Tron's Better Bottle Warmer

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TronCarter

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Location
Kalamazoo, MI
I'm new to this hobby, so forgive me if this idea has been done before. I would be surprised if it hadn't. I'm making my first batch of EdWort's Apfelwein and wanted to keep my carboy at 70-72F while in the fall and winter my house is usually around 64F. One of my other hobbies is saltwater aquariums, so I had a supply of heaters that weren't being used. I bought an oil drain pan from Menards for $7.44, cut a hole in the top for the BB, a small hole for the heater, put in the BB, filled the pan with 2 gallons of water, set the heater for 70, put it in, and I was done. Let me know what you think.

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Full sized images:

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Nice indirect heating, there! Looks like a cheap'n easy winner to me, and I haven't heard of it before.
 
Looks good, but I would say 64 F is a better temp. than 70 F for most ales.
 
Where does the water flow, or does it just sit in the interior of the drain pan, so the carboy is never actually touching the water?
When you set the water for 70F, and the large carboy is sitting 1/2 inch above the water, if the room temp is 60, will the carboy liquid even come close to 65F? I like the idea, just curious if there's enough heat transfer. Is there a thermometer "label" on your carboy so you can see the temp of the fluid?
 
LouT said:
Where does the water flow, or does it just sit in the interior of the drain pan, so the carboy is never actually touching the water?
When you set the water for 70F, and the large carboy is sitting 1/2 inch above the water, if the room temp is 60, will the carboy liquid even come close to 65F? I like the idea, just curious if there's enough heat transfer. Is there a thermometer "label" on your carboy so you can see the temp of the fluid?

The carboy sits on the bottom of the drain pan and the water flows all around it, so it is touching the sides of the carboy all around to a height of about 5 inches. The heater is in the water which heats the carboy by direct contact.

No thermometer label. There is a vent hole on the handle that is just like the vent on the back of a plastic gasoline can. I can poke a digital probe thermometer through to monitor temperature.
 
This is what I do in the cooler months except I use a ten gal plastic trash can for a 5 gal carboy with an aquarium heater. I fill it nearly to the wort line to maximize heat transfer.

I also use a 25 gallon rubbermaid storage bin for two 5 gal carboys. In this one I run the aquarium heater and an aquarium pump to circulate the water.

I put a little bleach in the water so it doesn't smell funny after a few days.

Never thought about using a shallow pan, should work just as well, that's a good idea.
 
I am liking this idea. In the winter I want to brew some ales and maybe even a lager. How good would this do in a garage dead middle of the winter? Maybe get a 10 gallon trash can and fill the water line up to the wort line, would the aquarium heater keep the water heated to where it needs to be in a garage where temperatures sometimes drop below freezing?
 
I like your idea, originally misunderstood that you had cut a hole for the carboy. I still think a stick on thermometer about halfway up the carboy will give a better measure of the actual beer temp.

I'm going to steal this concept shamelessly for my own use! Thanks for posting!

I wonder how many watts an aquarium heater is. That would be useful for answering the above question about use in a garage.
 
LouT said:
I like your idea, originally misunderstood that you had cut a hole for the carboy. I still think a stick on thermometer about halfway up the carboy will give a better measure of the actual beer temp.

I'm going to steal this concept shamelessly for my own use! Thanks for posting!

I wonder how many watts an aquarium heater is. That would be useful for answering the above question about use in a garage.


According to the box i have in front of me a submersible aquarium heater rated for 15-40 gallons is rated at 100 W
 
Cool, rated for 15-40 gallons - so it shouldn't have too much trouble keeping 6 gallons warm in a basement in the 50's. Might be tough in a garage, though!
 
LouT said:
I like your idea, originally misunderstood that you had cut a hole for the carboy. I still think a stick on thermometer about halfway up the carboy will give a better measure of the actual beer temp.

I'm going to steal this concept shamelessly for my own use! Thanks for posting!

I wonder how many watts an aquarium heater is. That would be useful for answering the above question about use in a garage.

Stick on thermometers: notoriously inaccurate

Steal? It's not stealing, that's why I posted it, to share with my friends.

