Cornies as Lagering Vessels?

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Evan!

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Here's my deal: my lagerator only fits one carboy at a time. So I can only lager one thing at a time. Which is kind of a pain. At the same time, I bottle exclusively, never kegged, but I have 4 cornies sitting around that someone gave me. Now, I'm pretty sure I could fit up to 4 of these unused cornies in the lagerator at one time...so, does anyone know if it's possible to use a corny as a lagering vessel? Is there any way to outfit it with an airlock or something? Or do I really not even need an airlock during the lagering (36-38f) phase?
 
Very easy to do. Assuming it is ball lock, go grab a 7/8 open end wrench OR socket and remove both the dip tubes. Then you just need to reattach one of the poppets and use the other one to hold an airlock. I Do it all the time.
 
I wouldn't be too worried about needing an airlock; they'll hold a boatload of pressure, have a pressure relief valve if things got to an extreme level, and you'll be at a temp where even lager yeast are pretty quiet. What I would be more concerned with is whether you'll be able to get the cornies to seal properly without being able to give them a quick hit of CO2. They won't always seal up all the way without a little bit of pressure pushing things outward.
 
the_bird said:
I wouldn't be too worried about needing an airlock; they'll hold a boatload of pressure, have a pressure relief valve if things got to an extreme level, and you'll be at a temp where even lager yeast are pretty quiet. What I would be more concerned with is whether you'll be able to get the cornies to seal properly without being able to give them a quick hit of CO2. They won't always seal up all the way without a little bit of pressure pushing things outward.

Yeah...great point. And the last thing I want is for anything to sit in my lagerator without being sealed. During the summer, since it's so humid, the inside gets nice and moist, but doesn't freeze because it's above freezing in there. And there are traces of some kind of mold.

Speaking of which...um, does anyone see a problem with putting a container of damprid in there?
 
I lager in kegs and don't worry about an airlock. The ferment is done.

Damprid sounds like a good idea.
 
david_42 said:
I lager in kegs and don't worry about an airlock. The ferment is done.

Damprid sounds like a good idea.

Do YOU have to hit it with co2 to make sure the lid is sealed, though?
 
Oh, and lemme also ask you guys this: let's say I have two cornies that are lagering away in there at 37f, and I want to brew a 3rd lager. Since it's 67f in my basement, I'll need to use the lagerator for primary fermentation to get it down to the 50's. Will it affect the beer if I take the others out of the lagerator while the new one is fermenting, and let them sit at room temp until it's done, then throw them back in and drop down to 37f again? In other words, will a period of higher temps in the middle of the lagering process have any affect on the beer?
 
EVAN - I don't think it would be a problem. You need to do a diacetyl rest anyhow. Your temp would be just a little higher. Most of the flavor will be developed already. You can also do the lagerator trick with a tub half filled with water and a fan blowing on it during this phase.

This is from John Palmers Website: (see the bit on diacetyl)

Chapter 10 - What is Different for Brewing Lager Beer?

10.4 Yeast Starters and Diacetyl Rests
There are two other items that are significant in brewing a good lager beer and I will describe them briefly. These are Yeast Pitching and the Diacetyl Rest. Lager brewing is best described in a book of its own and fortunately someone has done just that. See the Recommended Reading section in the appendices for more information.​

Because of the cooler temperatures, the yeast is less active at first. The best way to ensure a strong, healthy lager fermentation is to pitch a much larger yeast starter than you would for an ale. Where you would pitch a one quart starter solution of liquid yeast for an ale, you would use a 2 or 3 quart starter for a lager. This is the equivalent of about 1/2 to 3/4 cup of yeast slurry. In addition, the pitching temperature should be the same as the fermentation temperature to prevent thermally shocking the yeast. In other words, you will need to chill the wort down to 45 - 55 °F before pitching the yeast. The yeast starter should also have been brought down to this temperature range while it was fermenting. A good way to do this is to pitch the yeast packet into a pint of wort at 60 °F, let that ferment for a day, cool it 5 degrees to 55°F and add another pint of aerated, cool wort. Let this also ferment for a day, and cool and pitch a third and even fourth time until you have built up 2 quarts or more of yeast starter that is comfortable at 45 -55 °F. I recommend that you pour off the excess liquid and only pitch the slurry to avoid some off-flavors from that much starter beer.

Some brewers pitch their yeast when the wort is warmer and slowly lower the temperature of the whole fermenter gradually over the course of several days until they have reached the optimum temperature for their yeast strain. This method works, and works well, but tends to produce more diacetyl (a buttery-flavored ketone) than the previous method. As the temperature drops the yeast become less active and are less inclined to consume the diacetyl that they initially produced. The result is a buttery/butterscotch flavor in the lager, which is totally out of style. Some amount of diacetyl is considered good in other styles such as dark ales and stouts, but is considered a flaw in lagers. To remove any diacetyl that may be present after primary fermentation, a diacetyl rest may be used. This rest at the end of primary fermentation consists of raising the temperature of the beer to 55-60 °F for 24 - 48 hours before cooling it down for the lagering period. This makes the yeast more active and allows them to eat up the diacetyl before downshifting into lagering mode. Some yeast strains produce less diacetyl than others; a diacetyl rest is needed only if the pitching or fermentation conditions warrant it.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter10-4.html

:mug:
 
Oh, yeah, I know, I always do a diacetyl rest, whether it's pitched warm or cold. But that also requires some pretty precise timing in order to line your d-rest up with the primary fermentation on another batch.
 
I've made all my lagers where the yeasts operating range was 47-65F. (Superior Dry Lager) I fermented it to completion at ~55-57F. Then bottled and bottle lagered 6-8 weeks (at 44F) before popping one open. (Lots of discipline req'd) Its very very clean an crisp.

I'm thinking if your lager yeast can do its job to 90% completion or more at 37-44 or so, then rest it for sometime at 67 and then re-lager it at for a period before drinking. It should be pretty damn good.

I can't be any worse than a steam beer, right??

:mug:
 
Evan! said:
Speaking of which...um, does anyone see a problem with putting a container of damprid in there?

Damprid is anhydrous calcium chloride. It emits no vapors, and in pellet form almost no dust. In pure form it is used in the production of pickles (the food). Just keep the hydrated form (the gooey remains) out of your beer.


DampRid MSDS: http://www.hardwarestore.com/media/msds/606148.pdf
 
the_bird said:
I wouldn't be too worried about needing an airlock; they'll hold a boatload of pressure, have a pressure relief valve if things got to an extreme level, and you'll be at a temp where even lager yeast are pretty quiet. What I would be more concerned with is whether you'll be able to get the cornies to seal properly without being able to give them a quick hit of CO2. They won't always seal up all the way without a little bit of pressure pushing things outward.

Is there a problem with giving them a quick hit of CO2to seal it up? Will it lager alright under a tiny bit of pressure?

I've yet to make a lager, but when I do lager-fridge space will be at a premium, and a corny footprint is hell of smaller than a carboy.
 
I made a airlock one day when i transfered the brew from the wrong carboy into a corny. I removed the popit & used a broken piece of racking cane and some silicone tubing.
Now I just add a couple drops of foam control and no airlock.
11999-111107011.jpg
 
When I'm short on space in my lagering fridge, I remove the other kegs to give me space to ferment with.

I use kegs to lager in also. Just hit it with enough CO2 to seal it and then you can let some of the CO2 out if you feel that the extra pressure isn't good for your yeast to work with.
 
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