Help With Chill

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lee_smn

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Hey Everyone,
I'm thinking about trying out no chill and would like some advice, I'm not interested in hearing about why I shouldn't do it. I live in soCal with very little rain. Watching my chiller spew perfectly good water out for 30-40 minutes makes me sick. I water my yard with it and collect it to clean equipment but don't feel this is enough. My thought is to use the immersion chiller for 5-10 minutes until the water coming out has cooled, then transfer to an ale pail to let cool overnight. I heard an Ale Pale with a blowoff tube would work, and I would fill the blowoff vessel with starsan just in case anything did get sucked in. Does anybody have any advice for me, would this work ok? Would buying a better bottle be a better alternative to the ale pale, anything else i should be thinking about as far as procedure or equipment on this?
 
I'd go all the way and do the no chill as it gives you the advantage of sanitizing the container with the heat of the wort. 30-40 minutes seems like a waste to me - you need a prechiller or you could probably stir the wort while immersed in an ice water bath and be done sooner.

Either or not both. JMO
 
Thanks, sanitizing the vessel with starsan wouldn't be enough? That 5-10 minutes get it down to close to 100deg i thought that would be advantageous.
 
Thanks, sanitizing the vessel with starsan wouldn't be enough? That 5-10 minutes get it down to close to 100deg i thought that would be advantageous.

I do something along these lines. I'd suggest a 'one piece' airlock (the 'S' shaped type - filled with vodka or starsan. These let air pass either way w/o suck-back.

I do mini-mash with partial boils, so I have what is normally the 'top -off' water boiled and added the night before, or while I'm mashing. So it gets cooled some. Maybe not hot enough to sanitize the fermentor, but I clean and sanitize it before I add anything, and I'm pitching as soon as I reach my target temperature. I'm not doing the long-term storage thing like some no-chillers. If I were to do longer term storage (days?), I'd feel better with the full heat sanitizing procedure, but I have nothing scientific to back that up.

I've been doing this in the winter months here - so it usually ~ 40-50F on my porch. I put a small desktop fan on it, and it is down to 58-60F in 5 to 8 hours. So I don't think that is a concern with good sanitation. I've also let one finish overnight in my 60F basement, no problem there either.

What I'm really liking about no-chill is that you get your wort in the fermentor, seal it up, and I feel much safer from contamination. This summer, I might supplement this with an ice bath to get the last 5-10 degrees off, but it's all sealed, so no worries (I hope!). And no messing with chillers, hoses, draining the water, etc. I like it.

-kenc
 
I've been doing no chill also for similar reasons.

I've done it two different ways. 1) I just leave the wort in the kettle with the lid on for a couple hours then move it to my frig to cool to pitching temps and then transfer and pitch. 2) Leave the wort in the kettle with the lid on for a few hours then transfer to the ale pail while still pretty warm, but not warm enough to melt the bucket. I then put it in my fermentation frig and wait till it reaches pitching temp. Which leads me to my question: How high of heat can an ale pail/carboy/better bottle handle? I've heard of people cracking carboys and melting their better bottles fairly easy due to high temperature liquids. I haven't heard (that I remember) of anyone melting an ale pail.
 
I haven't heard (that I remember) of anyone melting an ale pail.

These looks like un-labeled ale pails. I'm pretty sure they are HDPE2, which is all that is important (as far as I know).

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23470&catid=752

Pails and lids are made of high-density polyethylene and meet NMFC, FDA and UFC requirements. Container and cover can be hot filled up to 190° F, steam sterilized and frozen.

This source, takes it further:

http://www.polymerplastics.com/corrosion_polyeth.shtml

HDPE has a working temperature of 212 degrees F - 220 degrees F under low load conditions and it may be autoclaved at sterilizable temperatures. Specification: L-P-390 CL.H, L-P-512

Just to be safe, I'm planning on letting any full boils cool to 190F. But that's just me. Plenty of no-chill people are going straight into HDPE and want the hottest temperatures to help sanitize the container. They also roll it and turn it on its side to heat every surface. I'd be nervous about doing that with an ale pail. And I just haven't found it necessary when pitching within 24 hours. But again, that is just my limited experience ( ~ 5 batches slow-chill).


Q: Any micro-biologists (or other good source) out there that can tell us if there is a significant difference in sanitizing from 'just-off-the-boil' wort temperatures, versus 180-190F? My gut says that compared to the open time when using a IC, this no-chill process would be better.


-kenc
 
Two thoughts, Ferment in corny's... boiling wort can go in without harming it or yourself when moving. I have had excellent success with corny fermenting.

I wouldn't cool prior to transfer. Hot=sterile.

Also when cooling try gently stirring your chiller around.. i cut my water usage in half as the Deta T around the chiller remains at a max value for heat transfer. Just feel the out tube and you will immediately feel the difference all the way down to 85-100 degrees and cooler.
 
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