Grain got through to the kettle

The last brew, on running the 2nd sparge, I noticed the runnings were cloudy. Somehow my home made, slotted filter in the bottom of the 10 Rubbermaid mash tun had loosened up.

Sure 'nuff, I'm tasting the beer now and it is too "grainy" for my liking. The brew (despite using gelatin finings) has the appearance of a good wheat beer .

I've got 15 gal of the stuff - fermented and ready to sup - any thing I can do at this stage?

Cheers!

Is it still in the fermenter? If so rack it the a secondary and let it clear, it may take a while but I think that it will eventually drop out.

cfonnes,
Many thanks for the suggestion.
Time is something we've all got.
Cheers!

Or, if it's still in the primary, cold crash it. Some of the grain may fall into the cake with the yeast. I've never done that personally, but it seems like it would work.

William,
Thanks for the suggestion - funnily enough, I put the 1st keg in the kegerator and turned the thermostat to maximum cooling. This morning it is still cloudy. Maybe it needs more time but I'm worried that the grain particles will impart a permanent unpleasant taste. I've therefore just got back from Lowes with a Filtration Housing and some filters. Took a while to figure out the connectors from this to 3/8" ID tubing but I think I'm all set to go. Will report back if anyone is interested.
Cheers!

You could also try using gelatin or other finings. Works well and easier than trying to filter.

Juan,
Yeah, I had used gelatin - which is normally great at clarifying - but this grain particle cloudiness is still there.

OK, the Filter Housing, etc, from Lowes was very easy to set up and use, unfortunately it did squat.

The only filter cartridge that Lowes (or Home Depot) had, that was not charcoal, was a 30 - 50 micron.

Looks like I need to mail order a 5 micron cartridge - any recommendations?

Cheers!

How long has it been fermenting?

Octavius said:

Juan,
Yeah, I had used gelatin - which is normally great at clarifying - but this grain particle cloudiness is still there.

OK, the Filter Housing, etc, from Lowes was very easy to set up and use, unfortunately it did squat.

The only filter cartridge that Lowes (or Home Depot) had, that was not charcoal, was a 30 - 50 micron.

Looks like I need to mail order a 5 micron cartridge - any recommendations?

Cheers!

Click to expand...

a charcoal filter will remove more than just the grain particles, maybe some of the flavors you want to keep.

HP,
Fermented a week, may 10 days (should keep better notes) (low alcohol Pale Ale)

EastOak,
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. But the stores have not got anything finer than 30-50 microns that is not charcoal so I was thinking of ordering a 5 micron (non-charcoal) from somewhere online.
Cheers

Jack Daniels uses a 10 ft deep bed of charcoal to mellow their whiskey.

Just got back from Ace Hardware - they have the full range of non-carbon filters!
10, 5 and 1 microns (about $10 for a 2 pack).

Any suggestions on the one to use for removing this pesky haze?

Cheers!

You know, 10 days is pretty short for a fermentation, let it go another week. I don't believe your seeing grain particles, but something else. Generally, when yeast has had a chance to do its work, the particulates drop out with the yeast. Whether this has anything to do with your situation, I don't know.

I do know that this is a pretty green beer, it's pretty premature to be adding gelatin and filtering at this point.

In any case, a hazy beer is still beer after all. Like Buddy Guy says, "You can't tell the difference once you get 'em in the dark"

Northcalais40,
Thanks for the reply.
Looks like I need to review my practices, ha!
For a low alcohol pale ale, can you recommend a typical time period for fermentation and a typical time period for aging?
For this brew, I saw the running on the second sparge and they were cloudy - something I have never seen before. I think I was over-enthusiastic on the stirring-in of the sparge water (batch sparge). Instead of a wooden paddle, I was trying out a length of copper tubing, chucked into an electric drill - worked great but maybe I didn't wait long enough for the grain bed to settle. Also, I was thinking maybe the super-agitation disconnected my home-made copper fliter in the mash tun somehow.
Yeah, and the beer has a horrible grainy taste. I'm not super picky but something has to be done about it or I'm going to empty it. 15 gal down the drain - enough to make my cry.
Cheers!

