How much will excess bitterness fade?

Hello all. I had my first real disappointment this week. Let me explain my process and then ask the question.

On February 20, I brewed AHS' extract Fat Tire clone. I did a full boil (but did not adjust the hops). I chilled the wort with an immersion chiller to 70 degrees in approximately 10 minutes, shook the heck out of the carboy and pitched a rehydrated pack of Nottingham. Fermentation temperatures were in the low to mid 60s. I hit the called out OG and FG. On March 20 I bottled. This weekend, I chilled three bottles and opened two last evening. Color was good, the head was good. But my word was the brew bitter. I mean overpoweringly so.

My newbie's brain tells me that failing to adjust the hops is the culprit, although I thought that the utilization would not change that much. I suppose I could have oxygenated the wort too much, which I understand may lead to astringency, which is kind like bitterness. I really don't think I have an infection, but I guess anything is possible.

So, the question is, will the bitterness fade? If so, how significant of a difference will there be? If the beer is astringent, will that fade?

Thanks for any help.

Can you provide your hop schedule? what hops added at what times?

Also, bitterness and astringency are two different things. bitter is, well, a basic component of taste. So, bitter is just bitter.
Astringency, on the other hand, is more like a puckering, medicinal flavor. Like cough syrup... or like how the smell of isopropyl (rubbing) alcohol would expect to taste.

I don't have my notes with me, but will post the hop schedule when I get home this evening. I was right on (within a minute or so) of the schedule laid out in AHS' directions.

I am pretty sure the flavor I am tasting is bitterness, not astringency. It is a little dry, a little puckering, but not at all medicinal. Maybe a bit alcoholic.

I assume there were steeping grains... did they get boiled?

You are describing more of astringency, not bitterness.... Which most often comes from tannins in the husks. Tannins are extracted from the husks at overly hot temperatures (around 180).

Bitterness from over hopping mellows out over time. I don't think astringency does, though.

It sounds like your timing (4 weeks fermenting, 3 week bottle) was good, but a little more time will always help. I wouldn't worry about over-aerating though, unless you're pumping pure oxygen through it its tough (or possibly impossible) to over-aerate.

Were the AHS instructions written up for a full boil, or partial boil? It sounds like you might have been considering that since you mention not adjusting the hops. I just ask because I grabbed a pale ale recipe from the LHBS when I first started, and the recipe was written up for partial boils with the full amount of extract. I'd just figured out late extract additions on here, but didn't take into account the hop utilization. Dropping some of the extract to late addition meant that my bittering hops were in a less dense wort, so more AAs got extracted and it was definitely more bitter than it should have been. On the plus side, I gave it an extra month in the keg and it mellowed out nicely, so you'll wind up being fine eventually. Taste one every now and then, and before you know it you'll be good to go.

Hey, thanks for the replies guys.

In order:

Yes, the recipe involved steeping grains. I believe the temperature stayed in the 150s though during this process. I could check the calibration of my thermometer. Maybe it is something that simple (which would mean my next batch is probably screwed up as well)

Yes, the instructions were for a partial boil. That is kind of where I have been thinking, that the increase to a full boil without a reduction in the hops made a big difference in the flavor profile. Hopefully it evens out over a bit of time.

Unionrdr, where are you located? I am in the Village, off of Abbe Rd. We should get together and trade some lies one of these days.

What size was the intended 'partial boil' for?

Aeration prior to fermentation is fine -

aeration after fermentation will lead to oxidation - which will taste like wet cardboard - not bitter, not astringent.

give it a few weeks and try another bottle -

Unionrdr, I am in College Heights.

The Pearson Farm - I believe that the recipe called for a 2.5 gallon boil, but could be wrong. As with the hops schedule, I will check the directions tonight.

It could be your water, a high sulfate content will accentuate the bitterness.

JayBullen said:

It could be your water, a high sulfate content will accentuate the bitterness.

Click to expand...

+1

I'll wait for the hop info to determine how much of a difference between a 2.5 gal boil and 6 gal...

Hey guys, thanks again for the help.

The hops schedule was .75oz target for 60 min; .5oz Williamette for 10 min; .5oz Kent Golding at end of boil.

The recipe called for a 3 gal boil, not 2.5.

Also, my sulfates are 30-32 ppm, which I understand is not too high. I haven't really messed with the water chemistry much yet, so I could be wrong.

Unionrdr, I am on Taylor. We should definitely get a brew day going when the weather gets nice!

k,

3 gal boil with those grains = 25 IBU using Tinseth
6 gal boil = 36.5 IBU Tinseth

That's pretty noticeable.

Also, it's more than just the sulfate level, it's the total water picture... but, chloride to sulfate level will determine the profile more than just the sulfate. What's the chloide level?

Chloride is 24-26 ppm

And yeah, 25-30% more IBUs seems like a pretty big difference. I really thought that the difference was miniscule.

okay, so chloride to sulfate ratio is 25:31 or .81

TH Produced a good water worksheet (found here: http://www.ezwatercalculator.com/)
Here's what he's posted about the ratio (from several sources including Palmer's How to Brew)

Below .50, Style = Very Bitter
.50 to .77, Style = Bitter
.77 to 1.3, Style = Balanced
1.3 to 2.0, Style = Malty
Above 2.0, Style = Very Malty

The lower the ratio, the more bitter the style will taste/feel. .81 is on the low end of balanced. As an amber ale, I would think that the ratio would be better around 1.5. Now, having said that, it requires water work... If you're not prepared, don't sweat it.

From the NBB site;
ABV - 5.2%
IBU - 18.5
Calories - 155
Hops - Willamette, Goldings, Target
Malts - Pale, C-80, Munich, Victory
OG - 12.6
TG - 2.2

The IBUs from NBB is only 18.5. Remember, that's in the finished beer. It was probably higher in the post boil wort. 25 was probably about right for the post boil, aiming for ~18 in the finished product.

remember, the ratio isn't going to simply produce a result, it helps (or hurts) influence the feel/taste to help (or hinder) you reach a certain profile. For example, if you want a malty, smooth, full-bodied ale that isn't terribly hoppy, target the higher ratio. It kind-of smooths the whole beer out and dulls the edge of the hop additions. If you want a hoppy IPA, drop the ratio to try and bring out the hoppy bitterness and characteristics. It just makes a cleaner, bitter beer (it doesn't prevent the smooth body but helps accentuate the hop bitterness).

Take a look at that calculator and do some reading... water is NOT as difficult as people think it is. I'd only venture down this path once you've developed your fermentation, sanitation and production processes though. Water will help take you to the next level once your at that point but won't overcome bad fermentation techniques.