Coleman Xtreme too much?

quixand · Oct 13, 2009

I plan on going all grain, and I had created a Mash tun from a 70 quart Coleman Xtreme a couple years ago that has been sitting in my closet now.

My question is...for 5 gallon...(total 6.5 gallon of wort before boil) batches is this too large? I may end up doing 10 gallon batches down the road, so I'd like to have the flexibility...but am worried about there being too much head space.

Dog House Brew · Oct 13, 2009

You are fine

quixand · Oct 13, 2009

Very nice. =) Thank You.

Yuri_Rage · Oct 13, 2009

It's fine as long as you batch sparge. Fly sparging such a small volume in that cooler will likely not work well.

Lupy · Oct 13, 2009

My 5-6gal batches have been totally doable, convenient and effective in this cooler.
You may not want to add water that is too much more than 185*F as my xstream seems to have warped during my first AG attempts with the use of 190*+ 'preheat' water. Still works though.

shortyjacobs · Oct 13, 2009

FYI, https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-big-your-mash-tun-needs-123585/

Edit, hey go me! I answered the exact opposite of your question! sorry, I think i need more beer :drunk:

oswegan · Oct 13, 2009

quixand said:
I plan on going all grain, and I had created a Mash tun from a 70 quart Coleman Xtreme a couple years ago that has been sitting in my closet now.

My question is...for 5 gallon...(total 6.5 gallon of wort before boil) batches is this too large? I may end up doing 10 gallon batches down the road, so I'd like to have the flexibility...but am worried about there being too much head space.

No way, I use one for 5-7 gallon batches all the time. It rocks. And you can ramp it up to 12 gallon batches really easily.

EvilTOJ · Oct 14, 2009

Nope, I have that exact same cooler and I've made 5 gallon batches in it just fine. I also make 10 gallon batches in it too.

Kauai_Kahuna · Oct 14, 2009

I use one, batch sparge, never a problem and I like it becuase the total cost was dirt cheap compared to other options.
As Yuri pointed out, the bed may be a little thin to effectively fly sparge on a low gravity 5 gallon batch.

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

Man you guys are awesome. I plan on batch sparging..so this is fantastic news!

I currently have a cpvc manifold in it now....one that I'm not entirely happy with...do you guys recommend a stainless steel braid for this one?

janzik · Oct 14, 2009

quixand said:
Man you guys are awesome. I plan on batch sparging..so this is fantastic news!

I currently have a cpvc manifold in it now....one that I'm not entirely happy with...do you guys recommend a stainless steel braid for this one?

My father and I both use the Coleman Xtreme 70qt. When we built mine we did a manifold, not realizing it was only needed for fly sparging. When he did his he did just a single stick of copper. Either of those or the braid will work.

I personally don't like the idea of the braid, because I've worried about doing larger grain bills and the grain crushing it, but that could be unfounded worry. I think there are a bunch of people who have done a whole lot of batches with the braid with no problems.

I've never used cpvc, what makes you unhappy about it? It will probably work out as well.

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

No reason to dislike the cpvc really...it just seems in the past 2 years, the hobby has evolved, and the SS braid is the common choice of most mash tuns. So if everyone is adopting it, there must be a reason no?

I mean, I already have it built....so I suppose the easiest solution is to roll with what I've got now. Now to find a pot large enough for 5 gallon AG full boils of 6.5 gallons.

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

For those of you using this beast, what is your rate of absorption?

I'll obviously calculate mine with the numbers I get after I brew, but I'd like a ballpark so my first brew isn't a total waste. LOL

janzik · Oct 14, 2009

quixand said:
For those of you using this beast, what is your rate of absorption?

I'll obviously calculate mine with the numbers I get after I brew, but I'd like a ballpark so my first brew isn't a total waste. LOL

Absorption as in in how much liquid gets stuck behind in the grains? Or do you mean the dead space? I at one time did a dead space experiment, I think it was a pint or two that I had. I really need to do that again, because my memory fails me here.

If you're referring to the grain absorption, does the MLT really matter? I'm not sure.. hmm... I wonder if something with a bigger footprint (like the Coleman Xtreme 70qt) helps the grain absorb more since it would be a more shallow grain bed compared to a keggle or big orange cylinder.

