I grew up in a family that did drink alcohol but I never saw my parents have more than 1 or 2. I worked for my old man in the summers as a carpenter from about age 16 to 23, at about 18, after a long or hard day he would bring up two beers and we would enjoy them together. I was honored and thought he was proud of me. At about that same age I started drinking at my neighbors having bonfires. My folks didnt care as long as I wasnt driving and that I was responsible.
Do your under age kids drink w/you at home?
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Found this interesting (UK law):
BBC NEWS | UK | Children and drink: What's legal?
Summary is you can buy and give your child alcohol for home consumption as long as it's more than 5 year old. 16/17 year olds can even drink in a bar, as long as it is with a meal, they are supervised by an adult and the beer/wine/cider is purchased by an adult. Pub licensing varies though.
Personally, my mother, a reformed alcoholic bought me a bottle of cider when I was 15 and told me I could drink if I wanted to, but that I only ever drank in the house so she knew where I was and could supervise me.
It was certainly much better than hanging around the park in winter with a plastic bottle of cider like most other people my age were doing.
BBC NEWS | UK | Children and drink: What's legal?
Summary is you can buy and give your child alcohol for home consumption as long as it's more than 5 year old. 16/17 year olds can even drink in a bar, as long as it is with a meal, they are supervised by an adult and the beer/wine/cider is purchased by an adult. Pub licensing varies though.
Personally, my mother, a reformed alcoholic bought me a bottle of cider when I was 15 and told me I could drink if I wanted to, but that I only ever drank in the house so she knew where I was and could supervise me.
It was certainly much better than hanging around the park in winter with a plastic bottle of cider like most other people my age were doing.
mlyday
Well-Known Member
Starting at about 13-14 my parent would let me have a beer at home if I wanted it. It made it not that big of a deal while I was in high school and college. I occasionally drank, but never binge drank like most of my peers. I think it was a smart move by my parents.
I grew up in a house with no alcohol. I had a few beers at a friend's house once in a while. No big deal. I think the chances of heavy drinking are more or less genetic and related more towards your inclination to "have a good time" than your upbringing. I knew a bunch of kids whose parents let them drink at an early age and they were just as likely to binge drink on college as anyone else. I've also known kids who's parents were strict and they just didn't have any desire to drink much either.
I've let my kids taste or drink beer. My oldest has tasted Kid Rock's American Badass once and didn't like it. She hasn't had any other beer that I am aware of, and I'm confident that she hasn't.
My youngest has tasted IPA. After she helped me brew a batch she got a taste at bottling time. She couldn't pit it out fast enough and several years later still has no desire to sample. However, I can see her drinking with friends when she's older.
In Michigan you are not permitted to allow your kids to drink for any reason except for religious ceremonies. I don't agree with that law, but I follow it. That is why we pray each time I give them a taste.
I've let my kids taste or drink beer. My oldest has tasted Kid Rock's American Badass once and didn't like it. She hasn't had any other beer that I am aware of, and I'm confident that she hasn't.
My youngest has tasted IPA. After she helped me brew a batch she got a taste at bottling time. She couldn't pit it out fast enough and several years later still has no desire to sample. However, I can see her drinking with friends when she's older.
In Michigan you are not permitted to allow your kids to drink for any reason except for religious ceremonies. I don't agree with that law, but I follow it. That is why we pray each time I give them a taste.
I grew up in a German family where alcohol was always around. My Grandfather stuck a pacifier in a bottle of whiskey at the hospital when I was born and stuck it in my mouth. He did the same thing for my two sisters and all eight cousins. Every weekend at his house he had a keg of beer in the living room with big cups for adults and small cups for the kids. None of us grew up to be alcoholics. My own kids have tried my beer, my daughter does not like them but my son has tried every homebrew that I've ever brewed and has enjoyed them all. It's perfectly legal in Georgia to give your own children alcohol in your own home, but only your own children and only in your home.
