Any problems with plate chillers??

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firefly765

firefly765

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I'm looking at pulling the trigger on a plate chiller (this one: http://www.dudadiesel.com/choose_item.php?id=HX1220

I'd like to know who has actually gotten an infected batch with a plate chiller? And did you sanitize it properly?

Seems like a lot of naysayers out there, but the people that actually have, and use them seem to swear by them. The old IC seem to be getting a bit midevil.

Thanks for any votes pro or con.

Also, if someone has one of these, what size threads do you have? I'm thinking the male thread in whatever standard garden hose is. What is that size? 3/4"???
 
I have one from the same place, works fine, no infections, Just doesn't work as good as my immersion chiller. I found out I don't like dealing with pumps (cleaning them) as such, i like the immersion chiller much better. I really needed to use a couple of pumps to get it to work right or there is whole lot of waste water. ( as if there is no waste water coming out of my immersion chiller)
 
Minimum size is a 30 plate and, since you live in a hot climate, the recommended size is a 40 plate. Get male NPT posts since they are easier to seal and clean.

The heat exchange capacity for competing models:

  1. shirron, duda 20 plate
  2. duda 30 plate
  3. therminator, duda 40 plate

Mcmaster and others sell garden hose fitting adapters for the cold side. I recommend quick disconnects (e.g., cam-lock) for the hot side.

I use the duda 30 plate coupled to a duda 20 plate after-chiller. 10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
 
lamarguy said:
Minimum size is a 30 plate and, since you live in a hot climate, the recommended size is a 40 plate. Get male NPT posts since they are easier to seal and clean.

The heat exchange capacity for competing models:

  1. shirron, duda 20 plate
  2. duda 30 plate
  3. therminator, duda 40 plate

Mcmaster and others sell garden hose fitting adapters for the cold side. I recommend quick disconnects (e.g., cam-lock) for the hot side.

I use the duda 30 plate coupled to a duda 20 plate after-chiller. 10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...

Do you use gravity, or pumps? (I'll be using gravity) How do you get down to 70F with 80F tap water?
 
Remember to backflush after each brewday. Most homebrew stores sell backflush kits for plate chillers but I made mine myself for probably $5-7 with a few parts from Lowe's. Using a hop bag also keeps hop debris from getting stuck in the plates.
 
Would Blichmann sell one if they didn't work? That's what I asked myself before making the plunge.
 
Whoa whoa whao, you cant just throw out general statements like this. For the most part they are untrue and just an opinoin.

If you are using a 20 plate chiller it might even be too BIG for your application. It all depends on surface area of ther chiller. The next thing to consider is Temp of wort, speed of wort entering chiller, temp of water, adn speed of water entering chiller. If the orignal poster is using gravity and only doing a 5 gallon batch a 20 plate might be good enough. You really need to do the heat transfer calculations to see what you need.

Furthermore. It is IMPOSIBLE to get wort cooler than the incoming water. You must be using some ohter water than 80 tap water if you are getting your temps down to 70.

lamarguy said:
Minimum size is a 30 plate and, since you live in a hot climate, the recommended size is a 40 plate. Get male NPT posts since they are easier to seal and clean.

The heat exchange capacity for competing models:

  1. shirron, duda 20 plate
  2. duda 30 plate
  3. therminator, duda 40 plate

Mcmaster and others sell garden hose fitting adapters for the cold side. I recommend quick disconnects (e.g., cam-lock) for the hot side.

I use the duda 30 plate coupled to a duda 20 plate after-chiller. 10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...
 
kegtoe said:
Whoa whoa whao, you cant just throw out general statements like this. For the most part they are untrue and just an opinoin.
Click to expand...

Wow, learn to use a spell checker and the guy asked for advice which, by definition, is someone's opinion. :rolleyes:

I'd love to hear what "general statements" I made that are "untrue". If you have anything to contribute, other than d-bag comments, please do so.
 
firefly765 said:
OK, so i guess i'm going to buy one. Is 3/4" standard garden hose size & is that what i should get? Male?
Click to expand...

get 1/2 in NPT male much easier to adapt to what ever you need garden hose thread is a weird thread and fittings are expensive
 
firefly765 said:
OK, so i guess i'm going to buy one. Is 3/4" standard garden hose size & is that what i should get? Male?
Click to expand...

Before you jump into a plate chiller, i would like to give my 2c. I have a Therminator. The Duda is much like it. The threads are male 1/2 in NPT except the male hose connection.

The plate chiller requires much more sanitation care than an IC. The proper IC is just as efficient or more so, than a plate chiller depending on design. The plate chiller must be back flushed, then cycled with PBW, then sanitized immediatly after use, or the chance of contamination is real.

I ran an experiment with the Thermiator by pouring distilled water through the beer side before using it, then streaking a plate to see if how bad the "critters" were. The streaks grew well. After that, I put the chiller in a pressure cooker for 15 min at 15 lbs before use.

