Saison Cottage House Saison

I stewed a rabbit in a pint of the session strength version of this and it was absolutely delicious. You could do the same with chicken and it would work just as well. Here's the recipe if anyone wants to have a go:

Ingredients:
2 tbs olive oil
2 large onions
3 medium carrots
3 large cloves garlic
2 tsp coriander seeds, lightly crushed
1 bay leaf
1 sprig of thyme
1 chicken or rabbit, jointed
500ml chicken stock
500ml cottage house saison
1 heaped teaspoon cornflour mixed with a little water
salt, pepper and sugar/honey to taste

1. Cut the onions in half, then into thin slices. Peel and chop the carrots.
2. Cook the onions and carrots and bay leaf in olive oil in a large saucepan until the onoin softens.
3. Add the chopped garlic, coriander seeds and thyme and cook for a further 2-3 minutes.
4. Add the meat and brown on all sides.
5. When the meat is browned, add the stock and beer plus salt and pepper to taste.
6. Simmer until the meat is cooked. If it needs sweetening, add sugar or honey.
7. Add the cornflour and water mixture to thicken the sauce.

My yard is teeming with rabbits, time to cull the herd of a few!

Just finished our first batch of this. Brewed ~6 gallons, and split it into three seperate batches after fermentation, bottling the first, racking the second over blueberries, and the third over jakfruit (flesh and some roasted seeds from the fruit)

It turned out really awesome, and it was all gone in just a few days. Everyone loved it! Thanks for the recipe.


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NuclearRich said:

3711 isn't bad with pepper flavor, unless you use fresh crack black pepper, that addition should be fine (maybe half that if fresh ground IMO). The white labs saison II, on the other hand is a peppery beast. Im cutting all pepper out next time I use that yeast.

I did a split batch of this recipe before. Rrplaced the fuggles additions. Half with nelson, half with citra. I really didn't love the nelson half, as the winegrape/gooseberry flavor gave it a perceived sweetness that I disliked. Citra was great though.
Dryhopping. .. your going to get something a bit different but I dont love hoppy Belgians so I cant exactly comment specifically.

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What temp did you ferment with the saison 2? I'm using it for the first time this weekend.

Hoping to brew this up this weekend, but my LHBS doesn't carry wyeast products, so I need to substitute.
My guess from the selection is either WL Trappist or WL Abbey liquid yeast. Is one better than the other?

Cheesy_Goodness said:

Hoping to brew this up this weekend, but my LHBS doesn't carry wyeast products, so I need to substitute.
My guess from the selection is either WL Trappist or WL Abbey liquid yeast. Is one better than the other?

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T-58 works pretty damn well. Not sure about the difference between the final products with the different yeasts though.

I've used rehydrated Belle Saison yeast on my last two batches. Really excellent results. I raise the temp a couple of degrees ea day until it reaches 75°F +. I usually leave it in primary 2-3 weeks.


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Looks like my LHBS carries T-58. Might end up giving that a try. Thanks!

Ah, the smells...

Brewing a 10g batch today, round one was awesome!


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MongooseMan said:

View attachment 220863

Ah, the smells...

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That looks delicious! All the carbonations!

I've been quietly watching this recipe and following this thread for months. Today I finally got it in the fermenter. I'm pretty stoked to see how it turns out.

I chickened out on the pepper when I saw how much I was grinding to get 1 1/2 tsp. So I stopped at 1 tsp. We'll see, right? This was also the first time I evenly split my batch sparge water. I usually come in a little low but today I hit my numbers spot on. So there you go. This was also my first saison, btw.

Anyway, after all of that, a question. The recipe calls for 4 weeks in the fermenter. I generally leave my beers in for 3 weeks which a lot of people think is long to begin with. So why 4 on this one? Cheers!

truvr said:

I've been quietly watching this recipe and following this thread for months. Today I finally got it in the fermenter. I'm pretty stoked to see how it turns out.

I chickened out on the pepper when I saw how much I was grinding to get 1 1/2 tsp. So I stopped at 1 tsp. We'll see, right? This was also the first time I evenly split my batch sparge water. I usually come in a little low but today I hit my numbers spot on. So there you go. This was also my first saison, btw.