Growing up, my parents always said it was ok for me to drink as long as I did at home. I thought that was lame but it probably set a good foundation. I remember having a sip of my dad's beer a couple of times when I was probably 6 or 7. I didn't like it at all. Even in my teen years, my mom would let me take a sip of her wine or whatever she was drinking.
For those of you claiming against the 5+ MPH sticking in court... clearly you've never driven through Tuxedo, NY.
There's really no argument... it is the LEO's duty to enforce the law, while also taking into account other factors and doing the right thing by the citizen and the community as a whole (i.e. not writing a speeding ticket for a husband driving his wife to the hospital because she's in labor). So yes, maybe it would be best to not right the ticket. Maybe it would be best TO right the ticket. It's a judgement call by the LEO.
HOWEVER, last time I checked, the speed limit signs did not say "55 MPH, or so" or "55 MPH, give or take a few". There is NO gray area in the limit. There is certainly gray area in interpreting the law or rightfully enforcing the law, however, simply stating that getting a ticket for going 60 in a 55 is asinine, is asinine in itself. You want to fight it? Sure, go ahead. Was the cop a d-bag? Maybe. But to be surprised to get a ticket for breaking the law, when you knowingly and were, in fact, breaking the law, is borderline insanity.
There's really no argument... it is the LEO's duty to enforce the law, while also taking into account other factors and doing the right thing by the citizen and the community as a whole (i.e. not writing a speeding ticket for a husband driving his wife to the hospital because she's in labor). So yes, maybe it would be best to not right the ticket. Maybe it would be best TO right the ticket. It's a judgement call by the LEO.
HOWEVER, last time I checked, the speed limit signs did not say "55 MPH, or so" or "55 MPH, give or take a few". There is NO gray area in the limit. There is certainly gray area in interpreting the law or rightfully enforcing the law, however, simply stating that getting a ticket for going 60 in a 55 is asinine, is asinine in itself. You want to fight it? Sure, go ahead. Was the cop a d-bag? Maybe. But to be surprised to get a ticket for breaking the law, when you knowingly and were, in fact, breaking the law, is borderline insanity.
nukinfuts29
Well-Known Member
As someone who is tasked with enforcing those laws, I disagree with you. Many of us behind the badge are well aware that many laws go against what is right, and that they are all subject to some degree of interpretation. If they weren't, then there would be no warnings. Also, that is not against the law in 42 states as indicated here in the topic.
Holding them to a higher standard is another way to say strict, and such rigid parenting was good at some point in time, but these days kids are out of control and you can take a lot of fire out of chaos by showing them the truth.
The way you were brought up is the same way I was, and the same way my kids will be.
Well said. My dad even allowed my friends to drink if they stayed with us, and their parents approved. Not all the time, but at parties for example. My dad also knew when to cut us off, and when to let us go to far and learn the consequences. I once stated that at a party that night he was having I was going to get drunk. Dad always taught "drink for the drink, never to get drunk". Did he scold me? Nope, he helped me accomplish it by introducing me to a game called quarters.
The next morning he woke me up at 7am, handed me the chainsaw, and took me out to cut and split firewood.
I didn't drink beer for 10 years, when I turned 22.
My daughter gets a little curious when I'm sipping a homebrew while playing with her on the floor sometimes, so I'll let her take a tiny nip. She seems to like every beer she's tried.
I'm definitely going to allow her to have a little at home, because I want her to learn to drink with me, someone who almost never gets drunk, and not with other teenagers who will be doing it specifically to get drunk.
As one who is tasked with enforcing laws, I've spent the last 10 years dealing with people of all ages who've never learned to respect alcohol, sometimes with horrible consequences. Considering I value my duties as a parent much more than my duties as a law enforcement officer, I'm going to direct my integrity towards raising my kids to have proper respect for our favorite liquid.
While I feel maybe drinking while on the floor with her might be unneeded, I feel it helps kill the stigma for it to be ok and casual. I also agree with everything else you said.
nukinfuts29
Well-Known Member
I'm not pulling anyone over for under 10MPH while I have lunatics speeding 20+, driving drunk, killing people, breaking into homes, committing rape.....well I think that says it all. I'm also not going to piss off the judges and prosecutors by bogging down the docket over 5MPH, because at least 30% of them will fight it.