In the end, it's your choice, but a well designed IC is just as efficient, easier to clean, and is self sanitizing.
 
ArtVandelay said:
I am really curious how to cool to 70F with 80F tap water and no prechiller.
Click to expand...

lamarguy said:
I use the duda 30 plate coupled to a duda 20 plate after-chiller. 10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...

jppost, thanks for clarifying. :)

An after-chiller uses less ice than a pre-chiller to achieve the same temperature drop. For example, which is more efficient?

  • 10 lbs of ice added to 10 gallons of 85F wort
  • 10 lbs of ice added to ~30 gallons of 80F tap water

Folks that use immersion chillers often take a similar approach - tap water until the desired temperature (e.g., 85F) is reached and then switch to a ice bath w/ pond pump.
 
sudbuster said:
The plate chiller requires much more sanitation care than an IC.
Click to expand...

It's like anything else on the cold-side of the brewery - it must be properly cleaned and sanitized. ;)

Cleaning is easy - backflush and recirculate hot PBW for ~15 minutes.

Sanitization is easy - recirculate 205+F wort for a couple of minutes, bake at 400F in your oven, or, as you mentioned, sterilize it in an autoclave.

IMHO, sterilization is just a tad bit overkill considering most of your other cold-side equipment is not sterile, just sanitized.

sudbuster said:
I ran an experiment with the Thermiator by pouring distilled water through the beer side before using it, then streaking a plate to see if how bad the "critters" were. The streaks grew well. After that, I put the chiller in a pressure cooker for 15 min at 15 lbs before use.
Click to expand...

What is your cleaning regime?
 
sudbuster said:
In the end, it's your choice, but a well designed IC is just as efficient, easier to clean, and is self sanitizing.
Click to expand...

An immersion chiller will never be as efficient as an equivalently-sized plate chiller. Period.

I encourage you to read Appendix C - Chillers.

If you choose an immersion chiller because you find it easier to clean and sanitize, that's great. But more efficient, it's not.
 
Ok I didn't want to, but here you go

you said:
10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...

He points out that with this statement you can literally not cool 150*F wort with 80*F water to achieve a final temperature of 70*F in your wort. Laws of thermodynamics state that this is IMPOSSIBLE. You say you use a pre-chiller, but 80*F water has no way of lowering the temperature of that unless the pre-chiller takes the 80*F water and drops it lower. However that being said you never stated that until later after you jumped on the guy.
 
onemanlan said:
He points out that with this statement you can literally not cool 150*F wort with 80*F water to achieve a final temperature of 70*F in your wort. Laws of thermodynamics state that this is IMPOSSIBLE.
Click to expand...

I'm enjoying this. I ask you to re-read this thread and you chose to chop off the most important sentence when quoting me. :D

My original statement was:

lamarguy said:
I use the duda 30 plate coupled to a duda 20 plate after-chiller. 10 gallons from boiling to ~70F in 10 minutes with ~80F tap water. Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...

I followed it up with:

lamarguy said:
Don't waste your time with a pre-chiller.
Click to expand...
 
I prefer my 30 plate chiller to the IC. Not by a wide margin, but it is easier to deal with. Cleaning is not a big deal if you have pumps and recirculate Oxy and hot water in both directions. It seems that I waste a ton of water either way. However compared to the amount of water the carpet cleaner guys use, I'd rather be putting the water to beer instead of clean carpets.
 
If you want to get tit-for-tat about it you didn't really specify what temperature the afterchiller was at at the time. Yes I cut off that sentence, but it's because you had said that the only cooling temperature used in this process was 80*F at the time w/o giving the temp of the afterchiller you use. Therefore at the time the guy you jumped on was correct in thinking what he did. Just please try to not attack people for questions of clarity regarding your statements. Its not very becoming of you.

I'm going to fight anymore over this because well lets be honest arguing on the internet is pointless.
 
I'd be curious of your opinion on the plate chiller vs immersion once you get it all set up firefly. As a fellow Floridian I too fight the battle of chilling my wort in a timely fashion.
 
patrck17 said:
I'd be curious of your opinion on the plate chiller vs immersion once you get it all set up firefly. As a fellow Floridian I too fight the battle of chilling my wort in a timely fashion.
Click to expand...

Will do. I ordered the 20 plate. I guess i have to figure out a hop filter now so i don't clog the thing!
 
onemanlan said:
"SNIP" ...I'm going to fight anymore over this because well lets be honest arguing on the internet is pointless.
Click to expand...

Finally....I was waiting for someone to make this point. Any serious discussion or argument on the Internet is like trying to win the Olympic 100 meter freestyle in the kiddie pool.

As for plate chillers, I was really tempted by the price of the chiller in question.....but it's too complicated to clean / maintain & I'd have to get a hop-blocker to use in conjunction with the plate chiller. I have 55F well water, so given the amount I brew, I'm just going to stick with my little 'ol copper immersion chiller.
 

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