Sour! Help!

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

brazedowl

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2009
Messages
864
Reaction score
50
Location
Fayetteville, NC
I'm trying for some hard cider... I started this almost two months ago... It has stopped bubbling, started to clear and SMELLS like cider... but it is almost completely unbearably sour to taste. If I add sugar to the glass the sourness disappears and it is wonderful to behold. I'm thinking about just reracking my 5 gallons onto another 3lbs of sugar or so (dissolved)... thoughts?

~~ Recipe details~~
*Ingredients
5.5 gal pasturized apple cider
3lb dark brown sugar
1lb Light DME
1lb Dark DME
1pkt Montrechet Yeast
1tsp Energizer
1 crushed campden tablet
 
You could try adding sugar then cold crashing it to help prevent restarting your fermentation, then heat pasteurizing the bottles after it's done. If you keg you can try to add sugar and filter it. If you don't want it carbonated you could add sugar then use preservatives to keep it still. You could use a non-fermenting sweetener. You could leave it as is, and sweeten to taste. You could ferment a batch of cider that has less acidity and a higher tannin then try blending the two together.
 
Montrechet Yeast will not cold crash. Ciders in general do not cold crash. Cider makers allow their stuff to freeze in outside tanks, and when they thaw, they start fermenting again.

How long ago did you start your batch? Since you said it quit bubbling, it might just need to be racked without adding anything. Actually, if you wanted to add something, apple juice might be better, but you could do the sugar if you wanted to.

Between the sugar and the DME, you have a wine going on. You don't mention OG or SG at all, but I'm guessing you have more than a normal cider's 7%, especially if you do add more sugar.
 
Yea I am for sweet stuff that kicks ya in the butt... I never remember to check the gravity until I need to know what it was. I'm quite forgetful in that department...

I just want to sweeten it up without it fermenting again without using artificial sweeteners.
 
You know, I have to add this - cider is fermenting apple juice. No sugar added ever. Moment you do that, you are making wine.

That's an opinion. One I do largely agree with, but not a fact. There are plenty commercial ciders out of a few places, including places very close to tradition like England and Eastern Canada that have sugar added to boost the abv or bacsweeten or whatnot. It's not an ideal to me, but it doesn't make it less of a cider. Apple wine and cider have a pretty important stylistic difference to them too, and an augmented cider that may be strong and tastes like a cider to me is still a cider.
 
I never remember to check the gravity until I need to know what it was. I'm quite forgetful in that department...

I just want to sweeten it up without it fermenting again without using artificial sweeteners.

Okay, the OG isn't important at the moment. Find out what the SG is to see where it is at now. I still recommend racking it, as I wonder if that is part of the reason it is sour. I was once told that you won't lose a batch racking too early, but you will loose a batch racking to late.

otherwise, then chemicals and sugar... chemicals and sugar, my friend.

@Yan- true, especially the backsweetened part. But the really good craft cider makers use real cider apples and there isn't anyway they are going to let sugar touch their brew at that point. It's the ones who use concentrate (which I have to do as a hobbiest living in the city) that tend to add sugar at the beginning, kind of like a filler. I can tell the difference. However, you are right that backsweetening is done with sugar, though, again, a lot of craft ciders would rather use juice.
 
There are others far more knowledgeable on here, but I would recommend either wine conditioner or a nonfermentable such as lactose. If you keep adding more fermentable sugars you run the risk of restarting your fermentation, and you probably will keep fermenting until you eventually reach the alcohol tolerance of the yeast. By then you may have altered the taste until you don't like it any more, and it will take quite a while to age out the alcohol hotness. If you like the taste now, then you want to try to keep things where they are and just add some sweetness.
 
CandleLight: Yes, you can cold crash hard cider. I don't know what you're smoking to believe that yeast will ferment just as it comes out of freezing temperatures. You can cold crash, sweeten, and keep it cool and have no problems. Yeah, if you leave it outside in the sun...the yeast is going to activate again. I'd like to think that people on these forums are smart enough to figure that one out. Apparently I will have to start writing warnings for every contingency.

"Warning, don't pour yeast starter in your eyes"

"Warning don't dump a load of fermentable ingredients into your cider and allow it to remain at a temperature which it can still ferment, in a vessel that can not withstand the pressure or ventilate pressure to atmosphere."


Yes, you can add sugar to increase fermentable material and still call it a cider. Apples contain enough sugar on their own to extend the ABV beyond what is accepted by the ATF as a cider, so I hardly think that adding sugar would do much to change it by reputation. What you have is an opinion. I know farms where they wouldn't call it a cider without it being mulled. That's their opinion. So why don't you let others have their opinion? It's my opinion that real cider is made from pressed apples. Guess what, many people can't. So why rob them of the joy of brewing by telling them that they're not making a real cider?
 
I agree that cider should be made without sugar, but any look through this forum shows that its standard practise for many people, so why worry about it.
As for cider refermenting in spring, I believe this refers to malolactic fermentation rather than yeast, which is a good way to reduce the sourness complained of by the OP. Malic acid is very sour so fermenting it reduces the sourness quite considerably.
 
hmm... well I didn't mean go get into this debate about semantics... Lets just say I have a jug of Apple-Cider-Based alcoholic beverage and I am seeking advice as to how to reduce sourness and make it drinkable. :p

A) Reracked onto 3lbs of sugar syrup (in maybe 1/2 a gallon of water) a week ago with no restart in the fermentation as of yet.

B) It SMELLS LIKE CIDER... it LOOKS LIKE CIDER... but tastes like what I can only approximate as a 10x strength apple-cider warhead. When I properly sweetened a sample glass it was PHENOMENAL.

C) Because sweetening makes it taste good and fermentation isn't kicking back in... I think I'll just keep sweetening it, with regular old sugar, until it tastes nummy.

And I shall call this concoction... HARD-WINE-CIDER-MALT-BREW
 
Well... coming full circle about 9 months later... it tastes pretty damn good. Soothed out some. I'll decidedly NOT put in the cinnamon sticks next time. But it's pretty tasty.
 
Anything fermented with yeast will cold crash when subjected to temperatures below 40 degrees F...the time it takes to clear depends on many factors..the flocculation rating of the yeast being one leading factor. It's what you do with the cold-crashed beverage after the yeast has fallen out of suspension that really matters; leave it on the yeast and the beverage will restart fermenting when warmed back up -- if sugars are still present; or, if you very carefully rack the cleared beverage off of the yeast, it will be stable for a year or two...beyond that the very few yeast cells that remained after cold crashing will begin to grow to numbers that can actually accomplish something noticeable, provided the beverage is stored at a temperature higher than 40 degrees.
 
I added ~1/2 pound of lactose and two cups of splenda (both non-fermentable sugars) to my 6gal batch of Johnny Jump Up at bottling. (see Cider Recipes) It turned out great, what I would call mildly sweet, but still has a good "twang" to it.
 
has anyone used stevia as a substitute for sugar when backsweetening? I hate the taste of all the other non sugar sweeteners and can always taste when they are used.
mfs
 
I have thought about stevia I've got a plant growing in the back yard. I'm thinking about putting the leaves in a mesh bag and steeping them in the fermenter.
 
Back
Top