An evil experiment

So here I am, racking off a finished mild ale into a keg when I look over at the kitchen counter and see two lonely gallons of apple juice on the counter.

I think to myself "You know what would taste good right now? HARD CIDER!". Alas, I have none in the house, and my batch of Apfelwein is two weeks from bottling.

With one of my fermenting buckets soon to be freed up, I think to myself that making a small batch of quick-and-dirty sweet hard cider would fill a hole in my larder.

Alas! I have no yeast! Woe is me!

But wait - I have the trub in my aforementioned and soon to be empty fermenter! And - as luck would have it, the trub is free of hop and grain detritus.

So... and evil plan is made...

- Rack off every bit of the yummy ale
- Unceremoniously dump a couple of gallons of apple juice on the yeast cake
- Wait a couple of days until there's just enough residual sugar to sweeten it to my liking, and enough alcohol to make it worth drinking (say, about 3.5% ABV)
- Cold crash to stop the fermentation and to rapidly achieve optimal swilling temperature
- Bottle back in the original containers, and drink it up quickly.

I can hear the naysayers already. I'll get off flavors from the dregs of my yummy ale... more off flavors from the ale yeast... and for the love of all that's sacred, I'm probably massively overpitching. Clearly, the person who cooked up this evil plan is insane, and must be stopped.

I hear the naysayers and you know what? They're probably right. This experiment in hobo chemistry can't possibly have a happy ending. Hundreds may die at tasting time. Even worse, GALLONS of fermentables may be ruined without a single person getting drunk!

Well, friends, that's why such experiments are done. It's all in the name of MAD HOBO SCIENCE, I tell you.

I have exceeding low expectations of this experiment. It will probably taste nasty, and smell worse. I'll probably drink it and wish I had something good (like MD 20/20 or Bud Light) to get the taste out of my mouth. It's entirely possible this will be the worst excuse for an alcoholic beverage in recorded history. But you know what? People have probably sought the heavenly embrace of intoxication with far, far worse swill that we can possibly imagine.


Best regards,

Dr. Evil, mad hobo scientist.

First bubble through the airlock 30 minutes after pitching. This one took off fast, as expected.

:insert diabolical laughter here:

LMAO! Great, great post! This post makes up for a lot of the fluff you sort through on here. Thanks for making my night.

It's less of a forum post and more of an expertly crafted mini-novella/soapbox speech/one-man show...

great!

I like it and I did something like it. I had an Irish stout that I racked off. I took one can of apple juice and one bottle of apple juice that was pretty old.
I added them to about 2 cups of sugar and ended up with a gravity of about 1.085 a little higher than I was looking for, all in the name of using what I had.
It now has been about 2 weeks and it is still fermenting, slow but still going. I checked the gravity and it is now at 1.025 or 7.88% ABV.
When I tasted it, the cider seemed a bit sweet to me still. At this point I'm just going to let it go.

I'm glad to see that I am not the only one that likes to play/experiment....

People who might be tempted / bribed / blackmailed / forced at knifepoint into tasting my creations should consider themselves fortunate that I didn't remember that I have a tub of honey on deck for a batch of mead. Not that I'd ever consider risking a gallon of fine raw honey on a ill-conceived experiment...

MaverickBrew said:

When I tasted it, the cider seemed a bit sweet to me still.

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Did you find there were any flavors carried over from your ale?

As I said, I'm going to cold crash mine and not let it dry out or get high in ABV. Kind of a session cider, I suppose. I want it sweet, I just don't want it nasty.

That's how we do it in the Evergreen State! :rockin:

CthulhuDreaming said:

Even worse, GALLONS of fermentables may be ruined without a single person getting drunk!

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this seems unlikely

every time i read this i think of the lab from Frankenstein with a batch of cider being raised to be struck by lightning

Thats a man after my own heart. Nothing better than ad-libbing as you go. I have made several meals similarly over the years. We call them fridge stew. Clean out the fridge and cook whatever you end up with. Some have been truly outstanding, others were not so much. I say the Hobo Evil Genius is on the right path. Let us know how that cider works out, I'm betting it turns out just right for a session cider with freinds.
Bob

kamkamdac said:

every time i read this i think of the lab from Frankenstein with a batch of cider being raised to be struck by lightning

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It's.... aliiiiiiiiiive!

Rbeckett said:

We call them fridge stew. Clean out the fridge and cook whatever you end up with.
Bob

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Here in Alaska we call that "Whatchagot Stew" and it's led to some incredibly tasty, if highly unorthodox dinners (seafood chili anyone?).

Drinking my cider now... Sooo yummy.. I decided not to let it go and try some tonight final gravity was 1.015 at 60 degrees. This is not a session cider.. It went from sweet to just right. I was surprised. As for using Stout Ale yeast from the Stout I racked, I can't taste any off flavors of signs of the Ale. (*I was hoping to pick up some kind of taste from it). One pint down an I I will make more of this when ever I can. For the cost of about 3 bucks it is well worth it. This is one of those that you set and forget...for about two weeks then rack off to a new jug. I now have two one gallon jugs of apple juice that is going strong. With these I used Nottingham yeast that I had. I think that these will come out much better.

that's why we brew... because it's OURS!!!

