how much are these burners costing me

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
JoshuaWhite5522

JoshuaWhite5522

Supporting Member
HBT Supporter
Joined
Jan 4, 2009
Messages
682
Reaction score
80
Location
Tacoma, WA
trying to get a feel for how much natural gas a set of burners will be using, basically I'm looking for some help with my math.

two burners at 72,000 btu/hr = 144,000btu/hr.

my utility company bills me in therms (at 38 cents a therm), and I understand that a therm is = to 100,000btu. I'm assuming that means btu/hr.

so if both burners are running for an hour using 144,000btu, and I'm charged 38 cents for every 100,000 btu, should it cost me approximately 57cents for the hour?

I have a feeling that I'm wrong because that just seems too cheap.
 
I usually brew one a month, 10 gallon all grain batches, and didn't see bill go up much if at all.
 
that sounds about right to me, propane tends to be more expensive and it only costs a couple dollars an hour I believe
 
unfortunately you cant do your math based on the BTU rating of the burner, because that rating is dependent on the volume of gas flowing thru the burner, and varies considerably.

however...
so if both burners are running for an hour using 144,000btu, and I'm charged 38 cents for every 100,000 btu, should it cost me approximately 57cents for the hour?
Click to expand...
that math is atleast correct, assuming your burners are actually using the rated 72k BTUs.
 
Wow, that's a lot cheaper than I expected. Makes me glad I went NG instead of LP, plus never ending supply.
 
There is no way Electric is cheaper than Natural Gas. The Heating elements are like those used in water heaters which cost 4 or 5 times more a month than natural gas.




Breweralex said:
Go electric.... Even less expensive and also never runs out!
Click to expand...
 
bkl63 said:
There is no way Electric is cheaper than Natural Gas. The Heating elements are like those used in water heaters which cost 4 or 5 times more a month than natural gas.
Click to expand...

even if the upfront costs are more for electric it is cheaper to brew with electric than gas.
 
eastoak said:
even if the upfront costs are more for electric it is cheaper to brew with electric than gas.
Click to expand...

Why are electric water heaters way more expensive to run than gas? Where's the efficiency loss with brewing?
 
How many Kw do you get for 57cent?
Electric heating is usually 97-100% effective

On a typical keggle rig without heatshields in place I doubt you get much more then 30% from gas
Its possible to get around 70%. But i believe that takes more then a simple shield
 
bkl63 said:
There is no way Electric is cheaper than Natural Gas. The Heating elements are like those used in water heaters which cost 4 or 5 times more a month than natural gas.
Click to expand...

eastoak said:
even if the upfront costs are more for electric it is cheaper to brew with electric than gas.
Click to expand...

These blanket statements don't help anyone. Electric is usually (but not always) slightly cheaper to run than gas, but it all depends on system design and local gas and electric prices, which can all vary quite a bit.

evandena said:
Why are electric water heaters way more expensive to run than gas? Where's the efficiency loss with brewing?
Click to expand...

Stand a couple inches away from your boil kettle while it's being direct fired. All that heat you feel is escaping into thin air instead of being transferred to the wort. Then stand next to a gas water heater as it's being fired. They're specifically designed to capture as much heat as possible and transfer it to the water, so you won't feel much if any heat.
 
JuanMoore said:
These blanket statements don't help anyone. Electric is usually (but not always) slightly cheaper to run than gas, but it all depends on system design and local gas and electric prices, which can all vary quite a bit.



Stand a couple inches away from your boil kettle while it's being direct fired. All that heat you feel is escaping into thin air instead of being transferred to the wort. Then stand next to a gas water heater as it's being fired. They're specifically designed to capture as much heat as possible and transfer it to the water, so you won't feel much if any heat.
Click to expand...

sorry about that, boss.
 
heres some actual numbers...

1kw = around 3400btu
so 29.4kW = 100,000 BTU = 1 therm

1 therm = 38 cents
1kW (for me) = 11.5 cents

so to get 100k BTU out of electricity, it would cost $3.38

however, electricity is nearly 100% efficient, so all of that energy is going to heat the water. direct fired is probably 30-50% if your lucky, less if its windy or your burner isnt properly setup, etc...

so for 38 cents, you are really getting 25,000 to 50,000 BTU of actual usable energy. that is about 7.3 to 14.7kW, or $0.84 to $1.69 worth of electricity. so gas seems to be cheaper but not by as much as face value.

but then you have to take into account the fact that my 5.5kW heating element cost me $10, and your gas burner setup cost a bit more...

tl&dr;
100,000 (usable) BTU electric = $3.38
100,000 (usable) BTU gas = $1-2 depending on efficiency
 
audger said:
heres some actual numbers...

1kw = around 3400btu
so 29.4kW = 100,000 BTU = 1 therm

1 therm = 38 cents
1kW (for me) = 11.5 cents

so to get 100k BTU out of electricity, it would cost $3.38

however, electricity is nearly 100% efficient, so all of that energy is going to heat the water. direct fired is probably 30-50% if your lucky, less if its windy or your burner isnt properly setup, etc...

so for 38 cents, you are really getting 25,000 to 50,000 BTU of actual usable energy. that is about 7.3 to 14.7kW, or $0.84 to $1.69 worth of electricity. so gas seems to be cheaper but not by as much as face value.

but then you have to take into account the fact that my 5.5kW heating element cost me $10, and your gas burner setup cost a bit more...

tl&dr;
100,000 (usable) BTU electric = $3.38
100,000 (usable) BTU gas = $1-2 depending on efficiency
Click to expand...

Thank you for those numbers, great post.

As I said, it all depends on local gas and electric pricing. I have a feeling that the OP's $0.38/therm doesn't include all taxes and fees, so the actual cost is likely higher. Including all taxes and fees I pay ~$1.60/therm for gas ($1.19 before taxes and fees), and ~10 cents per kWh for electricity. My tests lead me to believe that my gas set-up is ~38% efficient, which I think is probably pretty average.

So for me electric is about $2.94/ 100K usable BTU vs. $4.21 for gas.

And while my gas burner set-up did cost more than $10, it would have cost a whole lot more for me to go electric. I seriously looked into it because I think it has a lot of advantages, but it just wasn't feasible in the location I was brewing at the time I built my system.
 
Electric and NG can certanly go both ways
Changing mains and fusebox plus wiering for electric isnt cheap
Guess i could install a tank, but not so cheap that either

Propane is the only reasonable way for me to get the heat i need
 
Christ, this isn't about efficiency of the electric, it is about the cost. If you use 2 1500 watt elements (which would probably be insufficient) for an hour of boiling, and an hour of heating then that is going to be 6kilowatt-hours. At my super cheap rate that is going to be $.50. In other jurisdictions that charge a good deal more, say .14 per kWh, that is going to be about twice as much. Let's just say I can see a noticeable difference in my electric bill when I do two batches in a month (stove top) vs not brewing any (a couple of dollars, as we use very little electricity).
 

Similar threads

EGorsel
My first beerbrew recipe - tips and tricks?
Replies
12
Views
979
JaxBrewerSahti
JaxBrewerSahti
C
Beer Geek Breakfast Stout too roasty? can you offset this?
Replies
18
Views
2K
hottpeper13
H
P
Please tell me how to use an induction burner with BIAB
Replies
15
Views
3K
user 298779
U
B
Sparkling Wines & Carbonation
Replies
2
Views
3K
ShellinTX
ShellinTX
4_Sons_Brewing
12 Beers of Christmas - 2023 Edition
11 12 13
Replies
512
Views
20K
passedpawn
passedpawn

Latest posts

Back
Top