Belma Hops

Chriso said:

I am actually kind of sad about the change, but for a very silly reason - I liked to re-use the nice mylar bags during divvying up and resealing my hops - and these new nitrogen-flushed bags seem like they're too "slick" for my FoodSaver to find the air in the bag. It fails to vacuum pretty much every time. Just means I have to use more FoodSaver bags than I have in the past, that's all. Oh well.

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I have not tried it and you probably have, but I was reading the other day about cutting off a piece of a non-foodsaver bag, placing it inside the mouth of the mylar bag, ridges down, and then vacuuming it. Seems this helps folks get good suction on mylar.

Just fold the edge of the bag over like this. Not the best picture, but you get the idea. The food saver will seal it like that.

theveganbrewer said:

cutting off a piece of a non-foodsaver bag, placing it inside the mouth of the mylar bag, ridges down, and then vacuuming it. Seems this helps folks get good suction on mylar.

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i just put the mylar bags inside a foodsaver bag and vacuum away. Make sure to use a looooong bag so you can cut & reuse 'til you run out of that particular pound

Hop bursted Belma APA - no onion or garlic at all with the leaf. Creamy, slightly spicy (black pepper) and fruit is what I'm getting. Didn't try pellets yet.

I've brewed 2 beers with Belma leaf hop - well actually three

Orange honey Belgian with chouffe yeast - only late hops
10 gallons Bitter at about 1.036 split up with London iii & chouffe yeast - had a little cascade but about 10oz of Belma

Will let you know when they age a bit

I'm mostly getting a faint tropical & strawberry w/ some resin similar to their super galena - so far I love this hop

cadillacandy said:

Hop bursted Belma APA - no onion or garlic at all with the leaf. Creamy, slightly spicy (black pepper) and fruit is what I'm getting. Didn't try pellets yet.

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That what I smelled with the leaf as well.. Had a subtle smooth, not super juicy profile of fruit and peppercorns. Perhaps a fruity, smoother Chinook.

What about a combo of Ahtanum, Belma, and Chinook for the flavor, aroma, and DH additions, bitter with Magnum?

You'll have something earthy, orangey, and mildly grapefruity.

bobbrews said:

You'll have something earthy, orangey, and mildly grapefruity.

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I was looking for more pine (to counteract the citrus) than earth. Should I go with Simcoe or maybe Zythos instead?

Then Columbus would be better here than Chinook. Simcoe would offer a good deal of fruitiness in addition to the musky pine it gives. Wouldn't use Zythos for that purpose either.

Hadn't thought about Columbus. Thanks.

bobbrews said:

Then Columbus would be better here than Chinook

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For pine? Non-sense. I'll never understand when people go on and on about Chinook just being "earthy" and "spicy". I know for a fact I'm not the only brewer in the world who thinks the two big things Chinook brings to the table are an intense pine, and pink grapefruit flavour/aroma. Yes, profiles can vary from crop to crop but go give your Chinook a smell; it's probably pretty piny and citrusy.

Edit: Be careful blending with Chinook if you do go that route though. I find it's such an intense, in your face hop that it tends to over-power the other hops in the blend. 20-25% Chinook with the rest Ahtanum and Belma would make sense to me.

Crustovsky said:

For pine? Non-sense. I'll never understand when people go on and on about Chinook just being "earthy" and "spicy". I know for a fact I'm not the only brewer in the world who thinks the two big things Chinook brings to the table are an intense pine, and pink grapefruit flavour/aroma. Yes, profiles can vary from crop to crop but go give your Chinook a smell; it's probably pretty piny and citrusy.

Edit: Be careful blending with Chinook if you do go that route though. I find it's such an intense, in your face hop that it tends to over-power the other hops in the blend. 20-25% Chinook with the rest Ahtanum and Belma would make sense to me.

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Yes. Chinook is not very pine forward IMO. Maybe that's not the case when it's rubbed between your palms, where you do sense more pine. But when it's used late in an IPA, I find it delivering a lot of musty, earthy grapefruit, with a kick of spice and herb to it, and a lowly pine backdrop. It's almost like Simcoe without all of that sweet/juicy added fruit character. Columbus however is full of dank, green, herbal, piney, resiny, grapefruit. It's much more pungent. I've brewed with both on more than a couple occasions. But take it or leave it. Looks like you're leaving it.

bobbrews said:

It's almost like Simcoe without all of that sweet/juicy added fruit character.