Crispin has been fermenting cider with stout, Belgian, sake and other strains for a while now...

Holy smokes - this is one turbo fermentation. It bubbled furiously for 24 hours and is now down to bubbling every 10-15 seconds or so. I suspect I've overshot my window to keep it sweet so it looks like it's going to have to go the distance.

Full and hungry yeast culture... need I say more? There are quite a few posts about dumping onto old ale trub. Just none recently.

Have you taken a gravity reading?

MaverickBrew said:

Have you taken a gravity reading?

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Not yet. I plan to do so when I get home from work tonight.

CthulhuDreaming, you made my day. I love to see when other people post their crazy experiments! My cider experiement (albeit much less exciting) was spur of the moment and in reverse. Plans came up and I couldn't fit in a full brew day so while at the store buying supplies, I picked up store bought apple juice and a ton of raw sugar / brown sugar to make my California Ale yeast (high attenuation) happy. Threw a 6 gal batch together in like 20 minutes.

Pulled it out last week. ~9%. 6 Gal. 30 min. $25 set and forget brew ... and all the brown sugar gives a nice molasses taste. Reused the yeasties on my Barleywine (and surprisingly they still seem to be happy in that 1.1 SG monstrosity).

Anyway, great post!

I did something very similar too!
I racked my Russian Imperial Stout to secondary on the first of the month, and at the same time pitched 2 gallons of apple juice and a little less than a pound of brown sugar onto 3/4 of the trub.
Fermentation kickstarted so fast. I am a the two week point and the krausen has just fallen. I plan on buying some more Whole Foods apple juice jugs so i can make more cider and rack these two gallons into the glass jugs they come in.

Cheers!

Great idea, I am gonna have to get some more apple juice and keep those pesky kids from drinking it before i can get it fermenting

CthulhuDreaming said:

I'll probably drink it and wish I had something good (like MD 20/20 or Bud Light)

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CthulhuDreaming said:

something good

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CthulhuDreaming said:

like Bud Light

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huh, wat?

I think that was sarcasm, lol. I have made some cider in the past using the not so recommended bread yeast method and it actually came out pretty good but was a bit dry. This should turn out great.

AntX said:

huh, wat?

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Pro tip: the OP was written very tongue-in-cheek.

MaverickBrew said:

Have you taken a gravity reading?

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1.008 when I racked and cold crashed it (48 hours after pitching yeast).

I'm quite surprised that it actually smells and tastes pretty good for it's age.

Update: Day 6 of my experiment. My hobo cider has been in jugs in the refer for about 3 days (airlocked for about 36 hours, capped after that). It's on the dry side of semi-sweet, almost completely clear, still, and surprisingly.... it doesn't smell or taste half bad. A teaspoon of sugar in a 12 oz glass gives it just enough sweetness. Without sweetener, it's a bit like an inexpensive table white wine, about midway between dry and semi-sweet, closer to dry.

Fine wine, it's not, but it is surprisingly drinkable. Considering the turbo fermentation and potential for contamination due to not re-santizing the fermentation vessel and airlock, I'm pleased with the results so far.

My next batch is going to be fermented in a pair of old rubber boots using wild yeast behind a dumpster, and aged for 8 hours under a freeway overpass.

CthulhuDreaming said:

Update: My next batch is going to be fermented in a pair of old rubber boots using wild yeast behind a dumpster, and aged for 8 hours under a freeway overpass.

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I've read this phrase somewhere before! Remind me? Or am I imagining this?

Anyhow, I enjoyed the OP and the comments following.

I have just tossed together a wild and wooly concoction and it seems to be doing fine (see my post, yesterday, in the Cider Forum). I had thought about adding a new must right on top of the 'cake', when I transfer my current brew later this month. Then I thought... "Nah. Better play it safe."

But then again... Maybe some of the qualities (assuming they're desirable qualities) will make it into my second batch, which will be much less adventurous than the current one (with Jackfruit, Lychee, Mango and Papaya juices). Thoughts?

I've read that brewers used to (?) go to a favourite pub that did brewing on-site, carry home a pint and use that to start a wort.

Dietrich said:

I've read this phrase somewhere before! Remind me? Or am I imagining this?

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As far as I know, I made it up on the spot. However, I was drunk at the time, so who knows. I've been known to say some off the wall stuff at times.

I have just tossed together a wild and wooly concoction and it seems to be doing fine (see my post, yesterday, in the Cider Forum). I had thought about adding a new must right on top of the 'cake', when I transfer my current brew later this month. Then I thought... "Nah. Better play it safe."

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Try it sometime with a batch you don't care about much (e.g. ordinary cheap apple juice).

I'm no expert by any means, but the way I see it, as long as your yeast cake is healthy and you don't infect anything while racking, the biggest issue is overpitching. Conceptually, it's not really any different than washing and re-using yeast, except that you aren't washing it and your yeast count will be higher.

In retrospect, if I had kept the fermentation temperature much lower and controlled, it might not have fermented out so fast.

I'm thinking I might try this method in lieu of a starter on a high-gravity ale and see how it goes, with proper temperature control this time. Perhaps I'll even do an identical batch at the same time using more orthodox processes as a control and see how it goes.

What can possibly go wrong?