Forced carb three kegs

Yesterday one at a time.....set to 35 psi and rocked the kegs back and forth periodically after a couple purge pulls on the top....did this for Two to five minutes each.

Put in keezer set to 38 and set the three kegs to 12 psi let sit over for 48 hrs....took a sample still a little flat across the board the dba tasted close and the Pliny clone wasn't as hoppy as expected.....the blind pig seemed a little off not sour still had a beer taste but was extremely flat.....should I change the psi? The kegs are for the Super Bowl so they have almost a week left at 38.

Do I need to force carb them longer? What psi for serving? Buddy said 12 psi....worried the blind pig isn't going to turn out well :-/

All sat in primary ferm for two weeks then dry hop addition for another full 7 days then transferred and filtered through a sanitized mesh hop bag into kegs that were soaked in pbw rinsed then sprayed down with star San.

If I am trying to quickly carb I normally set the PSI at about 30-35 for 24 hours and then let sit a few days at serving pressure. That normally does the trick for me. Alternatively 10 days at serving pressure normally does it for me. And serving pressure depends on your beer temp/desired volumes of co2/line length. I have 10' lines and keep my beer around 38 degrees. I serve around 11 for most styles and that gets me a good pour.

My burst carbing procedure:

1. CO2 purge the keg
2. Fill the keg with cold-crashed beer
3. purge the headspace 11-15 times at 30 PSI
4. Set the regulator to 45 PSI
5. Let it sit at cold temperatures with gas on at 45 PSI for 18 hours
6. Disconnect the gas line and purge all head pressure
7. Reconnect the gas line and set it at serving pressure (~12 PSI), be sure to leave the gas on
8. Wait 3-5 days
9. Enjoy your beer

This is where I get my reasons for purging so much, thanks to doug293cz

Oye then I need to up the psi when I get home....I didn't cold crash the beer....but I can up the psi when I get home and then revisit in 24 hrs....

Why such a high psi? I thought 20-25 psi was enough for force carbing after a few days.

Oventoasted said:

Why such a high psi? I thought 20-25 psi was enough for force carbing after a few days.

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Over a few days it is, but it depends on how quick you want it carbed. Some people do 40 for a day and some let it sit at serving pressure for two weeks. Everyone does something different. It is just what works for you in the amount of time you're comfortable with.

Oventoasted said:

Why such a high psi? I thought 20-25 psi was enough for force carbing after a few days.

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Exactly what BigMack said, higher pressure = less time, less pressure = more time.

so crank it up to 35 psi and let it sit for 24 hrs?

GJOCONNELL said:

so crank it up to 35 psi and let it sit for 24 hrs?

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Yep that would work just fine.

The whole purpose of the "burst carb" method is to force a large amount of CO2 into solution quickly. It doesn't matter if its slightly too much or slightly too little. Then when you set it to the desired carbonation level and it will slowly balance out the carbonation to the correct level. (It will add carbonation if it's too low, or allow carbonation to decrease if its overcarbed).

The thing you want to avoid is vastly over or under carbonating it with the burst.

If its not enough, it will take a week or more to reach the correct level at serving pressure (no biggie really).

But if its way too much, then you'll end up with over carbonated beer that can't lose the co2 in solution unless you purge the keg several times (a real PITA).

TheMadKing said:

Yep that would work just fine.

The whole purpose of the "burst carb" method is to force a large amount of CO2 into solution quickly. It doesn't matter if its slightly too much or slightly too little. Then when you set it to the desired carbonation level and it will slowly balance out the carbonation to the correct level. (It will add carbonation if it's too low, or allow carbonation to decrease if its overcarbed).

The thing you want to avoid is vastly over or under carbonating it with the burst.

If its not enough, it will take a week or more to reach the correct level at serving pressure (no biggie really).

But if its way too much, then you'll end up with over carbonated beer that can't lose the co2 in solution unless you purge the keg several times (a real PITA).

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Well I got home tonight and two of the kegs had zero pressure in the keezer.

I pulled out the co2 tank and re-tightened everything down. Put clamps on all the connections. Re-tigthened everything on the 3 way distributor a couple things seemed a little loose.

Turned the psi up to 35 and one of the ball lock connectors popped off. So I had to cut the tubing and re-clamp down. I set the psi to 26 psi and I am going to leave overnight as it was cold outside and I was tired of fiddling with stuff and didn't want to risk blowing the line off again @ 35 psi.

