Portable RIMS project -ideas and help needed.

I was inspired by several of the pump in a toolbox threads and the Simple brewery thread, so when I got a march pump for xmas I wanted to build one.
My 3 tier setup is gravity fed, so the main purpose for the pump is for mash temp control and recirculation, and also recirc for the BK when it comes to immersion chiller time. Somewhere down the line I will make a change to a single or 2 tier setup that will be all electric. For now though, I need to work with what I have and use this RIMS as a learning tool so I can get a better understanding of using PID's. Also, the RIMS could go anywhere 110 is available, so I could take it to a brewday, and stub it in to just about anyone's process who might like to try it out (once I have it dialed in, of course)
I got the RIMS tube from freddyb, he's used it with success and so has lehr. It has 3/8" stubs so I got 3/8" compression to 1/2" NPT adaptors, tees, bushings etc from bargainfittings. I bought an Auber PID and RTD, and have a SSR which I need to source a heatsink for.
The reason for my post is trying to figure out the routing of liquids. I was thinking about mounting the RIMS tube on the outside of the tool box, where a short piece of silicone could make a 90˚ to the pump which is mounted on the end of the box. Right now the pump head is rotated 90˚ but I will probably rotate it back to horizontal, as even with the 90˚ fitting, it hangs lower than the box itself. I may have to scrap this box and go for something a bit larger.
So. Should the wort go in the RIMS first and then through the pump OR pump then RIMS? If I can mount the RIMS to the back I could put the pump switch and PID on the front side of the box, with the SSR sink hanging out of the opposite end of the pump head.
Comments, questions, concerns, and advice are all appreciated. I have no idea what I'm doing with the PID, but I have read RIMS for dummies and any other RIMS related threads that I've seen here.

Here is the RIMS tube disassembled and before I got the stainless parts for the thermowell Tee.

And the 3 Tier I built that I'm currently using:

Route it pump then RIMS. This is a great project! Way to go.

The PID is really easy to tune and use, just read the little pamphlet that comes with it and it should make sense.

Keep us updated.

Bendavanza, what type of element are you using there in the picture? Was the rims tube specially fabricated or scrounged from something else?

It's a Watlow inline heater, unknown original purpose and model # but looking at their site they make all sorts of immersed heaters and food related equipment.
http://www.watlow.com/

What is the disadvantage of routing through the RIMS first?

This is really clever! Does the outside of the RIMS get very hot? If so will you insulate it, I can picture someone moving the toolbox and accidentally touching the RIMS. I love this idea, way cool!

Posting just so I can track this thread. A portable RIMS is a great way to preach the one true way!

I've got to keep track of this - looks promising.

You can put your hand on it when you mash I'm sure it's around 140 to 150 degrees on the outside.

Pat

bendavanza said:

What is the disadvantage of routing through the RIMS first?

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March (and all centrifugal) pumps are not positive displacement. The do not create a positive vacuum on the back side of the pump and as such do not self prime. You can think of it as pushing the liquid, not pulling it. You want to push the liquid through the RIMS and any other components. It can work on the inlet side of the pump but is not ideal.

Coderage has his positioned this way and his system works for him. But in general, it is a bad idea to restrict the flow in any way before the pump. You want as much flow as possible to the pump, then restrict it (ball valve, RIMS, HERMS, Chiller, etc.) downstream.

bendavanza said:

It's a Watlow inline heater, unknown original purpose and model # but looking at their site they make all sorts of immersed heaters and food related equipment.
http://www.watlow.com/

Click to expand...

We have equipment at watlow. We had a service guy there last month and I tried to talk him into grabbing me some heat sticks. He was in a different area though

I may wrap a loose layer of reflectix or similar around the RIMS tube but I'm not very concerned about getting burnt. I touch the ss fittings on my pump with 170˚ mash running through it, it's hot but not dangerous.

I'm very interested in this. I got a March pump for Christmas as well and I am looking at RIMS as well. I like the components of your RIMS tube.

I agree with the RIMS placement. The only advantage of having the RIMS before the pump would be to keep the RIMS heater wet at all times.

I would arrange it like this

pump inlet => pump outlet => RIMS => ball valve

This way you are controlling flow through the RIMS, adequately supplying the pump, and limiting flow as desired.

Some slight progress:
I took a slice of a giant Apple G5 heatsink. It may be overkill but I know it will keep the SSR happy. Next up is to drill and tap the sink. I radiused the outer edges because they were sharp.

I dont have a heat sink on mine and I dont feel any heat fron the box.

Pat

Have you seen this? Very similar.
http://www.brew-magic.com/rims_wizard.html

Take a look at the price. OMG! I built mine for less than $500.

I will have about $175 in this because the pump was a gift.

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

...
Coderage has his positioned this way and his system works for him. But in general, it is a bad idea to restrict the flow in any way before the pump. You want as much flow as possible to the pump, then restrict it (ball valve, RIMS, HERMS, Chiller, etc.) downstream.

Click to expand...

I don't think there is enough restriction in the HEX to make a difference. It is pretty free flowing and I can get about 5gpm of flow out of it.

The only problem I have had is that sometimes if I am not paying attention and it starts to get too hot, it will blow steam causing the pump to loose it's prime. I do have the temp probe too far away which is a big part of the problem. With proper probe placement I don't see putting the hex in front of the pump as a problem at all.

