Yes for sure! That's why it's called a pump and not a suck...easy way to remember fwiw
Cheap compact wort pump
- Thread starter ColonelPanic
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Yes for sure! That's why it's called a pump and not a suck...easy way to remember fwiw
I'm running mine off an adapter. I was told by the seller to get a 12 volt 2 amp adapter for optimum flow. I'm currently using a 9 volt 2 amp that works fine, but the flow just isn't enough. The $6 with free shipping 12 volt 2 amp adapter is on its way from China.
alien
Well-Known Member
Although this kind of pump is rated about 1 A for continuous use, on start up it might draw considerably more power. I would suggest using a power supply rated for at least 2 A or preferably 3 A.
People in the UK have reported using variable voltage tattoo gun power supplies rated at 2 A. Some had success, some didn't.
People in the UK have reported using variable voltage tattoo gun power supplies rated at 2 A. Some had success, some didn't.
The mag drive isn't so much the reason they can be throttled as the centrifugal impeller part. The mag drive pumps aren't decoupling when they are throttled, the impeller are just thrashing the product. That said, controlling the speed is a much more elegant solution, and doesn't beat up your product (wort) as severely. This can be done using PWM controllers for the March/Chugger AC pumps as well these DC ones, or even a cheaper TRIAC based speed controller for the AC powered pumps.
Except that the pot would need to dissipate much more power than a stir plate pot for a muffin fan.
PWM speed controllers pulse at much higher freqs than you are stating, and appear continuously variable. PWM also gives much more range of speed (low end) for pumps/fans than varying the voltage, and are the preferred speed control solution for these applications (for DC and single phase AC, at least). They are also easier on the motor.
The simple TRIAC based speed controllers (ceiling fan controllers) will work well with the AC pumps, but the speed range will be less than an AC PWM controller. WalterAtMarchPumps has a few posts on the topic.
PWM is the preferred choice, even for the March/Chugger pumps, though I am not sure if you are talking about a brushless DC March pump. I haven't looked into those, but I would be surprised if PWM wasn't the preferred choice for those as well.
RE: power supplies for DC. DC motors generally do not like to have amps limited. A supply with more current than needed will not cause any issues. Rule of thumb is to give DC motors all the current they want, and to control speed with voltage (or duration as in PWM). For AC the rule of thumb is to keep the voltage at the preferred level, and control speed with current (various limiting techniques).
I've picked up both pumps. I just also ordered camlocks that I need. I guess I'll do a comparison of the two when the black pump comes in.
I also just picked up this http://bit.ly/X6ILwB which is a power supply.
I also just picked up this http://bit.ly/X6ILwB which is a power supply.
I got the black pump in today. It's a little bigger than I was expecting. I'm still waiting on a rheostat I ordered for it, and I have no idea where the power supply I had set aside was. Thinking about it now I'll probably skip the rheostat and control with a ball valve. I need a couple more camlocks that I thought I already had, but once they come in I'll run it through the paces. Maybe I'll do an all grain starter run and just can the wort. I can say already, just from loosely screwing on a few pieces that the inlet and outlet threads seem different. I easily got 3-4 threads on the outlet, but maybe 1-1.5 on the inlet before meeting resistance. This could just be a production quality problem as well. It is a little bigger and stouter than I thought it'd be, although its still mini.
alien
Well-Known Member
My pump (the little brown one) is 1/2" BSP. 1/2" NPT and 1/2" BSP are more or less compatible. The thread pitch is the same as NPT but there is no taper. NPT and BSP female fittings both screw on and seal with PTFE tape without any problems. The NPT fittings screw on about 4 turns, the BSP fittings 1 or 2.
The black topsflo pump that can be bought on eBay or from www.greatbreweh.com comes in 1/2 inch NPT. Mine came in last week and works great! I currently have a 9 volt adapter hooked up to it but I've ordered a 12 volt for a little more strength.
Just to make sure I understand, a 1/2" NPT female will screw farther onto a 1/2" BSP male than a 1/2" BSP female, right?
If so, I guess that means that the very ends of the male nipples/pipes match and the NPT threads start tapering to be shallower and shallower, where the BSP threads do not.
