Maryland to license Home Brew Instructors

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How long before you have to pay to get permission to demonstrate other hobbies. I could see having a business license of some sort if you are operating it as a money maker, but a seperate permit just because it is homebrewing? Just one more way to make some money I guess.
 
What a crock! Besides, what do they mean by teaching anyway. Can you show a friend for example, or have a group over to make beer? Jeez, the laws we make to mess up the good things in life!
 
Geez, Ok I am sorry that is just BullSh!t.

Greedy bastards. Seriously man, how much is enough! I feel like Popeye. "That's all I can stands and I can't stands no more!".

I have thought a good :)D) idea was for companies to charge a 'priviledge to work here tax'. That is right up that alley. So in other words, you become a criminal if you teach homebrewing without a permit. hip hip hoorah.

Wait, read the bill I am really confused? Is it saying you have to pay $50 to store beer or am I misinterpreting this? It seems to need more context.
 
It's not a law YET, but it is on it's way.

Sponsored By: Delegates Schuler, Boteler, and Bromwell

Entitled: Alcoholic Beverages - Home Brewing Instructor's Permit

Synopsis:

Establishing a home brewing instructor's permit; providing a permit fee of $250; authorizing the Office of the Comptroller to issue a permit to specified individuals; authorizing a permit holder to teach a client methods of brewing beer under specified circumstances; restricting the use of beer produced for specified purposes; prohibiting a permit holder from holding a specified license or other permit; and authorizing the Office of the Comptroller to adopt specified regulations.
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The key word is CLIENT. I guess if you are charging for lessons, you gotta pay Guido.
 
I think all the rest of those licenses are other required permits. Do you need a $400 permit to run a home brewery in Maryland?
 
EdWort said:
It's not a law YET, but it is on it's way.



The key word is CLIENT. I guess if you are charging for lessons, you gotta pay Guido.
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True, but it looks like it's one of those "slip it in the back door, Sam" type of things that gets passed.

I am still confused, it goes on to talk about $400 for a family brewery and $50 for a storage facility. I wonder what that all means in the context of the bill. :confused:
 
Brewpastor said:
I think all the rest of those licenses are other required permits. Do you need a $400 permit to run a home brewery in Maryland?
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Ahh ok, so those are already established fees then?
 
One of the interesting things about licensing, standards and qualifications in an industry or profession is to keep people out of it.

Yup. I was always surprised when I had constituents come to me asking to be regulated.

I do not know, but I would not be the least surprised to learn that there is a group of home brewers that are actually behind this. Those that would like to establish a business and keep others out or make it difficult to get in.

FWIW.
 
You're reading the PDF wrong. Only the parts in bold are what this statute will modify. The $400 fee for family beer and wine is for St. Mary's County where it is legal to sell wine and beer from a family farm. All of these permit fees are only for people who sale something. You don't sell alcohol you're fine. Alcohol laws are strange in Maryland. Most of them are tied to the county level, but are enacted at the state leve.

I think EdWort has hit it on the head. Just looks like they are trying to get some fees for people who teach classes for cash. I'm wondering why this has come up though. District 8 is the northern part of Baltimore County. Maybe someone has been teaching and making too much money up there :)

Edit: Here's the full code as it stands now (i.e. without this law enacted) http://michie.lexisnexis.com/maryla...emplates&fn=document-frame.htm&2.0#JD_2b2-101
 
I think its a way to tighten up laws on homebrewing. If they keep passing fees it will be a way to keep people from homebrewing because of cost even though we have a "right" to do it. Its the same thing they did with automatic weapons. You can buy them and we have to right to do so as long as you can pay the outragous permit fees.
 
This is all horsedung and probably enacted because some butthead has a problem with the local homebrew shop owner who is also president of a local beerclub and an outspoken advocate of brewing. Notice all the sponsoring delegates were Section 8 - Baltimore County where Tom resides, operates his store, and has brewing events that invite n00bs out to the shop to do a monthly n00b training nite (which ends up being a bunch of people drinking and yapping while he tends the boil).
 
jezter6 said:
This is all horsedung and probably enacted because some butthead has a problem with the local homebrew shop owner who is also president of a local beerclub and an outspoken advocate of brewing. Notice all the sponsoring delegates were Section 8 - Baltimore County where Tom resides, operates his store, and has brewing events that invite n00bs out to the shop to do a monthly n00b training nite (which ends up being a bunch of people drinking and yapping while he tends the boil).
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And for which he DOES NOT CHARGE.
 
