless fermentor. You cannot do it with glass or plastic for obvious reasons. I actually forgot I wasn't using my stainless fermentor once and melted a better bottle. Silly me right?

Anyhow I dump some star-san into my fermentor shake it around and let it sit while I brew. Then just before flame out I dump the sanitizer back into a bucket and cap the fermentor waiting to receive wort. Then I do what I described above. I let the fermentor sit for a good 12-18 hours then I chuck in my yeast. As mentioned in the no-chill thread this gives me the option for a real wort starter. In the case of high gravity beers I dilute down to approximately 1.040 and then go with it. Sometimes I decant the starter sometimes I chuck the whole thing in, which is dependent on how delicate the beer is flavored.

I have a plastic true brew fermenter. I've read that some of these can withstand 180 degree F temperatures. Could I chill the wort down to say 150 and safely dump it into my plastic fermenter?

Thanks for the infos!

FYI Better Bottle max temp is 140F.

I personally chill to 100F then throw it in the fermenter to chill overnight and pitch the yeast in the morning.

I on occasion will do no chill batches and I just dump it into my Fermenator. Ill wit about 24 hours or so and add the yeast. Done deal.

wedge421 said:

I on occasion will do no chill batches and I just dump it into my Fermenator. Ill wit about 24 hours or so and add the yeast. Done deal.

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What kind of fermenter do you have, and what would you say the temperature of the wort is when you dump it in?

The cube is super simple to clean, and can withstand heat. It also gives you a chance to aerate the batch by pouring the cooled wort from the cube to the fermenter.

To clean my cube, I immediately fill it with water and Oxyclean after dumping the wort into the fermenter. I let it sit like that until my next brew session. While my wort is boiling, I dump the Oxyclean solution, rinse, and add some Starsan. I slosh around the Starsan and let it sit. I then empty it prior to filling it with boiling wort. Repeat.

dantheman13 said:

I have a plastic true brew fermenter. I've read that some of these can withstand 180 degree F temperatures. Could I chill the wort down to say 150 and safely dump it into my plastic fermenter?

Thanks for the infos!

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Looks like I found an answer to my question about plastic fermenter temperatures: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/fermenter-bucket-max-temp-165830/

Thanks for all the feedback, guys! I will keep the cube in mind if I feel the fermenter route isn't working out.

For what it is worth...

I've dumped near 180 wort (I'd guess 180 as I didn't measure on that batch) into my VittlesVault that I use for fermenting

It didn't melt/deform or otherwise do any visible harm

Beer tasted fine and I'm still alive after drinking it.

JayInJersey said:

For what it is worth...

I've dumped near 180 wort (I'd guess 180 as I didn't measure on that batch) into my VittlesVault that I use for fermenting

It didn't melt/deform or otherwise do any visible harm

Beer tasted fine and I'm still alive after drinking it.

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Hence the name, "Hazard Brewing"?

Thanks. This is my plan for the next batch.

I've always done no-chill.. I didn't have a chiller when I started and from my research, alot of Aussies don't either. I gave it a shot, and loved the results.. can't tell the difference.
The one time I tried to do a side by side, I got an infection in the chilled batch (running wort through a copper pipe in ice water) not sure what caused it.. but it was pretty nasty

Just be sure not to tell people at your homebrew club that you no chill... they'll look at you like you just said " I like dudes"

joeybeer said:

Just be sure not to tell people at your homebrew club that you no chill... they'll look at you like you just said " I like dudes"

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Thanks. I have a feeling there is a lot of that. I probably won't admit to BIAB either, lol!

Actually, I could really care less. If people want to know, I will tell them. The main thing I want is good tasting beer.

If you warm the glass first, a carboy ought to be just fine to use. You might have to fill it a couple times with hotter water each time, but I don't see why it wouldn't work. You'll only risk breakage if you add hot wort to a cold carboy.

Or, if you have two pots, do your boil in one, and set the other on the stove with a carboy partway full of water. Warm it up for a 1/2 hour or so while you boil. Sanitize, add wort. Just keep some over mitts handy to move it around afterwards.

