2nd runnings

I'm going to try a Thomas Hardy's clone on Sunday. It will use 26 lbs of Marris Otter for a 5 1/2 gal batch. This will be the 1st time I've tried making another beer right after using the 2nd runnings. I'm going to add the specialty grains and 3 more lbs of Marris Otter for Orfy's 80 shilling scottish ale recipe, after the 1st sparge for the Hardy's. I'm taking a SWAG at it and figure I'll need about 6 gal more sparge water in order to extract the sugars that are left in the malt. Has anyone else here made a second beer from the mash of a big beer? If you did how much sparge water did you use?

Warrior said:

I'm going to try a Thomas Hardy's clone on Sunday. It will use 26 lbs of Marris Otter for a 5 1/2 gal batch. This will be the 1st time I've tried making another beer right after using the 2nd runnings. I'm going to add the specialty grains and 3 more lbs of Marris Otter for Orfy's 80 shilling scottish ale recipe, after the 1st sparge for the Hardy's. I'm taking a SWAG at it and figure I'll need about 6 gal more sparge water in order to extract the sugars that are left in the malt. Has anyone else here made a second beer from the mash of a big beer? If you did how much sparge water did you use?

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Your grain will already have picked up most of the water it is going to soak up, so you won't need all that much more water than you plan on boiling. Adding the extra grain changes that a little, but not a ton. I need 7.5 gallons to boil for 60 minutes, and I think I used just under 8 and it worked fine. What I would suggest is just sparging in two batches. Add the first and then add more when you figure out how much more you'll need to achieve your boil volume.

If that's wrong, I did it wrong this weekend.

carnevoodoo said:

Your grain will already have picked up most of the water it is going to soak up, so you won't need all that much more water than you plan on boiling. Adding the extra grain changes that a little, but not a ton. I need 7.5 gallons to boil for 60 minutes, and I think I used just under 8 and it worked fine. What I would suggest is just sparging in two batches. Add the first and then add more when you figure out how much more you'll need to achieve your boil volume.

If that's wrong, I did it wrong this weekend.

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Thanks for the quick response. I usually need about 7 1/2 gal for the boil also. The grains that I'll add will already be mashed in a seperate pot with a quart of water per lb. I'll figure about 7 1/2 gal of water for sparging. I'll post back here next week with the results.

don't mean to hijack. Gonna be testing my boil off ratio before doing my first AG. Is it accurate with just boiling water for 60 minutes? Or accurate enough? Or do the sugars in the wort affect the boil off ratio significantly?

Please delete if you feel this is hijacking. I just didn't wanna start a thread for something that could probably be answered by one person.

IrregularPulse said:

don't mean to hijack. Gonna be testing my boil off ratio before doing my first AG. Is it accurate with just boiling water for 60 minutes? Or accurate enough? Or do the sugars in the wort affect the boil off ratio significantly?

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It'll be close enough to give you a very good idea of how your system works.


TL

I do this always! I have not done such a big AG beer, but I take the 2nd runnings of any AG beer, add a little DME and some different hops, and I have another 5 gallons for 13 or 14 dollars.

cheezydemon said:

I do this always! I have not done such a big AG beer, but I take the 2nd runnings of any AG beer, add a little DME and some different hops, and I have another 5 gallons for 13 or 14 dollars.

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Posted this on a similar thread in response to my brew this weekend.

This was my longest brew day ever! It ended up being a 14 hr brew day. I made an Thomas hardy's clone and my target gravity was 1.125 in 5 1/2 gal in the primary. By the gravity reading at 7 1/2 gal I was going to end up with about a 1.103 gravity. Not a problem I just added 3 lbs of DME to make up the difference. The sparge went fairly well and I didn't have a stuck mash, it was slow but kept on flowing. I ended up doing about a 2 1/2 hr boil 30 mins longer than I planed. The problem was when I went to drain the wort from the keg after chilling the beer to pitch, it flowed like molasses in January! I use a shmidling easy masher for the drain on my boil keg and it worked great on all my other beers, even my IPA which has a huge amount of hops. I think the problem was with the gravity at 1.132 it was clogging the easymasher. I had to keep scraping the sides of the easymasher with my boil spoon to keep it flowing. It took me about an hour to drain 5 gals of wort! I ended up wasting about a 1/2 gal becuase I could not keep it flowing. Next time I brew a beer that big I'll need another drain set up. This is definately the biggest beer I have ever made.