So the biggest problem is than a BSP female will not thread well onto an NPT male, is that right?
thanks,
-fafrd
The little black pumps from China cost $18 - you could purchase 4 of them for less than the price of one of the greatbrewh or ebay/topsflo pumps...
They are BSP instead of NPT and plastic threads instead of stainless, but that is still a very big difference on price.
-fafrd
alien
Well-Known Member
1/2" NPT and 1/2" BSP are compatible at low pressures. That's all you really need to know. Just wrap enough PTFE tape on it and it will be fine either way.
1/2" BSP threads can be tapered or not (parallel). My pump has 1/2" BSP parallel threads. Any pumps out there with male parallel threads are likely also BSP. 1/2" BSP parallel connections are supposed to seal by compressing a washer instead of on the threads. But at low pressure you can wrap lots of PTFE tape and it will seal.
This document gives chapter and verse on the subject: http://www.colder.com/Portals/0/Lib...ture/WhitePapers/Documents/NPT_whitepaper.pdf
Aaaauuuugggghhhhh!!!!
I was getting ready to put my camlocks on and dropped my pump off the workbench, breaking off the outlet. I did what any redneck would do and JB welded it back on but don't want to use it for my beer now. If it holds I'll wire it up and give it a test with water to see how she goes. Maybe keep it for a conical cooler pump or something.
I was getting ready to put my camlocks on and dropped my pump off the workbench, breaking off the outlet. I did what any redneck would do and JB welded it back on but don't want to use it for my beer now. If it holds I'll wire it up and give it a test with water to see how she goes. Maybe keep it for a conical cooler pump or something.
Sorry for your loss, but I guess you've helped us all understand that they are pretty fragile...
-fafrd
Monster Mash
Well-Known Member
If it's any consolation if you drop a March pump on the head it will break also. At least you didn't spend $150 on this pump....
Jmarsh544
Well-Known Member
Just received the black pump and took the cover off the impeller area to inspect things. The plastic impeller seems fine, but when you pull the shaft out there is a plastic spacer and then an exposed magnet that drive the shaft. The entire shaft/ impeller assembly seems like it will be in contact with whatever gets pumped. Seems like it could be sanitized easily enough, but what concerns should I have with the magnet touching water and/ or wort? The pump seems solid overall, but the exposed magnet has me a little worried.
alien
Well-Known Member
Any chance of a picture?
From what I can tell the little brown pump has an encapsulated magnet.
From what I can tell the little brown pump has an encapsulated magnet.
I was afraid someone was going to discover that about the $18 Chinese pumps. It sounds like the GreatBrewEh/Canadian pumps before they added this to the product: Magnet is Coated with USA Approved FOOD GRADE High Temp Coating ( http://greatbreweh.com/Beer_Pump.html )
-fafrd
Jmarsh544
Well-Known Member
Hopefully this works:
Do magnets pose potential health problems?
Do magnets pose potential health problems?
lakedawgs
Well-Known Member
With my experience using those only in aquariums, they do get dirty and can also stall out. I find them finicky over time but you won't be running continuously so you might not have issues.
alien
Well-Known Member
A couple of people have dismantled little brown pumps after they went kaputt and found little bits of grain down inside the impeller by the magnet. They are not 100% hygenic in that respect.
The pump can be dismantled and cleaned after each brew, so hygiene would be less of a concern to me than safety. The Canadian pumps were built the same way until customers started raising safety concerns, which led the Company to add a 'food grade' coating onto the magnet ("Magnet is Coated with USA Approved FOOD GRADE High Temp Coating") so my suspicion is that these magnets are not food grade and these pumps should not be used to pump wort :-(
Now what I have no idea about is the actual materials used in these magnets, how hazardous (or not) it is to have that material exposed to liquids that will be ingested, and how much the Canadiam company's reaction was marketing-driven rather than safety-driven (they may have just gotten tired of arguing with their customers over the concern).
In any case, taking any risk over an issue such as this to save $40 is something to keep in perspective...
-fafrd
p.s. I have no idea of the beige pumps and whether they have coated magnets or not - the Canadian pumps apparently do (now).