Keep costing that tax payer money.
lol, that was a bad way to describe what I meant.
Let's just say that she's young enough that playing with her still requires sitting on the floor. So after dinner, Daddy is finishing his homebrew while sitting on the floor with a curious little girl.
Let's just say that she's young enough that playing with her still requires sitting on the floor. So after dinner, Daddy is finishing his homebrew while sitting on the floor with a curious little girl
.
That town will never shake this reputation. My grandfather used to say that it easily went back to the 50's. I might actually be looking at houses there soon.
nukinfuts29
Well-Known Member
lol, that was a bad way to describe what I meant.
Let's just say that she's young enough that playing with her still requires sitting on the floor. So after dinner, Daddy is finishing his homebrew while sitting on the floor with a curious little girl
I figured you meant something like that. The point remains that I don't really disagree with it anyway, as it kills some of that stigma where beer is a thing that should be hid from dad and used in excess during teenage rebellion lol
turkeyjerky214
Well-Known Member
I was never allowed any beer when I was growing up. I was too terrified of my mom to even try it at parties for fear that she would find out and I wouldn't be allowed to go to parties anymore. I mean this woman was f-ing hardcore insane.
My first week at college, I'm pretty sure I got alcohol poisoning. It took me a long time to build up a tolerance to alcohol and to get to the point where I could enjoy it without getting hammered. I mean, I would say I was a junior and going to bars before I could really handle myself.
I'm not saying that I wouldn't have binge drank in college if I was allowed to have beer growing up. I guarantee I still would have. But I would've known what my limit was and how to handle myself when drunk. I burned a lot of bridges my first couple years of school because of how obnoxious, inappropriate, and *****ey I was when drinking, and I really believe that if I had drank when I was younger, I wouldn't have been as out of control as I was.
My girlfriend and I have already discussed it, and we both are on board with letting our children have beer, wine, mead, cider, etc in moderation as young as grade school. Once they're in high school, they'll be allowed to have hard liquor in moderation, and more quantity of the lighter stuff.
We're still not on the same page as far as weed goes, but we're planning on moving to Colorado in 2 years, so I'm hoping that by the time our kids are old enough, it'll be legal making it a non-issue.
My first week at college, I'm pretty sure I got alcohol poisoning. It took me a long time to build up a tolerance to alcohol and to get to the point where I could enjoy it without getting hammered. I mean, I would say I was a junior and going to bars before I could really handle myself.
I'm not saying that I wouldn't have binge drank in college if I was allowed to have beer growing up. I guarantee I still would have. But I would've known what my limit was and how to handle myself when drunk. I burned a lot of bridges my first couple years of school because of how obnoxious, inappropriate, and *****ey I was when drinking, and I really believe that if I had drank when I was younger, I wouldn't have been as out of control as I was.
My girlfriend and I have already discussed it, and we both are on board with letting our children have beer, wine, mead, cider, etc in moderation as young as grade school. Once they're in high school, they'll be allowed to have hard liquor in moderation, and more quantity of the lighter stuff.
We're still not on the same page as far as weed goes, but we're planning on moving to Colorado in 2 years, so I'm hoping that by the time our kids are old enough, it'll be legal making it a non-issue.
I hear ya, and I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing the fact that people are confused by getting a ticket when they are knowingly breaking the law. Like you said, you have much more important things to worry about most of the time... that doesn't change the fact that if I see a red button with a sign above it that states "If you press this red button, you will receive an electrical shock", and I press that red button, I should not be surprised I received a shock. Did it hurt? Yes. Do I agree that I shouldn't receive a shock for pushing a little red button? Sure. Should I be surprised? Come on...
I think everyone is just upset my Giants kicked the crap out of the Packers..
Sorry Yoop... ...please don't ban me.
bernerbrau
Well-Known Member
I'd say it's more like, "If you press this red button, you will receive free pie. Do not press this button. You may receive an electrical shock."