Going to let things sit overnight @ 26 psi and check tomorrow. Hope everything is holding pressure. It sounded like things were bubbling in the two tanks which I expected just hope things get going solid tomorrow.

I guess I cold crashed the two kegs without intending to do it @ 38 f for two days.....ugh I should have checked all the connections on the keezer when I picked it up.

Also it seems like the reg. tank pressure gauge isn't working it didn't really move but the outflow seems to be working.

The tank pressure gauge won't move until the tank is empty if you want to know how much co2 is in your tank, you'll have to weigh it and subtract the tare weight that's stamped on the bottle.

Your connections should not be popping off that easily though. I routinely turn my pressure up to 45PSI and I've never had anything fail except for a party tap handle. So if you connectors are popping off, make sure you have the right kind of hose, the right size hose clamps, and that everything is as tight as you can get it.

You can also use Star San to check for leaks. Spray it on all your connections and if you see moving bubbles, there's a leak. Teflon tape is also your friend in fixing leaks, and long handled wrenches. Some of my connections need to be stupidly tight.

I'm also not sure what you mean by "it sounds like things are bubbling." There shouldn't be sounds coming from your kegs at all. If you hear bubbling, you probably have a leak somewhere.

Crap that was not what I wanted to hear not bubbling per se but the sound of co2 flowing to the kegs.....the psi was holding steady at 26 Crap I guess we will find out......

I bought the keezer from Craigslist so I am using the lines that came with it same with the reg and 3 way distributor what kind should it be and size I can pick up fresh line and clamps for everything tomorrow.

Something just dawned on me tonight....i didn't have nor use a dip tube cleaning brush on any of the corny kegs that came refurbished. I did let soak in pbw overnight then rinsed several times then sprayed down the inside with star San. I didn't have a dip tube brush and do to this being my first brew set and kegging didn't know about the dip tube brush period.

Given that I already kegged should I remove the dip tube and clean out with a brush or are all three fubared at this point?

Won't make this mistake again.

GJOCONNELL said:

Something just dawned on me tonight....i didn't have nor use a dip tube cleaning brush on any of the corny kegs that came refurbished. I did let soak in pbw overnight then rinsed several times then sprayed down the inside with star San. I didn't have a dip tube brush and do to this being my first brew set and kegging didn't know about the dip tube brush period.

Given that I already kegged should I remove the dip tube and clean out with a brush or are all three fubared at this point?

Won't make this mistake again.

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I wouldn't worry about that if you soaked in pbw, rinsed, and sanitized. I don't own one and have never had a problem.

TheMadKing said:

I wouldn't worry about that if you soaked in pbw, rinsed, and sanitized. I don't own one and have never had a problem.

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I pulled the one dip tube on the keg that is flat and the dip tube line was spotless and showed no signs of trub, clogging, in fact it was spotless. I went ahead and sprayed everything down with star san and let sit before re-installing.

Maybe it is the ring on the lid I will replace and report back once I have more c02.

GJOCONNELL said:

I pulled the one dip tube on the keg that is flat and the dip tube line was spotless and showed no signs of trub, clogging, in fact it was spotless. I went ahead and sprayed everything down with star san and let sit before re-installing.

Maybe it is the ring on the lid I will replace and report back once I have more c02.

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I'm slightly confused about what's going on at this point.

Did you establish that your kegs are leaking? and did you run out of CO2 because of it?

TheMadKing said:

I'm slightly confused about what's going on at this point.

Did you establish that your kegs are leaking? and did you run out of CO2 because of it?

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I took a step back and realized I don't know where it is leaking from I guessed it was from the keg because the other two kegs are holding pressure (I pulled the release and both still had pressure). The third did not. So I want to rule out leaks from the dist. system and start with fresh clamps and hose.

So I think there is a leak on the third keg either in the line or on the lid/somewhere.

So I am going to check the lid to ensure it is sealing, then poppets after ensuring all the lines for gas are good.

If you want to see if the keg leaks, just pressurize it while its empty to a certain PSI, and let it sit overnight. Then with your co2 tank off, hook it back up and check to see what the pressure is. If it isnt what you pressurized it to, its the keg. If it is, keep going upstream.

I would also suggest using teflon tape on any screw connections you have on all of the distributor fittings, regulator fittings, tank fitting, and if you have any MFL connections on your disconnects. That can prevent a lot of problems...

