Some specific efficiency, water and volume questions

I've been reading through a LOT of threads lately, so I apologize if I'm duplicating questions asked. I'm converting from extract to AG brewing, and I have some questions. I feel pretty comfortable with the process and the science behind it, and my experience with extract brewing has helped a lot. But I'm still dealing with some specific mashing issues.

First: Volume. In the stickied thread, it's suggested that I sparge with 1/2 gallon of water per pound of grain. The recipe I'm using to learn on is Yooper's DFH clone, which has 13 pounds of grain. At about 1.25 qt/lb mashing, plus 2 qt/lb sparging, that works out to 10.5 gallons of liquid poured into my mash tun (not all at once). Granted, I'm leaving a fair bit behind in the tun (bottom of the tun, plus stuff stuck to the grains), but that still seems like a lot of liquid. Should I just plan on boiling for an hour or two before I start my hop schedule, to get rid of the extra couple gallons of liquid?

Second: Water chemistry. I am brewing using San Francisco water. With extract brewing, I never did anything to my water, but with AG I am worried about this. According to the PUC, alkalinity is 50 ppm, Calcium is 12 ppm, Magnesium is 4.5. That puts my effective hardness (according to the graph in how to brew) below 10, which is awfully low. My local store suggested about a tablespoon of gypsum per 5 gallons of mash water. Any advice on that front?

Third: Efficiency. Well, this is a more general thing- I've been hitting around 60% efficiency in my first two mashes, which is respectable but not great. I'm worried it might either be a water thing or a crush thing- I've been *trying* to use a homemade pasta mill grain crusher. It seems like my crush has been decent (good husks, lots of crushed grain), but for my next batch I am going to have my homebrew store crush the grain instead. If I can't fix my efficiency problem, I'll have to start mashing around 15-16 pounds of grain to get to my target OG, which will compound my Volume Problem.

Fourth: Sparging. All else being equal, if I gave up on efficency and did a no-sparge batch, would I lose out on flavor? Is the reason why brewers sparge to capture sugars that would otherwise be left behind, improving efficiency? Or is there some other reason (say, some less-soluable sugars that wouldn't be in the first runnings at all) to sparge? I could solve my volume and efficency problem by throwing another five bucks of grain at the situation. That doesn't seem all that elegant, but at this point, I'm just thinking through different possibilities.

Thus far for the two times I've done an AG batch, it has gone like this: single-infusion mash at about 1.25 qt/lb, batch sparge with 1 qt/lb, batch sparge with 1 qt/lb, but cut the second sparge off after I get to about 7.5 gal in the boil vessel. I know I'd get more efficiency if I didn't stop the second sparge, but it seems kind of minor- the gravity of the third runnings isn't all that high anyway.

Any advice or comments are welcome, thanks!

Pfooti:

Sounds like you're well on your way. In my case, when I bought a barley crusher I increased my efficiency so much that I now dial down the amount of grain I use in recipes to keep from going over my gravity target. Grain crush is apparently a significant factor in efficiency. As far as as your water chemistry and pH, I've found that so long as I stay under a pH of 6, I tend to avoid tannins and other off flavors. If you're really ambitious, get a water report from your local water department and read up on beer styles and water. I usually mash with 1.25 per pound, then add just enough hot water to bring the mash to 167-168 degrees, vorlauf, drain and then sparge once. I try to keep the volume of initial mash at about one half my total water addition. Once you determine how much water your grain will absorb given your system, you should be able to adjust. Hope this helps.

1) No recipe should ever be configured so that you have to boil for two hours before adding hops - what a waste of propane! Yooper's recipe is probably right on for how much water you need. IMPORTANT: the point is not necessarily to run all that water through your grain. Most important is that you sparge until you reach your target preboil volume. How do you figure out your preboil volume? You need to know your boiloff rate. My boiloff rate is 15% per hour. So for a 60 minute boil, targeting 6gallons POSTboil, I figure that my PREboil volume is 7.06gal (6gal/85%). It sounds like you understand the concept of a preboil gravity - you are correct that you shouldn't sparge beyond this.

2) Don't bother treating your water until you have your AG process down pat. There are a lot more important things you'll have to figure out before reaching that step.

3) 60% is not terrible, but it's a sign you need to work on things. I'd say crush the grain at the homebrew shop. Plan for 60% efficiency going ahead, though you'll probably be higher. And you'll find that the more experienced you get with your system, the more efficient your mash will be. It's strange, but as I got better, my efficiency went up by 1% each batch until I got to about 75%.

4) You will never really get a straight answer on HBT about the best way to sparge, though I'd say most people would agree that it's worth trying batch or fly before you go to no-sparge. Just pick one and go. No sparge will always leave a little more sugar behind - you're not really rinsing, just draining (and there's a difference).

All right, thanks for the advice. I'm brewing today, I'll buy a couple extra pounds of grain and have them crushed at the homebrew shop. We'll see if that improves my efficiency.

Here's something I noticed, too late for today. After running my mash and lautering and sparging and collecting the proper amount of preboil volume, I ran the extra wort off into a second container (might make a small beer with it). It took me a good half-hour or so to get the main show up and boiling and hopped. At that point, I went to clean out my MLT.

I bumped the valve on the MLT and all of a sudden, it started spurting wort. "Hmm", said I, "that's odd."

Turns out, a completely-overlooked (by me) part of the lautering process is time. I ran my initial first runnings until the tube emptied and dried up, at which point I sparged. If I had waited 10-20 minutes and reopened the valve, I bet I would have gotten another gallon of first runnings, as the grains slowly gave up their excess moisture. As it was, that extra sugar in the lost runnings was diluted into my sparge volume, of which I only used part.

Here I'd been looking at water chemistry and grind and all that jazz (probably a contributor), and I totally overlooked a huge part of efficiency: make sure you get all the liquid off the grains. Next time, I'll do just that.