Well I just sent the following to all three Delegates involved. I'm not in their district, so I doubt I'll get a response.

me said:
What specific problem or problems is House Bill 674 (Home Brewer's Instructor's Permit) intended to address? As a long time homebrewer, I am unaware of anyone charging to teach homebrewing. I would appreciate any explanation of the intent and scope of this bill that you can offer me.
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Moonpile said:
Sorry to keep posting, but even the state only thinks they're going to make $450 a year on this. Apparently there's one business that would apply for the permit. Who?

http://mlis.state.md.us/2008RS/fnotes/bil_0004/hb0674.pdf
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Wonderful. And how much of YOUR tax dollars have been wasted for this BS?

Frickin politicians legislating everything in sight to justify their existence, not to mention their wonderful salary, never ending pension that gets COLA, and medical benefits to boot....all at the expense of the people who work for their money.

I think ALL Government worker pension plans should be transferred to a 401K like most tax payers have. Let then learn to save for their retirement like the rest instead of us paying for them.
 
EdWort said:
I think ALL Government worker pension plans should be transferred to a 401K like most tax payers have. Let then learn to save for their retirement like the rest instead of us paying for them.
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Umm, I am a government worker and I save for my retirement. I save for my retirement because the pension I get (assuming I complete 30 years of service) won't support me in retirement.

I also save on a salary that is about $25K+ less than my public sector counterparts.
 
Thats weird. At first I thought maybe they were trying to license for brew on premises type operations. But it doesn't look like it. I'm not sure what they are trying to accomplish.
 
DraconianHand said:
Umm, I am a government worker and I save for my retirement. I save for my retirement because the pension I get (assuming I complete 30 years of service) won't support me in retirement.

I also save on a salary that is about $25K+ less than my public sector counterparts.
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Sorry for my rant, but it's mostly aimed at Congress & the Senate. It's amazing what we pay 545 people (most of whom are very rich in the first place or got that way from being in politics), and then we continue to pay them in perpetuity after they have taxed us to death.
 
EdWort said:
Sorry for my rant, but it's mostly aimed at Congress & the Senate. It's amazing what we pay 545 people (most of whom are very rich in the first place or got that way from being in politics), and then we continue to pay them in perpetuity after they have taxed us to death.
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I agree with you completely. It's beyond ridiculous.

As for the fees in MD - if I lived there I'd never pay them. The odds of the homebrew police every showing up are pretty remote, I'd say.
 
ohiobrewtus said:
As for the fees in MD - if I lived there I'd never pay them. The odds of the homebrew police every showing up are pretty remote, I'd say.
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HBP....ahahahahahahahaha

Who can do a photoshop? I can't based on the PC I'm on ATM, but that would be hilarious!
 
Matt Foley said:
Thats weird. At first I thought maybe they were trying to license for brew on premises type operations. But it doesn't look like it. I'm not sure what they are trying to accomplish.
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Until I hear back from the authors of the bill, I can only figure the following possible reasons:

They want to crack down on a certain LHBS owner who has been hosting beginner brews at his shop, complete with samples of the previous month's brew. This bill certainly would have that effect since even if said owner paid the $250/year he would not be able to teach in his shop, as the bill specifies instruction take place in the Client's home.

Someone actually wants to make a business of this, and since charging to teach homebrewing would be quasi-legal at best as it stands is seeking to have it legalized. The Comptroller's Office says there's at least one business who would apply for this right away.
 
