I'm Thinking... 09/09/09 Barleywine

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BP's Smoked version has 26 lb of grains, which when input into 'Can I Mash It' gives me a necessary cooler volume of 10.21 gallons. I have a 10 gallon rubbermaid. I'm going to try it...but it looks like some mash is going to hit the floor!
 
blacklab said:
BP's Smoked version has 26 lb of grains, which when input into 'Can I Mash It' gives me a necessary cooler volume of 10.21 gallons. I have a 10 gallon rubbermaid. I'm going to try it...but it looks like some mash is going to hit the floor!
Click to expand...

What are you assuming for a water-to-grain ratio? I've got a nine-gallon mash tun, so I'm thinking I might need to set up either a real or quasi-fly sparge for this.
 
a friend and i were thinking about doing two mashes together and using the first running for a barleywine, the second runnings for a small beer.

maybe we'll do it for the 9/9/9...i'll run it by him. if so, i'll definitely include a small beer in addition to the BW bottles :)
 
the_bird said:
What are you assuming for a water-to-grain ratio? I've got a nine-gallon mash tun, so I'm thinking I might need to set up either a real or quasi-fly sparge for this.
Click to expand...

1.25 qts / lb is what I usually do(and what I input into the calculator).

I think if you can squeeze the mash in your cooler, you can do multiple batch sparges and get to your pre boil volume.

In both of our cases I think we will have to adjust our final volume down somewhere south of 5 gallons to be able to mash this volume of grain.
 
blacklab said:
1.25 qts / lb is what I usually do(and what I input into the calculator).
Click to expand...

That's what I usually do, as well, but I'm thinking this is going to have to be a little bit thicker - maybe 1.1 qts/lbs.
 
I think some experimentation is called for on this one. Maybe I will have to try this recipe out soon and see what numbers it yields.
 
I suppose I should trust BP's instincts with the smoked-BW recipe...

But I guess I'm a little leery of the citrusy domestic hops with the smoked malt. I've been imagining that recipe with more earthy-type hops, more of an English-IPA base to that particular recipe. Fuggles and EKG and all of those bad boys. Maybe even some German hops. Has anyone done a smoked beer with "C"-hops before?
 
I think that Alaskan Smoked Porter uses EKG and Willamette, although I wouldn't bet the farm on it! I could see a Chinook, Northern Brewer combo being interesting. I would look at the AAUs/IBUs and then go with whatever combination got you in that ball park and satisfied your sensabilities.
 
PseudoChef said:
FWIW: German Rauchmalt is smoked over alderwood.
Click to expand...

I'm 99.9% positive that German rauchmalt is beechwood-smoked, and 98% positive that Alaskan Smoked Porter (which is really the gold standard for a smoked porter) uses alderwood (they smoke it at a local facility).

EDIT: From NB's website:

Weyermann Smoked Malt. 2° L. Also known as rauchmalt, Weyermann's famous beechwood-smoked malt can make up to 100% of the grist for classic German Rauchbier.
Click to expand...
 
You can't argue with a .001 - .02 confidence interval!

For some reason I'm thinking that the smokey and citrus flavors will be really good...but I could be nuts.

I'm thinking BBQ'ed salmon with lemons and oranges...mmm....almost summer...
 
olllllo said:
Yep Alderwood.
Click to expand...

For Alaskan?

If anyone's really interested in smoked beers, I'd highly recommend the Smoked Beers that Ray Daniels and Geoff Larson wrote. Jamil's latest podcast is on classic rauchbiers as well.

I know that I have some Willamette pellets kicking around, and some NB as well; I might play around with those in a altered version of the smoked BW.
 
Alderwood = Alaskan Smoked Porter

Beechwood = German Rauch malt

plywood, 2x4s and railroad ties = Smokin' Nines
 
EAC said:
Alderwood = Alaskan Smoked Porter

Beechwood = German Rauch malt

plywood, 2x4s and creosote soaked railroad ties = Smokin' Nines
Click to expand...

ha! perfect. For some reason I am JACKED UP to brew this big ass beer.
 
