Cider First taste.... not bad (white wine flavor)

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swarfrat

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Ok - tomorrow is another trip to the homebrew store for an autosiphon. Tried to be delicate but just made a mess. If it doesn't get infected it will be because of the yeasts and not from my fault. (Not expecting it to... just that I did about everything wrong I could've).

Anyway - this is 3 qts Wal-Mart apple juice (no preservatives), LC1118, and a cup of brown sugar. 1.5 weeks. And .... not bad. Flavor is basically white wine. In fact, to my palate it would pass for a commercial (grape) white wine... it's a shame I don't like white wine! By the end of the glass though I was thinking this is definitely better than the hootch I was kind of expecting.

I've read the apple comes back with aging. But.. what about yeast selection and this WW Flavor? What makes it taste this way? Lack of Skins? Yeast? Waffling between trying Apfelwein and Graff next.
 
For starters, I'd avoid the Wal mart stuff. try to find real apple juice when its in season (soon!) if you can't find that - get some pure apple juice not from concentrate and try to find more than one type if you can. Around here i get some nice 1/2 gallon ones - 100% juice not from concentrate for $1.50. can't beat it. I can get em all year.

The yeast is critical to the flavor is what i found. i used champagne yeast which was great. my attempts with Nottingham and other yeasts just didn't taset as good.

from there its a question of what you want to make - i tend prefer more carbonation (hence the champagne yeast) - I bottle carbonate a lot. I also often add fruits in secondary fermentation. most importantly, i think that adding sugars or honey in secondary can really improve flavor. Cysers are much more interesting than base cider.

So - its a question of what you like. My suggestion - bump up the sugar ratio (and alcohol), carbonate in bottle, add cherry syrup to concentrate, if you can add honey in secondary...

and lastly, and perhaps most importantly. let the stuff sit... for a good while. it does get way better with age and flavors round out and return.
 
Ok - tomorrow is another trip to the homebrew store for an autosiphon. Tried to be delicate but just made a mess. If it doesn't get infected it will be because of the yeasts and not from my fault. (Not expecting it to... just that I did about everything wrong I could've).

Anyway - this is 3 qts Wal-Mart apple juice (no preservatives), LC1118, and a cup of brown sugar. 1.5 weeks. And .... not bad. Flavor is basically white wine. In fact, to my palate it would pass for a commercial (grape) white wine... it's a shame I don't like white wine! By the end of the glass though I was thinking this is definitely better than the hootch I was kind of expecting.

I've read the apple comes back with aging. But.. what about yeast selection and this WW Flavor? What makes it taste this way? Lack of Skins? Yeast? Waffling between trying Apfelwein and Graff next.

Yep, that's what simple juice, sugar and yeast is. white wine hoochiness, unless of course you feel like waiting a year.

If you really want a cider that is good after only a couple weeks in the bottle, you need to make GRAFF. Graff is what you would think cider should taste like IMO.
 
Methinks even after aging, you're not going to get much apple flavor back. That apple juice is mostly sugar and water, you need more fruit juice.

Also going with a champagne yeast is a great suggestion.

If you're looking for a quick fruity hooch, you can do exactly what you did but add an extract flavoring at the end before bottling. However, if you want real hard cider you're going to have to seek out a different juice.
 
Methinks even after aging, you're not going to get much apple flavor back. That apple juice is mostly sugar and water, you need more fruit juice.

Also going with a champagne yeast is a great suggestion.

If you're looking for a quick fruity hooch, you can do exactly what you did but add an extract flavoring at the end before bottling. However, if you want real hard cider you're going to have to seek out a different juice.

Champagne yeast will strip the apple juice of quite a bit of apple flavor. Go with a beer yeast like notty and it will be much gentler on the juice.
 
Sparge? whats this? I'm not set up for making beer. Graff will have to wait until I can spend money on equipment I guess.
 
It won't be Brandon's recipe, but you can brew a mighty tasty beverage with malt extract and apple juice. I used Munton's extra light DME and it was awesome. I was practically crying by the last bottle because I didn't have any more in the pipeline.
 
