Spiced-herbal saison / help me recovering a mess

Hi all,
i'm trying to ferment one of my first batches after some discrete ciders and wines.



The problem is: the mash/lauter tun I made is brand new and so i can just exitmate my efficiency and i really forgot to take down OG on the brew day.
The beer was fermented warm and did vigorous ferm on days 1-2, but slowed down and stopped now (day 4).
Actual gravity is very high 1.060 and looking in my glass carboy I can't see foam, but i see crumbs of material that I suspect is yeast. Tasting the beer is obviusly sweet and little to none alcholic.

About the high ferm temps, i know, but can't do anything better. Wyeast specs set the yeast from 21 to 35°C, so I... was... pretty relaxed on this.

Please, have you have some hints how to restart this?

Since there is still evidence of foam(krausen) and yeast in suspension and it's only day 4 my take is it's still fermenting and it's not done yet.

Without an OG it's difficult to know if its moved much but I will assume it has and still needs more time, give it a gentle swirl by moving the Carboy and another week and then see where it's at

duboman said:

Since there is still evidence of foam(krausen) and yeast in suspension and it's only day 4 my take is it's still fermenting and it's not done yet.

Without an OG it's difficult to know if its moved much but I will assume it has and still needs more time, give it a gentle swirl by moving the Carboy and another week and then see where it's at

Click to expand...

Thanks a lot for the interest!
Krausen is not present at this moment; and yes... i'm planning to use the watch&wait approach (finger crossed ), but i'm worried beacuse airlock shows no activity at all: the water level is equal in both the chambers of the siphon.
...and yes, is really airlocked and the carboy is glass and tested.

Some moments before i re-oxygenated, energically. Hope to wake up this lazy boy!!

dont go by airlock activity when the fermentation slows co2 is absorbed slightly back into the solution which causes that slight back pressure (atleast thats what i think?) always trust your hydrometer and a rule of thumb for myself. No matter what style beer i always keep it on the trub for atleast 2-3 weeks if not more and rarely secondary

Let the beer be beer and go enjoy a homebrew :rockin:

Thanks for supporting!
I'll monitor the situation for the next days and go for some update, guys.
I'm afraid it needs a re-pitch, but for now... let's be positive.!!

Hello and good sunday all.
I'm back there. Last 2 gravities were 1.060, no way.
It doesn't move by one single point. No krausen, no bubbles from the airlock.
I really think my ferm i stuck. Really there are no tricks to fix that a part from re-pitching?

In plus, I can't figure out what happened.

It looks to me that you may have under pitched your yeast. I'm assuming you used one vial? Generally, one vial is fine for 5 gallons (~18L) at an SG of 1.050 but at an estimate your wort was closer to 1.070. With a warm temp and swirling yeast already, I can't think of anything else to suggest.

If you can get Wyeast3711 Fench Saison yeast, I would recommend making a 500ml starter with the 3711 and pitch it into your Saison at high krausen. You might be able to get away without the starter in a pinch. If you can't get that, I would use S-05 dry yeast (rehydrated) or wlp001 Cal Ale. It probably won't taste as much like a Saison, but it should attenuate out and be drinkable.

Piratwolf said:

It looks to me that you may have under pitched your yeast. I'm assuming you used one vial? Generally, one vial is fine for 5 gallons (~18L) at an SG of 1.050 but at an estimate your wort was closer to 1.070. With a warm temp and swirling yeast already, I can't think of anything else to suggest.

If you can get Wyeast3711 Fench Saison yeast, I would recommend making a 500ml starter with the 3711 and pitch it into your Saison at high krausen. You might be able to get away without the starter in a pinch. If you can't get that, I would use S-05 dry yeast (rehydrated) or wlp001 Cal Ale. It probably won't taste as much like a Saison, but it should attenuate out and be drinkable.

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Thanks Piratwolf.
Reading and searching on the web I just came at the same conclusion.
Beacuse, yes, I used one "vial" (actually, they more like a sort of pouch) without starting it. I just activated it 2 days before the brew day and pitched directly. I thought it wasn't so much for that gravity.

Today in the afternoon i noticed some really small bubbles popping on the surface... but gravity isn't moving. Just now i tried another swirl, breaking the cake on the bottom (i've glass carboy) and trying to re-suspend the boy.

If it's fixed i should see some bubbling in the next day huh?

For re-pitiching I'm oriented on get another WY3724, with a serious starter. Should be fine, or not?

Update!
airlock is bubbling... rate 1-2/min!
Seems that areation worked: some sort of fermentation restarted.

How can I improve that?

Perhaps aerate first next time? And definitely do a starter . Cheers on signs of life

Piratwolf said:

Perhaps aerate first next time? And definitely do a starter . Cheers on signs of life

Click to expand...

Ja ja ja. Wyeast direct-pitch it is not so direct for beers a little stronger.
With that slow fermentation restarted, is correct to think that living cells will reproduct and fermentation will accellerate?
Because I suspect that rate of activity will use a year to clear that bunch of sugars (1.060)

The lag phase (delay) you saw was probably a reproduction phase--if I recall correctly, that period does not give bubbles much. So ja, I would expect accelerated fermentation over the next 24-48 hours.

Piratwolf said:

The lag phase (delay) you saw was probably a reproduction phase--if I recall correctly, that period does not give bubbles much. So ja, I would expect accelerated fermentation over the next 24-48 hours.

Click to expand...

Wow. I hope.
Today reading (in the morning) was 1.058 showing the correct sign of small fermentation.
Now, the bubbling rate is almost the same, maybe a very little incremented (or maybe is my positivism?) ... some little shaking and this evening i moved it to a warmer place (30°C).
I hope that he will catch my hint

Updates soon!