+1 to everything Furore said, plus you can find keg leaks much faster by pressurizing them to 25-30 PSI and liberally spraying all the seams down with star san. If there's bubbles coming out at any of the seams, it's leaking.

Furore said:

If you want to see if the keg leaks, just pressurize it while its empty to a certain PSI, and let it sit overnight. Then with your co2 tank off, hook it back up and check to see what the pressure is. If it isnt what you pressurized it to, its the keg. If it is, keep going upstream.

I would also suggest using teflon tape on any screw connections you have on all of the distributor fittings, regulator fittings, tank fitting, and if you have any MFL connections on your disconnects. That can prevent a lot of problems...

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Roger....I will try the above approach the only difference all the kegs have beer in them.....lol....

GJOCONNELL said:

Roger....I will try the above approach the only difference all the kegs have beer in them.....lol....

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It won't work if the kegs have beer in them because the beer will just absorb the CO2 and you can't tell whether its leaking out or going into solution.

You're better off pressurizing and spraying or dripping star san around the lid and gas posts.

good point....

Furore said:

If you want to see if the keg leaks, just pressurize it while its empty to a certain PSI, and let it sit overnight. Then with your co2 tank off, hook it back up and check to see what the pressure is. If it isnt what you pressurized it to, its the keg. If it is, keep going upstream.

I would also suggest using teflon tape on any screw connections you have on all of the distributor fittings, regulator fittings, tank fitting, and if you have any MFL connections on your disconnects. That can prevent a lot of problems...

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Do not use teflon tape on any fittings that use a washer MFL, regulator to tank. beer line to shank. It is the washer that seals not the threads.

PapaO

TheMadKing said:

It won't work if the kegs have beer in them because the beer will just absorb the CO2 and you can't tell whether its leaking out or going into solution.

You're better off pressurizing and spraying or dripping star san around the lid and gas posts.

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So I picked up a fresh c02 tank and a spare just in case. I spoke to the guy at the shop and his trick was to hold the lid open and lift the keg and then turn on the co2 and let the co2 do the lid seating.

Then spray with star san around all the connections (which I did no bubbles). What I did notice was the pressure relief valve when pulled hissed ever so slight. I tried to replace with one of the three replacements I picked up but it didn't fit the style. Removed the pressure relief added a little lube to the o ring and that seemed to do the trick.

Cranked the psi to 35 psi and let it sit for 1 hr. Disconnected and let it sit overnight and woot it still had pressure in the morning! A good amount too. So I hooked up the other kegs without the issue and left @ 35 psi and closed the lid.

Praying the Co2 isn't empty when I get home! I think I need to replace the lid or try to find the correct pressure relief replacement. Oh yeah I did replace all the o-rings and some sanitary lube.

Sounds like you may have found out the issue OP. Good luck come Sunday! From a force carb perspective there's no need to roll kegs etc....just put at 30PSI for 48h, then purge and hook back up at around 8-10 PSI and serve. As said, you might find your perfect pour slightly different (my system is best b/w 6-8 psi, other people around 10-12 psi...just depends) so just tweak it till you find the sweet spot.

TheMadKing said:

My burst carbing procedure:

1. CO2 purge the keg
2. Fill the keg with cold-crashed beer
3. purge the headspace 11-15 times at 30 PSI
4. Set the regulator to 45 PSI
5. Let it sit at cold temperatures with gas on at 45 PSI for 18 hours
6. Disconnect the gas line and purge all head pressure
7. Reconnect the gas line and set it at serving pressure (~12 PSI), be sure to leave the gas on
8. Wait 3-5 days
9. Enjoy your beer

This is where I get my reasons for purging so much, thanks to doug293cz

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Interesting. I have always just purged at 10 PSI 3 times before cranking to 30psi to force carb for 48 hr, then purge and hook at 8psi. Never noticed even a hint of oxygenation in my beers. Not even a RIS I had keg condition for 3 months before serving.

ballsy said:

Interesting. I have always just purged at 10 PSI 3 times before cranking to 30psi to force carb for 48 hr, then purge and hook at 8psi. Never noticed even a hint of oxygenation in my beers. Not even a RIS I had keg condition for 3 months before serving.

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I've mostly seen a difference in hops flavors. Oxygenation starts as more of a blunting or softening of hops flavors than an actual flavor of its own. A RIS can actually benefit from small amounts of oxygenation, since that's what occurs during the barrel aging process (slow oxygenation)

Praise be the kegs were all holding @ 35 psi @ 38f.....I bought a spare lid just in case I have issues down the line.