People press the button and get free pie. But then they get grumpy that sometimes when they get free pie, it also shocks them and takes their pie away. Why? Because they like their free pie and are used to not getting shocked.
meschaefer
Well-Known Member
I haven't read the entire thread, and I am sure someone has pointed this out already, but in NEW YORK
Sec. 65(c) of the Alcohol Beverage Control Law explicitly states
2. A person under the age of twenty-one years may possess any alcoholic beverage with intent to consume if the alcoholic beverage is given:
(a) to a person who is a student in a curriculum licensed or registered by the state education department and the student is required to taste or imbibe alcoholic beverages in courses which are a part of the required curriculum, provided such alcoholic beverages are used only for instructional purposes during class conducted pursuant to such curriculum;
or
(b) to the person under twenty-one years of age by that person's parent or guardian.
[emphasis added]
Accordingly it is legal to give YOUR CHILDREN alcohol to drink.
[for the record I am an attorney]
Sec. 65(c) of the Alcohol Beverage Control Law explicitly states
2. A person under the age of twenty-one years may possess any alcoholic beverage with intent to consume if the alcoholic beverage is given:
(a) to a person who is a student in a curriculum licensed or registered by the state education department and the student is required to taste or imbibe alcoholic beverages in courses which are a part of the required curriculum, provided such alcoholic beverages are used only for instructional purposes during class conducted pursuant to such curriculum;
or
(b) to the person under twenty-one years of age by that person's parent or guardian.
[emphasis added]
Accordingly it is legal to give YOUR CHILDREN alcohol to drink.
[for the record I am an attorney]
meschaefer
Well-Known Member
I've driven 5 MPH overt the speed limit in Tuxedo, NY. And I have the ticket to prove it.
I've driven 5 MPH overt the speed limit in Tuxedo, NY. And I have the ticket to prove it.
Haha you're not the only one!
Boerderij_Kabouter
Well-Known Member
Painful thread. I think Squirrly is an officer in my area... more's the shame.
Yes, I give my daughter a sip of my beer if she is curious. As with all things in her life for the next few years, it is my job to teach her how to cope with the world. I would much rather teach her how to appreciate alcohol and respect it than to learn how to slam Crystal from MTV. Wine/beer/spirits are just food. Food you need to respect, but not something to be kept secret.
Yes, I give my daughter a sip of my beer if she is curious. As with all things in her life for the next few years, it is my job to teach her how to cope with the world. I would much rather teach her how to appreciate alcohol and respect it than to learn how to slam Crystal from MTV. Wine/beer/spirits are just food. Food you need to respect, but not something to be kept secret.
Nope they got it right. In Utah it is only legal for medical & religious reasons. I fixed the indenting on what you quoted to make it easier to read:
This section does not apply to a minor's consumption of an alcoholic beverage or product in
accordance with this title:
(a) for medicinal purposes if:
(i) the minor is at least 18 years old; or
(ii) the alcoholic beverage or product is furnished by:
(b) as part of a church's or religious organization's religious services.(ii) the alcoholic beverage or product is furnished by:
(A) the parent or guardian of the minor; or
(B) the minor's physician or dentist; or
(B) the minor's physician or dentist; or
IMO any state trying to regulate my conduct in my home to that level is asking for an overturn from the US Supreme Court the 1st, 4th, and 14th amendments come to mind. Any government telling me that I cannot give 2 or 3 ounces of beer to my grandson (13) in my home is in for fight from me. A parent allowing an under age child to get drunk or become addicted to alcohol is not guilty of giving alcohol to a minor but of neglect and abuse and should be prosecuted under those laws, not alcohol control. Any law regulating private conduct in a private home at that level is nothing more than a political system out of control that allows those writing the laws to FORCE THEIR PERSONAL MORALITY on to the others. They should be resisted!