It may have been mentioned, but this would be a GREAT beer to brew with a buddy. Two mash tuns - split the grain evenly between the two. Collect ~3.5 gallons of wort from each (first runnings, basically), then do a second sparge and use the thinner runnings to do a small beer (which I would guess would still be pretty decent-sized). One person boils the BW, the other the small beer, each gets 2.5 gallons of each after fermentation.

The first grain bill (non-smoked) looks classic enough where you could make a really nice beer with the second runnings.
 
hey! you stole my plan! :p

DeathBrewer said:
a friend and i were thinking about doing two mashes together and using the first running for a barleywine, the second runnings for a small beer.

maybe we'll do it for the 9/9/9...i'll run it by him. if so, i'll definitely include a small beer in addition to the BW bottles :)
Click to expand...

but why would you need to have only 2.5 gallons of each? if we have two mash tuns, the first runnings from both would be over 5 gallons...i think we could still make a full batch of each.
 
I was thinking in the context of people with limited capacity. When I fill my tun to the rim (after the mash, before collecting any wort), I collect just about 3.5 gallons on my first sparge. Even cutting the grain bill in half, there's still a lot of grain to absorb water. If I do this by my lonesome, I'll probably have to do a third batch sparge (or fly sparge).
 
Couevas said:
It is Post #157:mug:
Click to expand...
Looks like your gravity is fine.

I do find that inputting recipes from other sources tend to differ on points and IBU's. I've never had a Jamil recipe come out on target.

Looks like you simply need to increase your hops here and there to get to the #'s.

I'm sure it will be a common theme.
 
Can someone else load the recipe into Beersmith and see what they get, please?

I don't see how the IBU's could differ by 30 points.

Thanks
 
Couevas said:
Can someone else load the recipe into Beersmith and see what they get, please?

I don't see how the IBU's could differ by 30 points.

Thanks
Click to expand...
I will do that soon but I have seen very large differences between the formulas especially when you deal with big beers and high IBUs. So 30 points is not suprising.

Craig
 
Here's what I got in Beersmith:


BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com
Recipe: 09-09-09 BW
Style: American Barleywine
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.75 gal
Boil Size: 6.82 gal
Estimated OG: 1.119 SG
Estimated Color: 20.8 SRM
Estimated IBU: 86.0 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
23 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) UK (3.0 SRM) Grain 82.50 %
2 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 7.17 %
12.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM) Grain 2.69 %
6.1 oz Chocolate Malt Pale (200.0 SRM) Grain 1.36 %
4.0 oz Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 0.90 %
1.66 oz Magnum [14.50 %] (60 min) Hops 73.6 IBU
1.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (25 min) Hops 12.3 IBU
1.00 oz Cascade [6.00 %] (0 min) Hops -
1.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (0 min) Hops -
1 lbs 8.0 oz Cane (Beet) Sugar (0.0 SRM) Sugar 5.38 %
2 Pkgs SafAle US Ale (DCL Yeast #US-05) Yeast-Ale

Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 26.38 lb




Notice that Brewpastor used a batch size of 5.75gal not 5.0 gal which is where your efficiency numbers are wrong.

Second try setting your bitterness formula to Rager in the options under the tools menu. This gets me closer to Brewpastor but still not quite there. If I use Tinseth or Garetz I get around 50 IBUs for the same recipe.

Craig

View attachment 09-09-09ABW.bsm
 
Thank you Craig:mug:

edit: Wait a second....I just put two and two together and figured out that you are from Cleveland, yet you are a steeler fan. WTF? That is sacreligious!!!
Browns are going all the way this year.
 
alright, shame on me but i haven't read all of the posts related to this but i do love barley wine, i'm in like flint on this one. i'll go back and read every thing later.

i was thinking about the smoked malt and was thinking that maybe we could put in some smoked oak. good idea, bad idea?
 