I think not (directly on AC). It's a 12V DC pump so you would need a 110V AC to12V DC converter (which should be pretty inexpensive).
-fafrd
alien
Well-Known Member
As far as I can tell from this picture the magnet (top left) in the little brown pump is encased in plastic. This one was from solarprojects.co.uk but the beige ones on ebay seem to be the same design.
adriedel said:
You just wire t to an old 12v adapter 1.5-3a adapter. Cell phone, laptop, video game system, drill charger, etc.
I don't even know what mine came from. It's unused, so I assume an rc toy.
HDIr0n
Well-Known Member
I finally got my pumps in, I have 2 of the beige pumps and 2 of the topsflow. I liked the way the topsflow are bigger, I wasn't expecting the beige ones to be soo tiny. Anyways I got them mounted to my stand with a 3 way T type ball valve.
Untitled by HDIr0n, on Flickr
I can't wait to brew this weekend.
-G
Untitled by HDIr0n, on Flickr
I can't wait to brew this weekend.
-G
Yes, the battery, or as snaps10 suggested, the charger that charges that battery (or the charger with the battery in it, which would probably be best from the point of view of stability and duration of supply...).
-fafrd
Well, here's the "test" on the little black Chinese pump. It isn't ideal since I JB welded it back together, so it was a little smaller of an outlet, and I didn't use tape, so there was a small leak.
160 water. In the video I'm holding it at about 48". I measured 2 gal/min at 40" head. This is running off a 12v 2.5a power source.
[ame]http://youtu.be/UPUtPO2qI9s[/ame]
160 water. In the video I'm holding it at about 48". I measured 2 gal/min at 40" head. This is running off a 12v 2.5a power source.
[ame]http://youtu.be/UPUtPO2qI9s[/ame]
I've been following this thread out of curiosity and your vid shows it all at work. Excellent!
That little black pump may have enough power (flow/head) to serve its intended purpose just fine, and that makes it a very good deal.
In comparison, a March 809 has a lot more power, and in certain applications too much. I mounted a valved recirculation loop, which also prevents most cavitation problems.
That little black pump may have enough power (flow/head) to serve its intended purpose just fine, and that makes it a very good deal.
In comparison, a March 809 has a lot more power, and in certain applications too much. I mounted a valved recirculation loop, which also prevents most cavitation problems.
ylpaul2000
Well-Known Member
Subscribed!
IslandLizard said:
I'll be ordering one and making it a dedicated mash recirculating pump I think. No need for the chugger for that. Another thing to note. The pump is silent. The only sound I heard was the sound of water.
mosquitocontrol
Well-Known Member
Man I told myself I wouldn't buy any brew equip for 6 months. But this could save me from lifting all my mash and sparge water above my head on a wobbly step it might be worth it...
HDIr0n
Well-Known Member
Yeah not hurting your back is priceless when compared to the associated costs.
It is nice that they are silent, my propane regulator and my Honeywell valve are much louder.
-G
It is nice that they are silent, my propane regulator and my Honeywell valve are much louder.
-G
I bought one of these and I'm very happy with it. However, Chugger Pumps has a crazy sale right now where one of their pumps is $84 with shipping! Search for it on this forum to find the coupon code that you need. If I wouldn't have just bought one of the little pumps I'd be all over this.
Isn't 'head' the difference in height between incoming liquid and outgoing liquid? if you raise the pump all the way to the level of the liquid in the keggle, I don't think the 'head' has changed (and I suspect the flow rate will not change either).
Half a keggle is about 12", so if my understanding is correct, your (very helpful) test only demonstrated the flow rate at about 12" of head (not 40").
I checked quickly for a definition and could not find one, so I could be wrong on this understanding of 'head', but I am pretty sure that the correct test for 40" of head would be to pump from one keggle on the floor to a second keggle on a table with 40" of height between the liquid levels of the two keggles (and the position of the pump should not really matter as long as it is somewhere between the lower keggle valve and the liquid level of the upper keggle).
-fafrd
You are basically correct in defining head pressure, but there is more to it. Every 90 elbow adds 10' of head pressure. It is important to have smooth large bends to reduce head pressure if you are getting near your limit.