Anyway, after all of that, a question. The recipe calls for 4 weeks in the fermenter. I generally leave my beers in for 3 weeks which a lot of people think is long to begin with. So why 4 on this one? Cheers!

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You can still add the pepper in secondary. It's what I did w/ my last batch. Crush the peppercorns. Use a mortar & pestle if you have one. No need to grind.


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govner1 said:

You can still add the pepper in secondary. It's what I did w/ my last batch. Crush the peppercorns. Use a mortar & pestle if you have one. No need to grind.


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I do have a mortar & pestle. Mostly I was concerned about the pepper being too strong. But I guess 1.5 tsp isn't that much in 5 gallons!

My $.02. I brewed this last summer exactly to recipe and loved it, but I personally wanted more pepper. Just brewed again with 2.5 tsp of pepper (and I threw in 10 fresh sage leaves from the garden) and it is perfect. I used 3711 btw and ramped it up to 80 degrees both times.

Some great pics last page!

As for the query of 4 weeks fermentation time, it's simply because I ramped up the temps (I was just winging it time wise), and also the yeast can drop down well below where most yeasts stall out so I wanted to be sure it was done fermenting, it worked great so I never tried it with any other fermentation schedule.

truvr said:

I do have a mortar & pestle. Mostly I was concerned about the pepper being too strong. But I guess 1.5 tsp isn't that much in 5 gallons!

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I've found the pepper flavor comes through on the back end and not strong at all. I use a little over 1.75 tsp in 6 gal.
In fact, I just added .75 tsp in secondary on a 3 gal batch of another Saison.


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This beer realy turned out fantastic, I washed the yeast from this and would love to brew another batch before fall, maybe with a little orange zest.

I'm brewing this in the morning. I have Citra and EKG hops that will go in. Need some advice on which is best to use first as the bittering.

Ethompson28 said:

I'm brewing this in the morning. I have Citra and EKG hops that will go in. Need some advice on which is best to use first as the bittering.

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The citra has a higher IBU than the EKG, you might use some citra early on, but the IBU in this recipe isn't high to begin with so perhaps late additions would better suit the beer by adding the citrus notes instead of big bittering.

Thanks for the help. I'm still new at it so I need a little more clarification. Are you saying to skip the fwh and maybe go from the 30 minute boil schedule or use the EKG for the fwh and the Citra tto wars the end? Getting the hop schedule right is still the hardest thing for me to grasp and I'd rather go less bitter than too bitter.

I once brewed this beer but changed the hop schedule to have an ounce each of citra and sorachi ace at flameout. Turned out very nicely. At that point the only real bitterness should be coming from the fwh. So, if you're going to do something like that, I wouldn't change the schedule too much apart from that. Azscoob's base recipe is a fantastic one.

Note that I only did the fwh and flameout additions. I should have been more specific.

That sounds like a good idea which leads me to another question. I'm doing it BIAB so I don't have a sparge. Can you FWH just adding the hops as the wort comes up to a boil? I'm mashing now so nothing like waiting til the last possible minute to get the recipe down.

thefolkmetal said:

Note that I only did the fwh and flameout additions. I should have been more specific.

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I was just going to suggest the same. Try to scale back the EKG/Citra ratio a little in the FWH to like

1oz EKG FWH
.25oz Citra FWH
.75oz Citra @ 5min or flameout

or because this is a saison and will most likely not be drunk young. Go for the extra citrus flavor that will mellow over time, granted you will be changing the original recipe which is fantastic, with the following

1oz EKG FWH
.25oz Citra FWH
.75oz Citra @ 5min
1 oz Citra @ flameout and hopstand

You won't be adding much more by way of IBUs (arguably), only flavor and aroma with those late additions.

If you are doing BIAB, toss in your hops when you pull your bag and start to raise the temp to boil. Should give you a similar effect.

Thanks for the help! I think I finally have my plan.

Brewed 10 gals of this about a week and a half and still signs of visible fermentation even today. This batch is sharing my ferm chamber with another batch (different recipe) so I would not be able to ramp up the temp from 68 to 80 degrees until the 3 week mark, will this affect my Saison and if so how?

dordelli said:

Brewed 10 gals of this about a week and a half and still signs of visible fermentation even today. This batch is sharing my ferm chamber with another batch (different recipe) so I would not be able to ramp up the temp from 68 to 80 degrees until the 3 week mark, will this affect my Saison and if so how?