Brewpastor said:
What a crock! Besides, what do they mean by teaching anyway. Can you show a friend for example, or have a group over to make beer? Jeez, the laws we make to mess up the good things in life!
Click to expand...


maybe now you can legally charge people to learn. I would still do it for free and not pay the money, but this is america, and for most people its all about the money or nothing at all
 
Moonpile said:
Until I hear back from the authors of the bill, I can only figure the following possible reasons:

They want to crack down on a certain LHBS owner who has been hosting beginner brews at his shop, complete with samples of the previous month's brew. This bill certainly would have that effect since even if said owner paid the $250/year he would not be able to teach in his shop, as the bill specifies instruction take place in the Client's home.

Someone actually wants to make a business of this, and since charging to teach homebrewing would be quasi-legal at best as it stands is seeking to have it legalized. The Comptroller's Office says there's at least one business who would apply for this right away.
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First of all bravo on actually contacting the authors of the bill to find out what their intent is. As you can see from many comments here, it went way off topic very fast and simply became a government bashing topic.

Is home brewing a growing hobby?
Are there new home brewing businesses popping up around the country?
Could there be money made by a chain of home brew stores that would teach people how to brew?

I don't know, but again, in my experience it is those that want to keep others out that ask government to regulate them.
 
Bah, this is just to cash in on people who want to start teaching Homebrew as a business. This has nothing to do with Homebrew night (as long as you dont' pay to attend). I can't imagine why they would feel the need to enact this stuff when the odds of someone actually PAYING for what lots of people would graciously give for free, let alone for what you can learn online for free.

Anyone not in business to teach homebrewing should not have a concern. I'm thinking about having a homebrew workshop near my house this summer (Just got to find someone to brew for me!!)
 
EdWort said:
Sorry for my rant, but it's mostly aimed at Congress & the Senate. It's amazing what we pay 545 people (most of whom are very rich in the first place or got that way from being in politics), and then we continue to pay them in perpetuity after they have taxed us to death.
Click to expand...

No problem, Ed. I too have a problem with that, but I guess my dislike stems from the fact that they can (and do) give themselves raises without public approval.

Anyhow, you won't find me paying any f-ing tax (which is what it is) to brew beer in my home. I can understand licensing an individual who teaches it professionally, but the fee seems excessive. It's not like teaching homebrew is some sort of growing industry here in Maryland. In fact, other than some homebrew stores who might offer a basic class, I can't remember ever seeing an advertisement for homebrewing classes in MD.
 
EdWort said:
One would think that there are more "pressing issues" for Maryland's law makers to deal with.
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That is one I think we can all agree on!

Hey, EdWort, how did you hear about this one in the first place? Especially being way down there in Texas?
 
Gammon N Beer said:
First of all bravo on actually contacting the authors of the bill to find out what their intent is. As you can see from many comments here, it went way off topic very fast and simply became a government bashing topic.
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Thanks. I figure those guys should at least offer me (and by extension, us) an explanation of exactly what they think their bill is going to do and why. Who knows, maybe their hearts are in the right place and they think they're trying to do something good for homebrewing?

Anyone want to take odds on whether I hear back from them?
 
Moonpile said:
That is one I think we can all agree on!

Hey, EdWort, how did you hear about this one in the first place? Especially being way down there in Texas?
Click to expand...

I have ears EVERYWHERE! :D

Actually, I'm well read. Picked it up on the net.
 
Moonpile said:
Thanks. I figure those guys should at least offer me (and by extension, us) an explanation of exactly what they think their bill is going to do and why. Who knows, maybe their hearts are in the right place and they think they're trying to do something good for homebrewing?

Anyone want to take odds on whether I hear back from them?
Click to expand...

If you do not hear back from them you then know who not to vote for in the next election.

They can offer a good and resonable explanation of why they drafted that proposal.

IMHO though, considering the responses I have read here and elsewhere, reasonablness has nothing to do with it. Most have made up their minds and will no longer consider options.

So goes policy formation in America today.
 
hmm, today I changed my buddy's oil, and while doing so I taught them how to brew. Should I collect on that...he did wash my car for me as payment, how do you tax that :p
 
EdWort said:
One would think that there are more "pressing issues" for Maryland's law makers to deal with.
Click to expand...
Nope, they have raised the taxes on everything else so.........what's one more thing.
 

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