The 2nd beer went much better, added the additional grains to the grains left from the barleywine and did another mash out to 170 deg. That was a 90 min boil for the 80 schilling scottish ale. That ended up with an O.G. of 1.049 only 2 points off from what I wanted. That was 5 1/2 gal for the primary and it flowed normal speed and filled the carboy in less than 5 mins.

Hardy clone is already starting to ferment. Scottish ale was taken downstairs and should be fermenting by tomorrow.

This was a frustrating brew day but I did learn what to do different next time. I'll use a 1/2 " stainless fittings and ell to reach the bottom of the keg. Around the nipple that goes to the bottom I'll use a stainless screen basket I made to strain out the hops. The holes on that screen are bigger than the easymasher and should allow the thicker gravity to flow through.

Quite a learning experience. The Hardy's clone is rocking right now with about a 4 in foam head on it. Might be a good thing that I only got 5 gal because it would be about at the airlock right now in the 6 1/2 gal carboy. I agree with what you said and will probably do second runnings on any bigger beers I make in the future. My next will probably be a Hennepin clone and a wit on Evets brewday. Makes sense to extract those extra sugars and make a different 5 gal batch of beer.

Just took a gravity reading on the Hardy's clone. It's still fermenting with the airlock bubbling about every 3 to 4 seconds. The gravity has gone from a 1.132 and is now at 1.049. I'll keep rousing the yeast this week and see if I can get it down to around 1.032 to 1.039. Right now it's at at about 10.9% alc. With that O.G. I hope to get it down at least another 10 points.

Warrior...what yeast did you pitch on that Hardys clone?

brewt00l said:

Warrior...what yeast did you pitch on that Hardys clone?

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What the Barley Wine styles book called for the 2206 bavarian lager. It was fermented at ale temps and it was the yeast cake from a Bock fermentation. This morning it's still fermenting away although it's only bubbling about every 5 seconds.

Took a gravity reading last night the beer is down only 2 more points since Sun. Right now it's at about 11% which probably means the 2206 yeast is hitting it's alcohol limit. Gravity is still at 1.047, and I want it down to at least 1.038 or .039. Checked Wyeast web site and they show the 2206 is good to about 9%. I'm going to rack the beer on top of a Scotish Ale yeast cake from the 80 Schilling I made, it shows up to a 12% range for that strain. I'll put that in the basement at 60 deg and see if that gets it down where I want it to be.

Warrior said:

2206 bavarian lager. It was fermented at ale temps and it was the yeast cake from a Bock fermentation.

Checked Wyeast web site and they show the 2206 is good to about 9%. I'm going to rack the beer on top of a Scotish Ale yeast cake from the 80 Schilling I made, it shows up to a 12% range for that strain.

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Man...What an experiment! I'd pay for a bottle of that when it's done!

BigKahuna said:

Man...What an experiment! I'd pay for a bottle of that when it's done!

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Maybe a trade in about a year when it's ready? I think I'll try another one later this fall if this tastes good after 5 months.

BigKahuna said:

Man...What an experiment! I'd pay for a bottle of that when it's done!

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Took a gravity reading on the beer tonight. It's down to 1.040 now. I roused the yeast again and put it in the basement at 62 deg. I'm going to let it go for another month and then I think I'll bottle it.

.......patience is a virtue grasshopper

Warrior said:

What the Barley Wine styles book called for the 2206 bavarian lager. It was fermented at ale temps and it was the yeast cake from a Bock fermentation. This morning it's still fermenting away although it's only bubbling about every 5 seconds.

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Bottled the hardy's clone two weeks ago, I love the way it tasted at bottling time. Now to try and let it age. I will be taking a very young bottle along to the next Lancaster club meeting. I will also be brewing the 090909 barleywine and will do another hardy's ale as I do like the flavor and think it's close to the original.