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It will likely just take a bit longer and have less saison funk to it.

Depending on where you live, you might want to just cover the carboy with a towel and move it somewhere warmer like a closet, the garage, attic room, etc

This is my first message here on the HBT. Just thought I'd add a note - I brewed this about a month ago, whole grain, 5 gal batch, kegged it. It's my third brew on my own, after "apprenticing" with a friend for 6 or 7 brews.

I was surprised that this thread is still active given it's original date was ... 07-02-2011, so three years! That alone caught my eye as I went looking for a saison to brew after having a great local saison (Trillium Saison here in Boston). And actually, that's what got me to settle on this as the beer I'd brew.

After brewing it I have to say: azscoob - thanks! The thread is alive and kicking because it's such a great beer.

I'll add that I failed to notice that you suggested a yeast starter. After reviewing the thread a couple days after pitching I got worried. But you know what - the WYeast 3711 did just fine all by itself - got the OG down to 1.006.

Cheers,

Perry

+++1 on the kudos to azscoob for this recipe. I've brewed it at least 4 times and it's always a hit!!


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azscoob said:

It will likely just take a bit longer and have less saison funk to it.

Depending on where you live, you might want to just cover the carboy with a towel and move it somewhere warmer like a closet, the garage, attic room, etc

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I'm in SoCal, outside temp is in the mid 80's to low 90's right now, I don't have AC, so my in house temps are above 80 and falls to low 70's at night, are these temps ok? Not so much worried about the mid 80 temp but more the temp fluctuations at night?

I think consistent temps are important. Particularly in the first week. This saison likes 75-80. So
Stones even higher depending on your yeast choice.
Do you have a place(closet, basement) where the temps are steadier? Even if they're in the low 80's?


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tgmartin000 said:

What temp did you ferment with the saison 2? I'm using it for the first time this weekend.

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I know this is a late reply, I haven't checked this thread in awhile, so my apologies.

I have made it with a primary ferment at 70F, and then another 2 weeks in the low 80s in an upstairs room. Did that one with pepper.
I just made it recently with no pepper (since I found this strain to throw a lot of its own spice), and fermented around 72F, with no ramp up. It is slightly more subdued, but I wouldn't call it a downfall. Its still a pretty rad beer, and still finished with a real low FG around 1.005

govner1 said:

I think consistent temps are important. Particularly in the first week. This saison likes 75-80. So
Stones even higher depending on your yeast choice.
Do you have a place(closet, basement) where the temps are steadier? Even if they're in the low 80's?


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I kept it at exactly 68 for the first two weeks but wanted to now ramp it up to 80 or so, I pulled from my ferm chamber and put it under the stairs indoors. We'll see what that does for it!

I like to let mine ramp up a few degrees each day after fermentation is underway. This helps w/ the development of the esters that give Saisons it's signature flavor.
If you've already fermented for two weeks at ale temps I'm not sure ramping up now will help w/ producing esters.
Do you still have active fermentation? What's your SG ?


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govner1 said:

I like to let mine ramp up a few degrees each day after fermentation is underway. This helps w/ the development of the esters that give Saisons it's signature flavor.
If you've already fermented for two weeks at ale temps I'm not sure ramping up now will help w/ producing esters.
Do you still have active fermentation? What's your SG ?
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This is my first Saison so tried to follow the recipe as closely as possible, that's why I did the full 2 weeks at 68. Active ferm seems to be done and my OG was 1.060. I'm sure the beer will be good as this recipe seems to be pretty popular. If I make it again, maybe I'll try ramping the temp up sooner and see how it changes the outcome.

So my OG was 1.060, I had to use white labs saison 2 due to availability in my LHBS. It's been 13 days, and it's down to 1.010. It tastes great! Probably my best brew yet, only my second all grain beer, and probably my 8 th brew altogether. Should I give it another week? Or bottle it this week? I have a small space to brew in so it's about 70 - 72 degrees in my brew room.


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Wait until your SG readings are steady for several days. I just legged a Saison that finished at 1.003.
You could raise your temp.now to let the yeast finish up.

Okay I'll try moving it to a closet! Thank you


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