Here is what I found:

Gallons/Liters 5ºC/9ºF 10ºC/18ºF 15ºC/27ºF
5 gal/25 L 25 watt 50 watt 75 watt
10 gal/50 L 50 watt 75 watt 75 watt
20 gal/75 L 50 watt 75 watt 150 watt
25 gal/100 L 75 watt 100 watt 200 watt
40 gal/150 L 100 watt 150 watt 300 watt
50 gal/200 L 150 watt 200 watt two 200 watt
65 gal/250 L 200 watt 250 watt two 250 watt
75 gal/300 L 250 watt 300 watt two 300 watt

Instructions:
Subtract the average temperature of the room the aquarium is located in from the temperature you wish to maintain the aquarium water at. Find the size of your aquarium in the left hand column and move to the column that shows the number of degrees the aquarium needs to be heated. If the heating requirement is between levels, move up to the next larger size.
In larger tanks, or where the room temperature is significantly below the desired water temperature, two heaters may be required. Heaters should be installed at opposite ends of the aquarium to heat it more evenly.

Example:
Average Room Temp = 68 degrees F
Desired Water Temp = 77 degrees F
-----------------------------------------
Heating required = 9 degrees F

Tank Size = 20 gallon
Heater size needed = 50 watts

Also, I am using a 7.5 watt heater, the smallest I could find, and it is holding ~8 gallons (2 water + 6 Apfelwein) at 73F in a ~66-68F kitchen.
 
You can buy aquarium heaters all the way up to 500w and if that isnt enough you could use multiples so theroreticaly (sp?) you could do it in the garage with enough wattage.
 
dataz722 said:
You can buy aquarium heaters all the way up to 500w and if that isnt enough you could use multiples so theroreticaly (sp?) you could do it in the garage with enough wattage.

I think maybe before I would do that I would build some kind of insulated box and maybe use a space heater with a thermostat, or just do it inside.
 
Tron! You inspired me! I was searching for a way to keep my Wyeast 3726 Farmhouse yeast going (I've read that it can take 6+ weeks to ferment if left in the 70's). With this setup, I'm easily able to maintain 85F in my 72F basement...

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Without the plastic bag covering it, it didn't want to get over 80F. I'm using a submersible aquarium heater rated for up to 40gal...

Up until I read your post and this idea clicked in my head, I was trying to do this with an "Air Incubation Chamber" - a sheet making an enclosure with a 75-watt bulb inside. It works fairly well to maintain 78F, but you can't really control the temp at all. (You can see that in the background).

This setup is AWESOME!! The temp is very controllable, and it only cost me the $22 for the aquarium heater!! Thanks for the inspiration, Tron! Thanks for posting!
 
Stick on thermometers: notoriously inaccurate

Really? I've never heard that before. There was a discussion on either the Jamil Show or the Sunday Session about an experiment that was done and found the stick ons to be within 1 degree of the temperature in the center of the carboy.
 
Nice idea - I might be able to lager this winter after all.
 
Noob question time. Why not sanitize the heater modify a stopper to allow the wires to pass out of the bottle and put the heater directly in the must? The Marineland Stealth Visi-Therm Submersible Aquarium Heater 25W is about 25 dollars and just one of several that are fully submersible. Some even have the temp control on the AC plug end so its easier to adjust. You can notch the stopper and then seal the stopper with food grade silicon to get the wire out of the carboy. Set the thermostat to the temp you want and its automatic after that. Seems like an easier way and a lot less hassle.
 
Noob question time. Why not sanitize the heater modify a stopper to allow the wires to pass out of the bottle and put the heater directly in the must?

All in all, not a terrible idea, but my reasons for not doing that are:

1) I didn't want to cut my stopper or sanitize the heater. Also, if you want to adjust the temperature, you have to remove it, turn the dial, and then re-sanitize it to put it back.

2) I didn't want to risk the heater getting too hot right around it and thus killing some of the yeast or doing some other damage to the wine.

3) I don't know how a heater that is made for water will react to alcohol and also didn't want to find out the hard way.

4) If the heater breaks (which does happen in the aquarium world) it would not contaminate the wine.

I use an ice cube cooler and a small fountain pump to keep the water circulating.

Also a great idea. It would hold in more heat and use less electricity.

great idea.


And it works well.

;)

Yes, great minds think alike. :D
 
1: Well, They do make heaters that have the temp control on the wal plug end so once in it does not have to be removed to change the temp. You can sanatize it with a spray of star san so thats not an issue.

2:The temp right around the heater will not exceed the setting. Thats where the temp reading is taken.

3: A sealed heater wont know the difference in alcohol or water it wont be an issue.

4: Breakage is a problem but not as big as you might think. Get the right one and its well build to start with.

I understand not wanting to do this but I just wanted to show that it would work.
 
I guess technically this can double as the destination for a blowoff tube as well. Could lead to a mess though.
 
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