The science behind head

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william_shakes_beer

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Where could I find a resource that will give me a scientific description of the conditions that promote/increase the volume of foam in a batch or beer?

I have done 2 batches now(not back to back and one quite some time ago) that had VERY heavy head. I'm talking 4 oz filling a 22 oz pilsner glass. The head was firm and dissapated very slowly. They both tasted as they should and I have changed neither my sanitization practices nor my equipment so I do not suspect infection. I always use tasty brew and bottle prime to style. They were not over pressurized, since when I open the bottle I get the usual little cart fart. TRhe foaming starts in both the bottle and the glass when I pour, so the agitiation of the cake may have something to do with it. Are there combinations of malt/yeast/adjuncts/fermentation temps that result in excessive head formation?
 
dang, when I saw the title I was hoping I would get to make the snarky comment this time!!! Something like when a girl really likes a guy, or is really drunk......
 
Thanks. I'll post a video showing the problem, and also the recipies and procedures to see if there is any commonality. Guess I''ll have to be careful when titling my threads in the future. Should have learned my lesson from "how to keep the bag off the tube" thread!!!
 
Sounds like you're over-carbed. Does it foam as much when it's really cold?

Hod did you calculate your priming sugar? Is it every bottle?

oh, and "that's what she said"

:)
 
Sounds like you're over-carbed. Does it foam as much when it's really cold?

Hod did you calculate your priming sugar? Is it every bottle?

oh, and "that's what she said"

:)

ooh, you were Soooooo close to providing a serious answer.

Primary ferment 4 weeks, bottle carbed 4 weeks, priming sugar calculated using Mr Malty based on style and bottling temp. Chilled minimum 48-72 hours. My initial tasting notes reported "slightly too much head" I left it alone for 3 weeks, and the head had grown exponentially. I discount an infection because it still has good taste, and because I have had batches before and since without the problem. This is the second batch with this issue
 
hmmm, sounds like an infection if your priming rates were good. what happens to the beer a month or more after they have overcarbed? Thin, watery and flavorless and you may have some sort of gusher infection. From what I understand they often don't effect flavor early in the infection.
 
I´m trying to chime in but every time I read the thread title I laugh I can´t possibly contribute
 
Its a pumpkin ale. All grain, BIAB. 5 gallon batch. 6 LB 2 row, 6 LB munich, 2 LB vienna, 1 LB L60, 0.25 LB special B, 60 OZ libby's pumpkin puree in mash. Mash at 158 OG 1.050 4 weeks primary FG 1.010 bottled 9/15/12 video shot 12/6/12, chilled in door of fridge 3-4 days, 53F. prime 4.5 OZ brown sugar. Anybody know how to post an AVI video file? Mine doesn't seem to have taken.
 
at 54 I think you're over priming. That and I have no idea how long or how fully the sugars in the pumpkin may take to ferment.

http://www.northernbrewer.com/priming-sugar-calculator/

at 53 degrees this calc says 3.9 oz of brown sugar to get to 2.5 volumes of CO2 - which is a good middle number for a lot of styles of beer.

You got to account for your fermentation temperature or the higher temperature that the beer sat, not the temp when bottling.
 
You got to account for your fermentation temperature or the higher temperature that the beer sat, not the temp when bottling.

oops, yup, misread his post - assuming 65-70 on the ferment he's right on.

hmmm, I dunno what 60 oz of pumpkin does to a batch - I've never done that volume of solids as an additive.
 
Sorry, expressing myself poorly. I shot a video of a 12 OZ beer at 53F filling a 22 OZ bottle and a 16 OZ bottle with foam. That pour was after a few days in the frige. Tried the upload thre AVI but it didn't take. Can anyone describe the taste of a beer that's infected? I have never had one, and had assumed that a infection was signified by a beer that foams out of the bottle immediately upon opening and smells and tastes nasty. Am I misinformed?
 
First steps of an infection wont give you to much off flavours or aromas, It gets disgusting over time. You just hace to wait and see and if you think your beers are overcarbed or there is a chance for an infection, take precautions against possible bottle bombs
 
First steps of an infection wont give you to much off flavours or aromas, It gets disgusting over time. You just hace to wait and see and if you think your beers are overcarbed or there is a chance for an infection, take precautions against possible bottle bombs

Thanks. It has been sitting for several months, and in looking through my tasting notes,the initial impression was "a bit too much head" It has been gradually building up more and more.. The pressure does not seem to be excessve, just the usual little "cat fart" when I open the bottle. It had little pumpkin taste initially, and I thought if I closeted it for a few it might get better. Guess its time to drink these down and move on.
 
You got to account for your fermentation temperature or the higher temperature that the beer sat, not the temp when bottling.

I've heard several people make simiar statements, an I believe them to be true, but it runs counter to my (limited) understanding of the reasoning behind the carbination calculators. Please review my reasoning below and advise where my understanding is incomplete or incorrect.


When fermentation is concluded, there is residual c02 disolved in the beer. The amount of co2 that the solution can hold is temperature and pressure dependent. Higher pressure and lower temps permit absorption of more co2, and conversely lower pressure and higher temps force co2 out of solution. For that reason beer that is slightly overcarbed at room temp can be tamed by placing the unopened bottles in the frige, and when beer is opened, pressure in thecontainer is reduced, co2 is forced out of solution and creates the pleasant carnival of tiny bubbles that we all look forward to.

In order to calculate the proper amount of priming sugar to provide the desired carbonation level, the yeast must first be permitted to ferment out all the fermentable sugars. If residual fermentable sugars remain from the primary fermentation, and additional sugars are added at bottling, the result will be excessive carbopnation, possibly to the point of failure of the bottle. The amount of priming sugar required depends on the fermentability of the priming sugar and the amount of residual co2 in the beer. Since bottling is completed at atmospheric temperature, pressure is not an issue and is assumed to be at 1 atmosphere.

The temperature is taken at the time of bottling, since raising the temperature will force a portion of co2 created from initial fermentation out of solution.

Why is this wrong?
 
With my limited english I´m having some problems following your train of toughts, yes atmospheric pressure and temperature of the liquid will impact on it´s capability of absorbing co2 but following your practical case: you fermented for 3 or 4 weeks until primary fermentation was done, I can´t find the temp you fermented at but let´s assume for practical issues it was 70F, then you cool it till 53F (this you did mention), when co2 is driven out of the solution at higher temps (ferm temp 70) it doesn´t magicly goes back to solution when you cool it at 53F, that co2 it´s already gone forget about it.... so if you bottle cold at 53F you got to account for 70F for your calculations... does it makes a little more sense now?
 
When I calculate the priming sugar I base it on the wort temp that I measure before racking. I do not usually ramp temps up or down during fermentation, just set it in the middle of the published yeast range and let the temp controller operate within its default +-3 degrees F range. Some of the threads I read stated that the temp used should be the highest the wort experienced, not the present temps. It has been stated more than once, so I hesitate to discount the guidance. It just does not make sense to me. Your statements make sense to my understanding of the factors involved. And, just so you'll know, your english is perfectly uunderstandable to me, a native speaker.
 
ONCE you CAP IT........it is all semantics.

The Co2 is contained. Warm it up, cool it down, (I don't recomend this) but once you cool it the final time, it wil be fine as far as carbonation.
 
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