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Given that Simcoe is generally way up there on people's lists of piney hops along with Chinook, yes, I think I will be leaving it. Yes, Columbus is a more pungent and dank (my favourite descriptor for Columbus) hop overall, but again, thinking Chinook used as a late hop can't give a pine needle and spruce bough profile to a beer is absurd.

Pine is a common trait of Simcoe, but it's also very very fruity and borderline tropical. Simcoe tastes more like pine-fruit... if that were possible. Neither Columbus or Chinook have that added fruitiness which can detract those raw pine needle notes from being front of the pack. I wouldn't say Chinook will give you the sense of pine needle / spruce bough character more than Columbus would. But hey, he can use both Chinook & Columbus if he chooses

So I just want to put my opinions on this hop here, and not contribute to all the back and forth bickering that has been going on. I just brewed a "Pumpkin IPA" recipe on Monday, dry hopped yesterday and took a gravity reading today, The beer is no where near ready but the smell from one day of dry hopping with a LOT of belma and some simcoe is very awesome! So here is the recipe:

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 8.26 gal
Post Boil Volume: 6.76 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 6.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.75 gal
Estimated OG: 1.060 SG
Estimated Color: 10.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 77.1 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 70.4 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
6 lbs 6.4 oz Pumpkin (3.0 SRM) Adjunct 1 30.5 %
12 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 2 57.1 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 3 4.8 %
1 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 4 4.8 %
8.0 oz Victory Malt (25.0 SRM) Grain 5 2.4 %
1.6 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 6 0.5 %
50.00 g Perle [7.50 %] - Boil 40.0 min Hop 7 38.1 IBUs
15.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 40. Hop 8 21.3 IBUs
55.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [12.00 %] - Boil 10. Hop 9 17.6 IBUs
40.00 g Belma [12.10 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 10 0.0 IBUs
30.00 g Caliente [13.50 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
30.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
12.00 oz Pumpkin Seeds-toasted (Boil 0.0 mins) Other 13 -
1.0 pkg Thames Valley Ale (Wyeast Labs #1275) [0 Yeast 14 -
80.30 g Belma [12.10 %] - Dry Hop 12.0 Days Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
51.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 12.0 Days Hop 16 0.0 IBUs

Like I said, Lots of hops, somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 IBUs and about 220g of hops in the kettle and 130g dry hopping. Compared with my previous beers using simcoe alone as a dry hop, this one with belma and simcoe provided a huge citrus and pineapple fruit on the first sniff, then melon and mango on the second, and finally I got a strong strawberry starburst candy aroma at the end, way more tropical fruits than simcoe alone. Very cool

but that said with a bit over 4 oz of dryhops I should be getting some awesome aroma, Oh and it was simcoe pellets and whole leaf belma

Mine get here tomorrow. Was going to try and force myself to brew an ipa, but the strawberry tropical talk has me thinking saison.

I'm going to brew my favorite IPA recipe with Belma and who knows what other hops on Sunday. Have a pound of Belma so not limited. Been reading this thread and have the sense it does well for dry hop and for flavor. I have been trying to make sense of the blending characteristics but I'm a bit confused.

Picture 6 gallons of an 8% ABV brew with 80% two row, 5% each aromatic and carapils, 8% crystal 20 and 2% acidulated malt. Bitter with 2 oz of Magnum at first wort, flavor with 1 oz of Belma and 1 oz of Simcoe at 15 min, aroma at 1 min with 1 oz each of Belma and Simcoe and dry hop with 2 oz Belma and 1 oz Simcoe.

Sound tasty? Need more hop complexity? Need more Belma? Open to input.

bobbrews said:

both Chinook & Columbus

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Now we're talking! I support this option 100%.

Crustovsky said:

Now we're talking! I support this option 100%.

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Drinking Flying Fish Exit 16 Wild Rice IIPA right now. It's dryhopped with Chinook and Citra. And I actually have to agree. Chinook is VERY piney. The pine can't be from the Citra.

It's also brewed with Columbus, Centennial, and Simcoe late in the boil, but I won't attribute all that pine to those three more than the Chinook dryhop.

You win, sir. Guess I have to go back to the drawing board with Chinook when used late. I typicaly brew dry tropical, fruity IIPAs. And even when I use Chinook, I'm not delicate with the Citra, Amarillo, Centennial, and Simcoe, which can overpower Chinook at times depending on the amount used. This beer that I'm drinking now actually melds the flavors of every one of those hops (sans the Amarillo with added Columbus) quite nicely.