I run straight from the boil kettle boiling wort into corny kegs and get around to fermenting the wort when I have time. I brew when I want to and keep the fermenters going as well. I have 20 gallons of wort to ferment right now, 8 kegs in the keezer and 8 empty kegs. I better start emptying something because I want to brew on saturday.

Onthekeg- great idea !! I'll have to work that into my pipeline ! I only have one fridge so when I bring it to ferm temps I want it full !!

Another idea that sounds crazy but I've heard works is just to kill the heat and leave the wort in the kettle with the lid on until it gets to "carboy safe" temps, probably only a couple of hours ...

I boil in a 5.5 gal (real capacity) pressure cooker, so when I'm done I sanitize the lid and lock it on. The next morning I siphon to my bucket, aerate, and pitch.

I tried to ice bath 5 gal one time and it took 4 hours to get to 85*. No way in hell I ever pitch above 65* again, so I ended up having to wait overnight anyway.

Always let it cool to pitch temps. If you can find yourself some kegs you can keep your beer in stainless all its life! Pinlocks are perfect actually, I think they seal better.

I tried to use an immersion chiller twice, and gave up, about 30 brews ago (and 18 months). In the summer, I drain the hot wort into the brewbucket, lock the lid on, and put it in the house over one of the AC vents on the floor. Brew buckets are good up to 200F (and some people use a heat stick to boil wort in them).

I usually cover the airlock hole with a paper towel soaked in starsan.

The rest of the year I put a lid on my e-keggle and let it cool in the garage for 24 hours to pitch temp.

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So, how about clarity? On my first BIAB All Grain, I chilled for 2 hours, and a lot of the proteins and hops settled to the bottom of the kettle during that chill period. I strained it into my fermenter, and had a whole lot of trub left over.

Does pouring the wort directly from the kettle, through a strainer and directly into the fermenter cause the resulting beer to be any more hazy than it would be if no chilled in a cube first, then racked to the fermenter?

I have not experienced increased haze. The same proteins fall out, it just happens slower and they are in smaller pieces than when rapid cooling I think. Not that I have really seen anyone make a claim to the contrary, but, the brewery I intern at whirlpools then goes through a heat exchanger into the fermentor. That does essentially the very same thing we're doing by no chilling into the fermentor. All the proteins that would otherwise fall out of solution end up in their 100bbl conical just like it does in our no chill 5-10g batches.

I no chill all the time.. I also can't do full boils so I mix up my runnings and split it into 2 3gal boils splitting all my additions.. From the boil straight to the bucket.. I also parti-gyle wich makes for a long day.. My flame out additions I add when the wort gets to 180.. What ever you do don't tell the guys at the LHBS because they will try to talk you out of it because of what could happen and push there stuff onto you.. It's fun when you let a 30yr brewmaster try your brew and he says it's one of the best in the group.. I walk away with a smile... I don't get chill haze and it is very clear with regular finning additions for my lighter styles.. Did I mention I just dump everything into my pale, hops, break and at boiling temps... I let them cool over night and aerate and pitch the next day...

Anyone ever have any problem with Dimethyl Sulfide with chilling in the fermenter, or with no-chill in general? I've seen folks claim that chilling wort slowly can produce extra DMS.

edmanster said:

I no chill all the time.. I also can't do full boils so I mix up my runnings and split it into 2 3gal boils splitting all my additions.. From the boil straight to the bucket.. I also parti-gyle wich makes for a long day.. My flame out additions I add when the wort gets to 180.. What ever you do don't tell the guys at the LHBS because they will try to talk you out of it because of what could happen and push there stuff onto you.. It's fun when you let a 30yr brewmaster try your brew and he says it's one of the best in the group.. I walk away with a smile... I don't get chill haze and it is very clear with regular finning additions for my lighter styles.. Did I mention I just dump everything into my pale, hops, break and at boiling temps... I let them cool over night and aerate and pitch the next day...

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Wow, that's pretty cool, especially the part about dumping everything in there! Do you cold crash your fermenter before bottling or kegging?

dantheman13 said:

Wow, that's pretty cool, especially the part about dumping everything in there! Do you cold crash your fermenter before bottling or kegging?

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Only the really light beers that I feed my BMC friends trying to convert them.. I only keg now too cause the bottles I fill off the kegs are sediment free.. Mostly I use a paint strainer on my siphon but for the most part the yeast cake is like cement and nothing gets moved around only the day before I keg when I move the primary to the kitchen table. They come out really clear..