Couevas said:
Thank you Craig:mug:

edit: Wait a second....I just put two and two together and figured out that you are from Cleveland, yet you are a steeler fan. WTF? That is sacreligious!!!
Browns are going all the way this year.
Click to expand...
:off:
Yea I get a hard time about being a steelers fan around here all the time. However I have been a fan all my life and lived in NE Ohio most of that time.

The AFC North should be interesting this year and the Browns should make a run at the conference championship but they won't be going all the way. Cleveland teams seem to have a problem with winning it all, they always fall a little short. Still I root for the other Cleveland teams, just not the Browns.

As for the topic, I hope I helped you figure out the changes. I will be modifying it considerably to include a large amount of DME. My 5gal cooler is not going to handle the full grain bill.

Craig
 
CBBaron said:
My 5gal cooler is not going to handle the full grain bill.
Click to expand...

You, and anyone else with a 'too small' cooler, could use the re-iterated mash method. Mash half the grain, re-heat the wort to strike temp, then use it as the strike water for the second half of the grain....or something like that. Just FYI on another method that I don't think anyone has mentioned.
 
By my best count we're at 33 confirmed participants.

  • If you're name does not appear below and you think it should, it is likely that you are not yet a paid member. Get paid up and PM me.
  • If your name does appear below and you do not want to participate, PM me and I'll trim the list.

This is by no means a final list. A truly final list for the swap will not be assembled until well after the brew date...most likely sometime in early 2009. This will allow the list to "clean up" a bit as we have late comers and some brewers who have to withdraw for various reasons.

If the list below is any indication, I'd say we're off to a good start. Will keggles be on the boil on Labor Day Monday?

Note that this "Occasion" swap is not a replacement for the quarterly open swaps or any other swaps that may be in the works.

I'll update the list periodically.
***********
9/9
98EXL
Air Pirate
BakerStreetBeers
BierMuncher
blacklab
Brewpastor
Brewsmith
BuffaloSabresBrewer
CBBaron
chadley
Cheeto1977
Couevas
DeathBrewer
deathweed
EdWort
EvilTOJ
Ize
jds
justbrewit
Kilted Brewer
landhoney
Liquidicem
MikeFlynn74
Mutilated1
olllllo
Ooompa Loompa
Professor Frink
RICLARK
TexLaw
the_bird
uglygoat
wildwest450
 
landhoney said:
You, and anyone else with a 'too small' cooler, could use the re-iterated mash method. Mash half the grain, re-heat the wort to strike temp, then use it as the strike water for the second half of the grain....or something like that. Just FYI on another method that I don't think anyone has mentioned.
Click to expand...
I know I have several choices for this beer.
I could:
1) buy a larger cooler and transfer my bulkhead.
2) Perform 2 mashes and combine
3) Reiterative mash
4) Or my usually of supplementing with DME.

#4 is the quickest and easiest and I have had good luck with it in the past. I may end up doing a combination of 1# and 4# as I would like to upgrade the MLT size but that big of OG is going to result in a very long boil or very poor efficiency. I may split the difference and do a moderate sparge resulting in a normal boil and supplement with DME to the desired gravity.

Ofcourse with #2 I could borrow a second turkey fryer (my parents and in-laws both have a burner and pot) and make 2 beers by separating the first and second runnings.

Lots of possibilities.

Craig
 
When I plug numbers into ProMash with a water:grain ratio of 1.25, I get a total mash volume of 1.36 gallons, so that won't work for my 10 gallon tun, either. However, bring the ratio down to 1.06, adding 6.98 gallons of water, and the total volume goes to 9.09 gallons. Especially for this recipe, that seems like a great number.

I'll just have to be extra certain about conversion. With all that pale malt in there, I am not at all concerned, though. That goes double if I go with Marris Otter. That stuff converts faster than drinking Baptist in a Catholic cathouse.

CB, by the time you pay for all that DME, you would probably have paid for a 48 quart Igloo Ice Cube.


TL
 

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