Brewitt said:

I'm going to brew my favorite IPA recipe with Belma and who knows what other hops on Sunday. Have a pound of Belma so not limited. Been reading this thread and have the sense it does well for dry hop and for flavor. I have been trying to make sense of the blending characteristics but I'm a bit confused.

Picture 6 gallons of an 8% ABV brew with 80% two row, 5% each aromatic and carapils, 8% crystal 20 and 2% acidulated malt. Bitter with 2 oz of Magnum at first wort, flavor with 1 oz of Belma and 1 oz of Simcoe at 15 min, aroma at 1 min with 1 oz each of Belma and Simcoe and dry hop with 2 oz Belma and 1 oz Simcoe.

Sound tasty? Need more hop complexity? Need more Belma? Open to input.

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Sounds good, but I would cut back on the Simcoe a bit (just me). Maybe throw a little Centennial in for the dry hop or Amarillo at one of the late additions in place of the Simcoe for one of those steps.

If I can get three brews in, I'm doing an all Belma, Bam Biere inspired petite saison. If not, it'll be in the mash tun this time tomorrow.

Dry hopped my Belgian red with 3 oz of Belma only and my ESB with an oz each of Belma, Cascade, and Citra today. Thinking 14 days in the hops....

Those of you who have brewed with Belma, what would you think of subbing it in Skeeter's 3 Floyd's Zombie Dust recipe instead of Citra?

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
11.75 lb 2 Row (2.0 SRM) Grain 81.7 %
1.13 lb Munich Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 7.8 %
0.50 lb Carafoam (2.0 SRM) Grain 3.5 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 3.5 %
0.50 lb Melanoiden Malt (20.0 SRM) Grain 3.5 %
0.75 oz Citra [12.40%] (First Wort Hop) Hops 17.0 IBU***
1.25 oz Citra [12.40%] (15 min) Hops 21.1 IBU
1.25 oz Citra [12.40%] (10 min) Hops 15.4 IBU
1.25 oz Citra [12.40%] (5 min) Hops 8.5 IBU
1.25 oz Citra [12.40%] (1 min) Hops 1.8 IBU
3.00 oz Citra [12.40%] (Dry Hop 10 days) Hops -
SafAle English Ale (S-04) **
London ESB 1968**

chutracheese said:

Those of you who have brewed with Belma, what would you think of subbing it in Skeeter's 3 Floyd's Zombie Dust recipe instead of Citra?

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It's a far cry from Citra and it makes a totally different beer. Not nearly as good as the Citra version, but still a decent beer.

Opened my bag of Belma today. Definitely get the allium/garlicky smell in the bag, but not when I weighed the hops out. Only used an oz & a half in 11 gallons.

jammin said:

It's a far cry from Citra and it makes a totally different beer. Not nearly as good as the Citra version, but still a decent beer.

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Sure, I didn't expect it to be a direct substitute - asking more if anyone thought this would be a good use of Belma.

Brewed yesterday, SMaSH brew called "Velma".
12# Vienna malt
5oz Belma hops total:
0.25oz FWH, 0.25oz 20 Mins, 1.5oz 10 Mins, 1.5oz 2 Mins, and it will get 1.5 Oz more dry-hop in a few days once fermentation is done.
Pitched a jar of washed American Ale yeast that came out of my Rye IPA which got kegged yesterday.

chutracheese said:

Sure, I didn't expect it to be a direct substitute - asking more if anyone thought this would be a good use of Belma.

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The Z.D. recipe might let the hops come through well, even give it a chance to show it's "sweeter" side since 1968 finishes sweet.

I would add more Belma through the 15/10/5/1 additions though, maybe bump it to 1.5 or 2 oz even, I have found that Belma is on the soft side of the aroma/flavor spectrum compared to Citra.

Chriso said:

Brewed yesterday, SMaSH brew called "Velma".
12# Vienna malt
5oz Belma hops total:
0.25oz FWH, 0.25oz 20 Mins, 1.5oz 10 Mins, 1.5oz 2 Mins, and it will get 1.5 Oz more dry-hop in a few days once fermentation is done.
Pitched a jar of washed American Ale yeast that came out of my Rye IPA which got kegged yesterday.

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1) great name
2) sounds tasty. let us know how it turns out.