Oh and I do always plan for blow off because the yeast really stir things up and it sticks to the krausen and it just keeps rising...lol

Thanks for the responses.

dantheman13 said:

Anyone ever have any problem with Dimethyl Sulfide with chilling in the fermenter, or with no-chill in general? I've seen folks claim that chilling wort slowly can produce extra DMS.

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Do a 90 minute boil and you will never have an DMS issue with no chill.

edmanster said:

I no chill all the time.. I also can't do full boils so I mix up my runnings and split it into 2 3gal boils splitting all my additions.. From the boil straight to the bucket.. I also parti-gyle wich makes for a long day.. My flame out additions I add when the wort gets to 180.. What ever you do don't tell the guys at the LHBS because they will try to talk you out of it because of what could happen and push there stuff onto you.. It's fun when you let a 30yr brewmaster try your brew and he says it's one of the best in the group.. I walk away with a smile... I don't get chill haze and it is very clear with regular finning additions for my lighter styles.. Did I mention I just dump everything into my pale, hops, break and at boiling temps... I let them cool over night and aerate and pitch the next day...

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That is pretty awesome. I dont have the balls to do a full on no chill dump yet. I still filter out everything going into the bucket.

I mostly do a full on chill dump. With the exception of what hops remain in the hop bag all the hop dust that escapes the bag goes into my fermentor. Brewing this "lazy" way makes brewing so much more fun.

I have a spigot on my BK with some silicone tubing attached. So once the boil is finished I just throw the tubing into my fermenting bucket that has my wort chiller already in there. I run cold water through the wort chiller and it takes about 30 minutes for it to get down to 70 degrees or so.

I splash the wort back into the BK to aerate it a bit, then I throw my tubing into my carboy and turn on the spigot again. Shake up the carboy and pitch the yeast. Shake it once more, and throw on the air lock and leave it alone.

First of all I've never done no chill brewing but I was just reading these post and have a question. onthekeg said that he throws his right into the corny which makes sense to me. If you were going to leave it for couple of days should you charge it with CO2?

I only tried to chill the first 2 brews (almost 2 years ago), the next 40+ batches were BIAB no chill.

In the winter, I let it chill in the e-keggle in the garage (with a lid) overnight.

In the summer, it goes from boiling to the ferment bucket and then inside next to an AC vent. Usually takes 24 hours to reach room temp.

I usually pull a quart off the boil kettle early on and put it in the freezer for an hour, and use it for a starter.

RugenBrau said:

First of all I've never done no chill brewing but I was just reading these post and have a question. onthekeg said that he throws his right into the corny which makes sense to me. If you were going to leave it for couple of days should you charge it with CO2?

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What is your reasoning to possibly charge it with CO2? We want oxygen in the wort before fermentation, so that isn't an issue. Is there another reason you were thinking of?

BTW, thanks for bumping this. I have an update, sorta. I brewed my last batch using edmanster's methods. After the boil, I put in my late hop additions, and I did a short water bath to get the temperature down to 175F. This only took 10 minutes if even that. I then dumped my hot wort into my plastic fermenter, and sealed it with an airlock. I stuck it in my fermenting freezer, and left it over night. The next day, I pitched some S05.

The beer is bottled now, and tasted (and looked) great at bottling time. It is a CDA though, so clarity won't be a factor, but the beer did look clear in the tubing as I bottled. There was quite a bit more hop material at the bottom of the fermenter than my last batch which was brewed with a very similar recipe (and chilled with an ice bath), but this beer smelled much better. I just hope there isn't too much grassy flavor from the hop material when the beer matures (none detectable at bottling time). I did let this ferment in the primary for about 4 weeks, so I am a little worried about the hop material giving it a grassy taste.

I had another problem with this beer that is unrelated to no chill. I won't go into great detail since it is off subject, but it is worth mentioning just in case the beer has flavor issues... for some reason my mash didn't extract nearly enough sugar, and my mash gravity was way off. I should have extended my mash time looking back now, but instead I chose to add some DME after the boil to bring the gravity up to where it should have been. Oh well.