No! Don't toss it! Any grain in the kettle or fermenter is going to drop out. I can't say what your haze is, but it ain't grain. As for fermentation time, I wait 10 days, take a reading, wait 4 days, take a reading. If the gravity is the same, I'll bottle, if not I'll wait a few more days and check again. As a general rule, ferment for 2 weeks min. for a low OG brew. Some will finish sooner for sure though. This is totally subjective based on your beer, your type and quantity and health of yeast, temp, etc...

The grainy taste, could be astringency, a wierd hop bitterness or who-all knows what. The beer when carbonated is going to taste different than it does in the fermenter.

An ale doesn't need to be aged, but it does need to be done. When you drink the first bottle, it probably won't be fully carbonated yet, and won't taste its best. The next one may be carbonated fully, but still won't taste its best. After 2 weeks in the bottle it will begin to taste like it should. Bottles should be left in a warmish spot for a week (like 70F) then some where cooler for a week (like 50F) then refrigerate them before drinking. I thought my latest brew sucked for the first 3 weeks, but now its coming in to its milk.

DON'T PANIC

Northcalais40,
Thanks for the advice.
I'm actually kegging my beer now but I think the jist of what you are saying should apply.
2 weeks + 2 weeks - man, that is a long time to wait! Ha!
Cheers!

I ran all the beer through the 1 micron filter and I think it tastes a bit better, slightly. Still cloudy (or rather, hazy).

Just thought on...
I usually aim for somewhere in between 150 and 155F for the mash but I missed it this time and ended up with 69C, which is about 156F. Do you think that may have anything to do with it?

I'll leave it a week and re-sample. Now I'm worried that it may be an infection. It doesn't taste horrible - just kinda grainy and I've never had it so hazy before.

Cheers!

Did you do any water adjustments with this beer? Did you measure mash pH and finished beer pH or do a conversion test?


I am thinking possibly a starch haze?

MachineShopBrewing said:

Did you do any water adjustments with this beer? Did you measure mash pH and finished beer pH or do a conversion test?


I am thinking possibly a starch haze?

Click to expand...

Wow! Good thinking on the starch haze.

I'm afraid I stopped taking measurements years ago when I thought I had things down pat.

I've just tried the starch test on the finished beer - came out negative, ie no starch but I'm not sure if that is relevant. I've always mashed for exactly 1 hour, btw. Next time I'm definitely taking an iodine reading on the mash.

pH of the finished beer is 5 (I should say, it is between 4 and 6) I used 1-14 pH papers so none too accurate.

I do like the idea of a starch haze. I would imagine starch has a kind of grainy taste to it - anybody know?

On the CaSO4/MgSO4 - I forgot to add them to the mash water (but added them to the 2 sparges - prolly too late by then, but hey.) I'm sure I've brewed without the salts before with no problem. (Our well water has 9 ppm Ca and 4 ppm Mg and alkalinity of 43 ppm)

Thanks for the reply.

Cheers!

OK, good news!

The sample I took yesterday for the pH and left in the glass, it is settling out. That is, there is an incredibly fine deposit on the bottom of the glass. The sample was still hazy but the settling is a good sign. At least we can rule out some sort of infection.
I have the 15 gal in 3 cornies. Would pressurizing with CO2 encourage settling?

Cheers!

Pressure won't help settling but time will. Slow down my friend! Sounds to me like you're rushing things.

Hoppus, Thanks for the post - I think you will be proved right.

OK, more good news:
I repeated the exact same brew yesterday. First runnings were clear, 2nd and 3rd were cloudy until I had collected approx 2 gal, then they ran clear!
I'm thinking my enthusiastic stirring (after introducing the 2 sparges) (with propellor in electric drill) caused the very fine particles in the mash to become free.
I think I'll go back to my trusty wooden paddle mixer and hand stir the grains in future.

Cheers!

That's good advice. You don't want to aerate too much at that stage anyway.

My last brew was a CDA that had the same issue but 4 weeks in the keg at 38* and you can read a book through it now. Just be patient and you'll probably end up fine.