FourSeasonAngler said:

The Z.D. recipe might let the hops come through well, even give it a chance to show it's "sweeter" side since 1968 finishes sweet.

I would add more Belma through the 15/10/5/1 additions though, maybe bump it to 1.5 or 2 oz even, I have found that Belma is on the soft side of the aroma/flavor spectrum compared to Citra.

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Thanks

Has anyone dry hopped yet?

I have a Belma Pale ale that tasted pretty nice right out of the fermenter, but not a ton of citrus IMHO. It was more of a pungent, earthy kind of flavor.

Then I dryhopped with 1.5oz of Belma in the keg, and today, I'm wondering if I'll be able to even drink the rest of the beer.

Just one person's anectdotal experience. I think I'll use mine for bittering mostly, and keep it to the boil exclusively. I just don't enjoy it's dryhop flavor AT ALL.

jbaysurfer said:

Has anyone dry hopped yet?

I have a Belma Pale ale that tasted pretty nice right out of the fermenter, but not a ton of citrus IMHO. It was more of a pungent, earthy kind of flavor.

Then I dryhopped with 1.5oz of Belma in the keg, and today, I'm wondering if I'll be able to even drink the rest of the beer.

Just one person's anectdotal experience. I think I'll use mine for bittering mostly, and keep it to the boil exclusively. I just don't enjoy it's dryhop flavor AT ALL.

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how would you describe the undesirable dry hop flavor?

sweetcell said:

how would you describe the undesirable dry hop flavor?

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LOL...I though alot about this when I was thinking I'd post my findings up on this thread....and I couldn't come up with anything better then:

Just not right.

I'll taste it again today when I get home from work and try to give you something a bit more tangible then that.

Thanks for the warning. I was planning to dryhop with 1.5oz just as you did. I will wait & watch...

I dry hopped with 4ozs and its fine. I think it's better suited for heavy dry hopping. The flavors are mild so extra duty helps out.


Edit:
Drink'n on a bomber of my Belma Zombie Dust clone. I'm getting an earthy, slightly fruity Centennial. That's promising imho.

I had my all Belma Pale Ale(along with IPA and IRA) on tap for Sunday NFL/Homebrewers tasting afternoon. Nearly everyone who tried it said it was "different" or "odd" and tasted like strawberries and/or melon. No one disliked it, but not many refills on that one. The brewers who are into Belgians, thought it would work well in fruity, estery Belgian brews.

jammin said:

I dry hopped with 4ozs and its fine. I think it's better suited for heavy dry hopping. The flavors are mild so extra duty helps out.

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I've got a Belma/Simcoe IPA fermenting. All additions are 2:1 Belma:Simcoe. I was planning to dry hop with 3 oz Belma and 1.5 oz Simcoe. Will it be enough?

TimBrewz said:

I had my all Belma Pale Ale(along with IPA and IRA) on tap for Sunday NFL/Homebrewers tasting afternoon. Nearly everyone who tried it said it was "different" or "odd" and tasted like strawberries and/or melon. No one disliked it, but not many refills on that one. The brewers who are into Belgians, thought it would work well in fruity, estery Belgian brews.

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I have had similar reviews of my all belma amber ale. Strong berry nose and a mild berry/citrus flavor with a hint of spice. Tomorrow is brew club so I will have a few more experienced brewers tasting it then. I also handed out 12 at work to random guys interested in craft beer. Should have those opinions on Monday or so. Ultimately I like it but feel it isn't a good stand alone hop. I just need to find that great pairing.

jammin said:

I dry hopped with 4ozs and its fine. I think it's better suited for heavy dry hopping. The flavors are mild so extra duty helps out.


Edit:
Drink'n on a bomber of my Belma Zombie Dust clone. I'm getting an earthy, slightly fruity Centennial. That's promising imho.

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That's a gorgeous beer. I'm getting grassy from Belma (for the poster who asked me what was unpleasant about my dryhop with Belma). Way more grass then fruit tbh. It's been 5 days now and I'm going to pull the dryhops from the keg after turkey day..we'll see.

I think it's going to mellow in time, and I have to say, since I last posted, it's definitely improved....but I'm still not going to dry hop with this one, though at this point, I do wish I'd have used 3oz given your suggestion of heavy dryhopping. It's still going to be a tough sell of the 5 beers I currently have on tap. It was great before the dryhop, but now I'm just hoping for the best.