This morning I drilled/tapped the heatsink and attached the tube with a piece of wood. I will go pump then HEX although it would have made routing cleaner the other way round.
Next is mounting the PID, SSR, switches, and wiring it up.
Should I be concerned about the PID being in the same box as the pump? (HEAT, the liquid is all outside of the box)

Lots of progress today. Power cord with strain relief, switches with covers, SSR and PID holes cut and fitted, and some wiring.
I have 4 questions:
1) The RTD has 3 leads, 2 red one blue, which go where?
2) Can I just combine all my white leads with a twist connector or do I need to use a wire block like I did the grounds, and if I do so, is screwing it into plastic and wood adequate insulation?
3)Does the PID "need" a 1Amp fuse?
4) Will the pump create RF that would be an issue for the PID and or RTD leads?

Also please take a look at my rat's nest. I have a heavy duty power cord coming in, with the ground wire going to the ground block, the black wire going to the common on the double switch, and the white will be connected to all other whites (neutral, right?)
(larger image of the wires is here: https://cdn.homebrewtalk.com/gallery/data/1/MG_9953.JPG

Update: I figured out the RTD wiring, and entered 21 (for my unit) for the probe type.
I found an offset of about 3˚ from my new CDN proaccurate thermometer, so entering thet in, it would appear that I'm on target. Freddy said to set the max output to 80% but I had no problems with boiling using 100%, but i only had the water up to 140 or so for my test. It seemed that I was able to make a 20˚ rise in temp with reasonable flow rates. I may do another test with a smaller volume of water that's already 155˚.
Just one small leak to fix and I do think I'll be putting in a small exhaust fan. The pump gets the box fairly warm over an hour, or maybe I can just crack the lid open once my fluid connections are good. Hoorah!
BTW that heatsink is severe overkill (for the load), it barely got warm, and that may have been from the heat of the pump. The RTD sensor seems slow to lose heat.
Do you other RIMS users use the RIMS on a batch sparge or just for the main infusion?

Poppy wants.

I used my portable RIMS for the first time and even used it to ramp up the temp as a mashout, for whirlpool and for CIP of the IC/kettle. I got almost 75% efficiency so I'm pleased. My temp correction needs to be re adjusted by about 2˚. No stuck sparges even with corn and rice in the grain bill, but the almost new march pump motor quit at one point, so I blew it out with compressed air and oiled it. All was good. I'm still getting the hang of correctly priming the pump.
I also rehydrated my 2 S-05 packets with my stirplate, which was nice as I usually just sprinkle the yeast on the wort.

There will be more brewing this week.

Looks like i am too late, but it would have been sweet if you mounted the rims tube as the tool box handle.

That could get pretty hot for a handle.

Quick iPhone video:

That is a very utilitarian beer tool box you made there bendavanza.

Cheers;
BeerCanuck

Great Project. I've been reading through all the RIMS threads collecting ideas for my RIMS hex when I came across your thread. It really fits the scope of the project I wanted to take on. I already have the March Pump toolbox from an earlier DYI so that's a bonus.

Do you have a parts list for your project that you wouldn't mind sending me. I'll send you a PM as well.

Again great project it's really going to help my brew set up.

I got the PID and RTD probe from Auber Instruments, auberins.com1 x 1/16 DIN PID Temperature Controller (SSR control output) (SYL-2352) =$44.50
1 x Liquid tight RTD sensor, 2” probe, 1/4 NPT Thread (PT100-L50NPT) =$29.95
You may as well get your 40a SSR and heat sink from them as well, or find a cheaper equivalent on ebay, I already had the SSR and I made a heat sink from apple G5 parts. You really don't need much of a heatsink for this small load, mine never gets warm.

The Stainless Tees, barbs, compression fittings, etc. I got from Bargain Fittings. The RIMS tube's stubs are 3/8" OD so I used two 3/8 in OD tube x 1/2 in NPT (pipe thread) adapters and a 1/2 x 1/4 inch reducing bushing for the RTD probe.
http://www.greatbargain.net

The RIMS tube, that may be difficult to source unless freddyb still has some left. It is made by Watlow and I assume he bought them surplus or something. Here is a link to the thread that got my attention https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/35-rims-heater-133208/ I used plumbing strap clamps from home depot and covered them with heat shrink tube to mount it to the wood block. The shrink tube gives it better grip and should prevent from marking up the RIMS heater. Searching by the part # on the element I found this which may help you http://www.midohioresale.com/storepages/tube-heater.htm
The 3/8 OD stubs concerned me but they are short so they don't have too much affect on flow for Mash recirc but when I whirlpool the boil I disconnect the RIMS and use the march pump directly.
I would consider some kind of ventilation for the toolbox, I leave mine cracked open during the mash but I'd prefer some kind of shielded vent.
-Ben

bendavanza said:

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This is really cool, but you GOTTA paint that block of wood black or yellow or something!

I admit the block of wood was a last minute necessity because of the shape of the toolbox. Some black paint would do it some good.

This is sweet. It may be my baby step into electric brewing.

very cool, nice project

BenS said:

This is sweet. It may be my baby step into electric brewing.

Click to expand...

It certainly is for me. Now I am re thinking my entire brew rig and where I brew. It gave me a chance to learn about PID's and how all this electrical mumbo jumbo works.

Do you have a write up of the parts list to make this? I just got my tax return and I'm going RIMS!

Retrofit:
The closest thing would be post #32 above. March pump, Auber PID, SSR with heatsink and RTD probe. A couple light switches and a weatherproof cover. A toolbox (find one with flatter sides) and you'll need some fittings for the pump and whatever RIMS tube you can find, this one in particular may not be available, I haven't found any more.
-Ben

Thanks for the reply. I saw that, but some guys include a sheet. Not complaining, just curious if one was available. I like the portability of this system and I'm going to try an emulate it.