GJOCONNELL said:

Praise be the kegs were all holding @ 35 psi @ 38f.....I bought a spare lid just in case I have issues down the line.

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Awesome! Glad to hear its all fixed, now carbonate some beer, you've earned a few

TheMadKing said:

Awesome! Glad to hear its all fixed, now carbonate some beer, you've earned a few

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Once I get to 48 hrs @ 35 psi. Do I just turn down the psi to 10-12 psi to get the serving psi or do I give the relief valves a couple tugs after turning the co2 off then setting to 10-12 psi?

GJOCONNELL said:

Once I get to 48 hrs @ 35 psi. Do I just turn down the psi to 10-12 psi to get the serving psi or do I give the relief valves a couple tugs after turning the co2 off then setting to 10-12 psi?

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Turn the gas off, purge all of the pressure from the keg, then set it to serving pressure.

Also, 48 hrs at 35PSI is a little long, I wouldn't go past 24 hrs myself

TheMadKing said:

Turn the gas off, purge all of the pressure from the keg, then set it to serving pressure.

Also, 48 hrs at 35PSI is a little long, I wouldn't go past 24 hrs myself

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Well crap. I did the purge and stuff and set to 11 psi. I checked the three taps and getting pretty much all foam @ 11 psi.

What is the quick fix? Need the kegs for Super bowl Sunday.

also two of the beers have a sour taste to them. If the prior lines had sour beer through them would that impart the sour taste or does the sour indicate the beer is no bueno.

I sent an email to the guy who owned the keezer before me to inquire about the lines and if they were used four sours I think as a precautionary measure I am going to just replace the lines to rule that out of the equation. The Firestone dab and the Blind pig had the sour smell and taste to them. The pliny clone was a hop bomb in your face.

I purged once more and set the psi to 10 and I am going to leave that way for the night and check tomorrow in the morning.

GJOCONNELL said:

also two of the beers have a sour taste to them. If the prior lines had sour beer through them would that impart the sour taste or does the sour indicate the beer is no bueno.

I sent an email to the guy who owned the keezer before me to inquire about the lines and if they were used four sours I think as a precautionary measure I am going to just replace the lines to rule that out of the equation. The Firestone dab and the Blind pig had the sour smell and taste to them. The pliny clone was a hop bomb in your face.

I purged once more and set the psi to 10 and I am going to leave that way for the night and check tomorrow in the morning.

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If the lines were used for sour beers and you didn't sanitize the crap out of them, your beers are likely contaminated and sour, but not bad to drink.

If you did sanitize, it's probably just carbonic bite and will fade.

Foamy beers mean that you either have over carbonated them, your lines are too short, or your serving pressure is too high for the temp.

You can shake up your keg and purge the pressure a few times to remove carbonation. And you can just turn your serving pressure down until you get a good pour if your lines are short.

Wow OP, you're really scrambling I feel for you buddy!! Hope all goes well. Just pour a few glasses and get them lines cold and your beer should settle down. I would set to 8-10 psi and shake a little and purge to get the overcarbed beer to vent.

Let it sit and purge every few hours. It'll calm down. Prolly just a little over carbed

Well how did it go?

treacheroustexan said:

Well how did it go?

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I purged for a couple hours and still was having foam issues even turning the psi down to like 2-5 psi. My brewing buddy (a long time friend who used to work in a brewery) came by before the Superbowl and said the draft lines were wayy too short so we headed out to the beer store and got 5 ft lines and after a couple beers poured it worked out okay.

Also the beers with the off taste (once the foam calmed down) actually went back to tasting normal and the guests were able to pick up the Pliny Clone, Blind Pig and the DBA (all extract kits) so that was good.

My brewing buddy brought a keg of cherry saison that was fantastic plus I picked up a bunch of IPAs from Fieldwork on Saturday while my wife raided IKEA as a backup plan.

Overall it went well considering I was freaking out the beer might suck. Not sure why the guy I bought the keezer from had such short draft lines my buddy even wondered how he was able to make it work with such short lines.

The damage to my kegs was as follows:

Pliny is about half gone so 2.5 gallons
Blind Pig about 1/4 gone
DBA half gone

My buddies Saison was nearly tapped out.

One recco my friend made was to get the CO2 out of the Keezer just for ease of use and it will allow me to use a 20 lbs bottle.

Thanks for all the guidance/help as I know I was posting fast/furious.

Glad it worked out for you!