My next brew, I'll follow up with my results...

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

janzik said:
Absorption as in in how much liquid gets stuck behind in the grains? Or do you mean the dead space? I at one time did a dead space experiment, I think it was a pint or two that I had. I really need to do that again, because my memory fails me here.

If you're referring to the grain absorption, does the MLT really matter? I'm not sure.. hmm... I wonder if something with a bigger footprint (like the Coleman Xtreme 70qt) helps the grain absorb more since it would be a more shallow grain bed compared to a keggle or big orange cylinder.

My next brew, I'll follow up with my results...

Many thanks Joe. I'll post mine from this weekend to compare. I plan on brewing up BM's Centennial Blonde.

What is the rate of absorption you factor in to your batch sparging presuming you use this method.

janzik · Oct 14, 2009

quixand said:
Many thanks Joe. I'll post mine from this weekend to compare. I plan on brewing up BM's Centennial Blonde.

What is the rate of absorption you factor in to your batch sparging presuming you use this method.

What I actually do is, after I total my first runnings, I then take that amount and subtract it from my desired boil volume. I split that by 2 and do my 2 batch sparges. If I ever come up short, I may do a third tiny sparge. This is usually due to bad estimation of what I'm sparging with (I'm generally pretty careless/lazy when I dump in my sparge amounts, because I'm scooping the water out of one of my brew pots with a pyrex pitcher and just eyeball it the best I can to the 1 quart line)

I think I started doing it that way because I never setup the absorption rate in BeerSmith. I'll have to try that out and see what I can figure. I wonder how much it differs depending on what type of grain/oats you are using.

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

janzik said:
What I actually do is, after I total my first runnings, I then take that amount and subtract it from my desired boil volume. I split that by 2 and do my 2 batch sparges. If I ever come up short, I may do a third tiny sparge. This is usually due to bad estimation of what I'm sparging with (I'm generally pretty careless/lazy when I dump in my sparge amounts, because I'm scooping the water out of one of my brew pots with a pyrex pitcher and just eyeball it the best I can to the 1 quart line)

I think I started doing it that way because I never setup the absorption rate in BeerSmith. I'll have to try that out and see what I can figure. I wonder how much it differs depending on what type of grain/oats you are using.

All very interesting things to consider I suppose. LOL
I guess the more info you could put into Beersmith, the more usual?

I'll wing it the first batch as you suggested. And take all my measurements to put into Beersmith. Your method should get me close enough, which is ultimately, my primary goal for my first AG brew.

Dog House Brew · Oct 14, 2009

My grain absorbtion is figured @ .16

quixand · Oct 14, 2009

Dog House Brew said:
My grain absorbtion is figured @ .16

Sorry for the noob question, is that 16%? Or.... 0.16%?

oswegan · Oct 14, 2009

quixand said:
Man you guys are awesome. I plan on batch sparging..so this is fantastic news!

I currently have a cpvc manifold in it now....one that I'm not entirely happy with...do you guys recommend a stainless steel braid for this one?

I recommend copper tubing and a hacksaw! Seriously.

See Palmer's design Figure 165:

http://www.howtobrew.com/appendices/appendixD-1.html

Hacksaw slits on the bottom of the long pieces about 3/4-1 inch apart, a little less than half way through the pipes. Squeeze the fittings with pliers to tighten but do not solder (easier to clean if you can take it apart).

Dog House Brew · Oct 14, 2009

quixand said:
Sorry for the noob question, is that 16%? Or.... 0.16%?

10lbs of grain X .16 = 1.6 gallons absorbtion. It it system, crush specific. Some get .20, but my system is .16. You will have to brew and watch your system. I thinks starting at .20 is a good starting point and fine tune from there. I use a 100qt Extreme with a 1/2" single pipe running the length of the tun. The pipe has a bazillion 1/4" holes drilled in it and then I covered it with a long piece of stainless braid. Works OK, but I may go to a 6 pipe copper manifold to fly sparge. :mug:

Coleman Xtreme too much?

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