Why not try cider yeast or beer yeast then it will be more like cider or beer... rather than white wine.
 
It won't be Brandon's recipe, but you can brew a mighty tasty beverage with malt extract and apple juice. I used Munton's extra light DME and it was awesome. I was practically crying by the last bottle because I didn't have any more in the pipeline.


oooh more detail on that concoction and what do we call it?
 
Very nice.. thank u. this is definitely getting on the list. I had some experiments with this in small 1 G batch but didn't have a formal recipe.
 
Saw another thread mention elevated fermentation temps were connected with esthers & fruity flavor (in beer, not desirable). What about fermenting cider warm? Any experience with that?
 
For my malted cider experiment I used 1 gallon apple juice, 1 lb Munton's extra light DME, 1-1/2 cups organic sugar, and pitched a package of Munton's dry ale yeast. It took off fermenting within an hour. Bottle-conditioned and bottled from primary after about 3 weeks. It had a rich malty-apple flavor and a very smooth, full mouthfeel. And a 12 oz glass would definitely make its presence known, especially since it was just about impossible to drink it slowly. Might not be everybody's cup of Graff, but to me it was one delicious drink. Definitely going to make some more soon.
 
For my malted cider experiment I used 1 gallon apple juice, 1 lb Munton's extra light DME, 1-1/2 cups organic sugar, and pitched a package of Munton's dry ale yeast. It took off fermenting within an hour. Bottle-conditioned and bottled from primary after about 3 weeks. It had a rich malty-apple flavor and a very smooth, full mouthfeel. And a 12 oz glass would definitely make its presence known, especially since it was just about impossible to drink it slowly. Might not be everybody's cup of Graff, but to me it was one delicious drink. Definitely going to make some more soon.

Yes, isn't it amazing? Cider that actually tastes like cider, and has supreme drinkability. the crystal grains add so much, and the malt gives it proper flavor profiling.

Cider should have mouthfeel, it should have some body, it should not be sweet but have a bit of residual sweetness.

Graff does all these things. Any combination of yeast, sugar, and juice is not going to have mouthfeel or body, nor will it even taste good until considerable time has gone by.
 
For my malted cider experiment I used 1 gallon apple juice, 1 lb Munton's extra light DME, 1-1/2 cups organic sugar, and pitched a package of Munton's dry ale yeast. It took off fermenting within an hour. Bottle-conditioned and bottled from primary after about 3 weeks. It had a rich malty-apple flavor and a very smooth, full mouthfeel. And a 12 oz glass would definitely make its presence known, especially since it was just about impossible to drink it slowly. Might not be everybody's cup of Graff, but to me it was one delicious drink. Definitely going to make some more soon.

Did you do a boil with this recipe? It was a 1gallon batch, correct?
 
No boil, just DME, sugar, juice, shook it up to mix/aerate, pitched the yeast, swirled it a little, & put on an airlock. Real beer brewers are cringing right about now, but it works for me. Lesson learned--when using ale yeasts with apple juice in small batches, reserve about 1-1/2 pints of the juice in the fridge, and add it back when the kreusen settles down a bit. Saves having to clean & replace the airlock a couple of times. How do I know this, you may ask? :D
 
I don't think there's anything wrong with it, just wondering if it would be better if you could incorporate a boil with the DME. Perhaps a mini-boil with the DME and some water, then adding it to the apple juice? Just thinking out loud. :)
 
I'm hoping to try an extract variation of Graff in the next few weeks using a pre-hopped LME instead of the DME. I probably will do a mini-boil in that case just to make sure the LME is well dissolved. I'm thinking bring the LME to a boil with a gallon of water and add to 4 gallons of AJ to make a 5 gallon batch.
 
I'm hoping to try an extract variation of Graff in the next few weeks using a pre-hopped LME instead of the DME. I probably will do a mini-boil in that case just to make sure the LME is well dissolved. I'm thinking bring the LME to a boil with a gallon of water and add to 4 gallons of AJ to make a 5 gallon batch.

Exactly what I was thinking. Let us know how it turns out!
 
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