Baking yeast

Hi everybody,

I've recently made a cyser using 240g of clover honey and 3L of clear applejuice. It dried out completely from a density of 1.065 to a density of 1.000 which means it contained around 9% ABV.

Here's the thing though, it tasted great while I brewed it using a baking yeast. So I presume it was straightforward Saccharomyces Cerevisiae. I used 7g (so 1/4th ounce). I have been told on multiple occasions that this yeast is badly suited for brewing, why is this? And what would have been different if I'd used an ale yeast or a champagne yeast?

I'm brewing it again using the same amounts and the same yeast right now. It's really bubbling like crazy! Is this a good or a bad thing?

The resulting cyser is a dry, bubbly concoction without even the slightest hint of a head.

Baker's yeast is closely related to beer and wine yeast and it will work as you have found out. However, with so many high-quality yeasts available to the home beermaker & winemaker why would you not use the proper tool for the job? You can pound a nail into a board with a rock too but most of us prefer to use a hammer for the job. In general baker's yeast won't tolerate higher alcohol levels and tends to be less flocculant than beer/wine yeast. Brewers and winemakers have been breeding specific strains of yeasts for a long time and I think it's a good idea to take advantage of that effort.

+ 1 what Ed said (and so well elucidated too).

Also, bakers yeast has been optimized through the years for maximum CO2 production (makes thing rise), whereas brewers yeast has not.

Next time I would recommend using a better suited yeast, at around $1 (Lalvin or Red Star are two good brands).

I wouldn't know, I've never seen either of them here in the Netherlands.

Does fast fermentation also equal weird flavours or just more simplicity?

Nerro said:

I wouldn't know, I've never seen either of them here in the Netherlands.

Does fast fermentation also equal weird flavours or just more simplicity?

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Fast fermentation can cause the temperature of your must to rise, which leads to off flavours. If you keep the temps in check, it really doesn't matter how fast something ferments.

I would not normally endorse the use of baker's yeast, but I have to say if you liked the end result why not. though I think I would try the same recipe with the proper yeast just to compare.

i've been meaning to try this in the interest of science. how long has this been fermenting nerro?

It's been going since saturday night this time so it's been fermenting for approx. 48 hrs and frankly it's going much much harder than I've ever seen before. It's fermenting at 19 degrees C.

Last time I cleared it using sulfite and bentonite after only a week. This time I'm going to let it rage and then clear. I'm also going to prime and bottle it.

I'll keep you posted.

On the other hand, cysers are all simple sugars which bread yeasts can handle and you're keeping the temperature down. Ale yeasts have been selected to deal with the complex malt sugars, not a factor here. Wine, mead and champaign yeasts all have high ABV tolerance, which isn't a concern.

You would probably get a little better flavor using a cider yeast, but as long as you keep the OG down and ferment cool...

Small update & bumpage.

I've bottled the cyser after one week of primary fermentation. The cyser had cleared completely. I've bottled it in German ½L bottles. I could see the priming happening! This yeast is hyper-active!

I'm going to try one after only a week of lagering just for the hell of it.

The rest will be left alone for at least three months.

By lagering I hope you don't mean having it sit at lagering temperatures, I don't think the baker's yeast would deal well with that.

You might be interested in the Basic Brewing Videocast;

September 28, 2007 - Trading Places: Beer and Bread Yeast
James makes a Simcoe Ale with bread yeast, and Steve makes bread with beer yeast.

http://www.basicbrewing.com/index.php?page=trading-places-beer-and-bread-yeast

By lagering I meant priming and botteling and just leaving it the hell alone for a while in the dark.

Nice link there, Revvy Looks like the yeast is a lot more interchangable than a lot of people here like to believe

The cyser came out great as well. Making a cider with ale yeast and fresh pressed apple juice right now, look for my post in the "cider" sub-forum.

Nerro said:

By lagering I meant priming and botteling and just leaving it the hell alone for a while in the dark.

Nice link there, Revvy Looks like the yeast is a lot more interchangable than a lot of people here like to believe

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You definitely want to leave your beer alone in the dark for awhile, usually 3 weeks minimum @ 70 degrees to fully carb and bottle condition...Some beers take longer...I've had stouts and porters take longer...

Granted, we now have hundreds of strains of beer specific yeasts to choose from, but it wasn't always so. Heck the first beer brewed in ancient Sumeria was done by adding pre-baked bread (with fruits and spices baked in) to water and sprouted barley in a mash, and letting it ferment.

And even as recently as the 70's when homebrewing was first legalized in the US, there were very few beer yeast available, and from my understanding they were pretty nasty hard yeast cakes...

So people used what was readily available....And that was the jar or packet of RedStar Bread Yeast sitting in the cupboard (RedStar also makes Wine yeast, like Montrachet, btw.)

It may not be as great as using an ale yeast in terms of floculation and attenuation, and it may not be as "clean tasting" as specific yeasts, but it still works.

Also there's some places in the world (like Bulgaria and the Middle East where for various reasons beer/wine yeasts are not readily available.) So rather than not brew becaause people don't have access to the "right yeast." I say go for it...it ain't like it hasn't been done before...

Plus experimentation is fun!