I only did a 60 minute boil, so we'll see if there is any detectable DMS flavor. Of course, with a CDA, that probably won't be a factor.

Thanks again for all the responses here!

I've done no chill once, on a berliner weisse. It was an authentic, mash hopped, no boil, single decoction berliner weisse, with no chill. My hose I use for chilling suffered a catastrophic failure, and so I ran off right into my boil kettle, and brought the wort up to 180. Threw the lid on, and killed the heat. I left it right in the pot for ~24 hours, and then racked into a fermentor and pitched my lacto culture.

I've not detected any DMS in this beer at all. It actually tastes phenomenal right now. Can't wait to get it kegged and carbed.

If you no chill in the kettle then you don't have to worry about handling hot wort or a cube. You just pop on a sanitized lid and let it sit for 18 to 24 hours. The hops and trub fall to tbe bottom and then you can siphon or just dump into your carboy or bucket. I've been doing that for over a year now. No clarity issues and no dms in around 25 batches.

Seriously, why handle boiling hot sugar water if you don't have to?

nutty_gnome said:

If you no chill in the kettle then you don't have to worry about handling hot wort or a cube. You just pop on a sanitized lid and let it sit for 18 to 24 hours. The hops and trub fall to tbe bottom and then you can siphon or just dump into your carboy or bucket. I've been doing that for over a year now. No clarity issues and no dms in around 25 batches.

Seriously, why handle boiling hot sugar water if you don't have to?

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This is what I do. I leave behind a lot of hops & crud in my BK ... so now I just make sure I have ~ 0.5 gallons more of run off during sparge, so I get a full fermenter.
My only issue is that it postpones clean up of the BK.

nutty_gnome said:

If you no chill in the kettle then you don't have to worry about handling hot wort or a cube. You just pop on a sanitized lid and let it sit for 18 to 24 hours. The hops and trub fall to tbe bottom and then you can siphon or just dump into your carboy or bucket. I've been doing that for over a year now. No clarity issues and no dms in around 25 batches.

Seriously, why handle boiling hot sugar water if you don't have to?

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Ok, I'll admit it. I have done the 4-5 batches no chill in the kettle, and then ferment right in the kettle. Basicly I just put a sanitized lid on the kettle and when below say 80 degrees I put it in my chest freezer/fermenator to bring it down to temperature. Once chilled I pitch yeast and ferment in the kettle w/ the lid on. Usually I cover the lidded pot w/ a thightly secured plastic bag after the initial ferment. After 10-12 days I cold crash and rack to a keg. Beer hasn't suffered and I have increased flameout and dryhop additions to counter the no-chill. Very simple

wilserbrewer said:

Ok, I'll admit it. I have done the 4-5 batches no chill in the kettle, and then ferment right in the kettle. Basicly I just put a sanitized lid on the kettle and when below say 80 degrees I put it in my chest freezer/fermenator to bring it down to temperature. Once chilled I pitch yeast and ferment in the kettle w/ the lid on. Usually I cover the lidded pot w/ a thightly secured plastic bag after the initial ferment. After 10-12 days I cold crash and rack to a keg. Beer hasn't suffered and I have increased flameout and dryhop additions to counter the no-chill. Very simple

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Wow, that takes equipment costs down! Don't think I'd do it since I like to have more than one thing fermenting at once, but good on you. Is your pot large enough to not get krausen pouring out on a vigorous fermentation?

My method has been similar to what others have said. After boil, water bath until under ~140, then pour through sanitized double mesh colander into my Ale Pale. I put the lid on (no airlock since the wort might suck in the water/vodka) and set my ferm fridge to the temperature. When it hits ferm temps I pitch yeast (normally 8+ hours). My next batch I'm going to water bath, colander over bottling bucket, then let that drop from counter height into ale pale through the spigot. Thanks dfc for that idea. Should provide great aeration and if I turn off the AC it'll minimize any possible infections from air microbes.

midfielder5 said:

This is what I do. I leave behind a lot of hops & crud in my BK ... so now I just make sure I have ~ 0.5 gallons more of run off during sparge, so I get a full fermenter.
My only issue is that it postpones clean up of the BK.

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Aha! I knew I wasn't the only one. Thank you kind sir for being a kindred spirit.