Differences between Caramunich/vienna and regular crystal malts?

I've been writing recipes for about a year now and have found myself getting stuck on adding either C-120 or C-60 to just about everything. Most of my research comes out of Ray Daniels Designing Great Beers book so I know I'm missing out on some new grains out there and one thing I have never really incorporated are the Caramunich and caravienna malts.

Just curios about these guys. I have an APA I like with 2-Row, Vienna and C-60. Could I just sub in caravienna? What are the differences? What would that change about my finished product?

Caravienna would be close to 20L caramal/crystal, Caramunich is closer to 60L, These are the belgian versions of the caramel/crystal malts, thus they are used alot in the belgian styles. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/CaraVienna https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/CaraMunich

I'm sure you can find more on line about their subtle flavours.

I'm pretty sure it was in this beersmith podcast episode on Malting Barley with Bob Hansen from Briess

http://beersmith.com/blog/2012/03/31/malting-barley-with-bob-hansen-from-briess-beersmith-podcast-35/

where he talks about the differnce between crystal malts and caramunich. I remember hearing him say Briess is using a drum roaster to make their crystals which provides a more even roast to the malt, where as Weyermann is using a kiln to make the caramunich which doesn't provide as even a roast. So for a caramunich you get one side of the malt that is like a munich malt, and one side that is like a caramel or crystal malt, not as even as a drum roaster. Different maltsters, different processes.

imo caravienna and caramunich seem a richer/fuller than their American counterparts

Buna_Bere said:

I'm pretty sure it was in this beersmith podcast episode on Malting Barley with Bob Hansen from Briess

http://beersmith.com/blog/2012/03/31/malting-barley-with-bob-hansen-from-briess-beersmith-podcast-35/

where he talks about the differnce between crystal malts and caramunich. I remember hearing him say Briess is using a drum roaster to make their crystals which provides a more even roast to the malt, where as Weyermann is using a kiln to make the caramunich which doesn't provide as even a roast. So for a caramunich you get one side of the malt that is like a munich malt, and one side that is like a caramel or crystal malt, not as even as a drum roaster. Different maltsters, different processes.

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I was just doing some research on Caramunich and came across your post. I just read this at the Weyermann site on their FAQ page regarding their Cara process:

Caramelmalts
Question I am trying to educate myself on the differences between your different cara malts. Based on the color ratings, it s easy to tell which malts will produce more color. Does the grain name following cara signify the grain that been crystalized? If so, it would make sense that Caramunich is a crystalized version of Munich....however what would the grain be for Carahell or Cara-amber? Beyond color, what are the variances in the caramalts (degree of body, foam, sweetness, caramel level, etc).
Answer You are right. “Cara” means that these products are caramel or roasted malts (Carafa® & Carafa® special) produced in roasting drums. Caramel malts are produced from green malt (directly after germination) in special designed roasting drums. In a saccharification step (70°C) the starch is converted into sugar. Then with higher temperatures these sugar is caramelized. For Carafa® roasted malt, special produced kilned malt is roasted in roasting drums (temperatures > 250°C).

Things may have changed since your post Buna_Bere and since the Beersmith podcast with Bob Hansen, but Weyermann definitely uses drum roasters for their Caramunich.