CoalCracker
Well-Known Member
Once I turned 16 my dad said he didn't mind me having a drink from time to time. As long as I stayed home. Did I ever do it, nope. He said he would rather me be under his supervision than to be out in the bush or someones house drinking. Did I go through a time where I let loose. Yeah, everyone does. I plan on doing this for my children when they come of age too. The wife won't agree with it however I believe by removing curiosity, you remove a lot of danger. I was introduced to firearms at a very young age, shown the damage they can do. Never once did I take a gun out to show friends or mess around with them. Always treated them with respect and acted as if they were loaded even if they weren't.
StophJS
Well-Known Member
My parents are from Switzerland, an all my extended family lives there so I go back quite a bit. At least until a few years ago, beer could be bought at age 12 and liquor at 18. Because it isn't stigmatized in the same way though, you don't really see kids rushing out to buy the stuff. It's just another thing.
In the US, it is my understanding that minors can drink at home with parental consent. I've also hear that kids can drink at the bar in Wisconsin with their parents.
In the US, it is my understanding that minors can drink at home with parental consent. I've also hear that kids can drink at the bar in Wisconsin with their parents.
I give my girls sips all the time, they know what's good! just last night you should of seen their eyes light up after a little taste of rochefort trappist!! They all think BMC is disgusting 
I'll take the over.
saintdog327
Well-Known Member
Being that I don't have kids, I still feel I would let them have a few drinks with me if it was all in good fun. Drinking is a problem when it becomes an escape (i think this can appear in many forms). Also, since I'm from Argentina, it was natural for my cousins and myself included to drink with family from the early age of about 14. It's all cultural and what drinking means to your family.
what about catholic kids taking communion?
KevinW
Well-Known Member
We were all kids once, I am assuming
I respect any parents desire to keep their kids from using the previously mentioned, but it seems the reality of this day is kids will get the stuff no matter what.
I was allowed sips of beer when young and do the same with my kids. I consistantly tell my kids that moderation and resposibility is up to them. If they drink away from home I cannot nor will not back them up and they need to choose their friends wisely.
What else can you do?
I respect any parents desire to keep their kids from using the previously mentioned, but it seems the reality of this day is kids will get the stuff no matter what.
I was allowed sips of beer when young and do the same with my kids. I consistantly tell my kids that moderation and resposibility is up to them. If they drink away from home I cannot nor will not back them up and they need to choose their friends wisely.
What else can you do?
Not so. In most states 21 is the age to purchase alcoholic beverages. Many states, you can buy your kid a drink at a restaurant without a problem. And in virtually all states, your children can drink in your home when you are there. Doesn't mean their friends can, though, even if their parents are there. I have an OLCC (Oregon Liquor Control Commission) server's license and the laws here are about as convoluted as anywhere, but your kids can drink under your supervision.
In Michigan anyone under the age of 21 with a blood alcohol of 0.02 is in violation of state law (misdemeanor) and the person who provided it is a felon. 1 Exception sacramental wine.
Enforcement is another issue all together...
Enforcement is another issue all together...
yep..keep them away from the liquor..the stuff is evil...besides, nowadays they'd rather dig in the medicine cabinet and take the oxycontin if they are really wanting to get wasted.
either that or sniff some gasoline or hairspray in a bag.
We can shelter our kids until they leave the house, at which time they will probably go crazy and get in more trouble than if we teach them responsibility at home, even if it means letting them have a sip of your beer if they want it, then explaining that it's not to be abused.
too much government involvment in my life now...and with this SOPA and PIPA stuff...
either that or sniff some gasoline or hairspray in a bag.
We can shelter our kids until they leave the house, at which time they will probably go crazy and get in more trouble than if we teach them responsibility at home, even if it means letting them have a sip of your beer if they want it, then explaining that it's not to be abused.
too much government involvment in my life now...and with this SOPA and PIPA stuff...
my house....my rules (as long as SWMBO is okay with it). Either way, Uncle Sam isn't welcome without a warrant. When/if i have kids, that's for me to decide what happens in my house and the law will have no impact on that one way or another.
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
I have to agree with Squirrley. It is a "teaching moment".. does this include teaching your kid to disrespect the law? I think the law is a bit too tight.. but that is no excuse for me to teach my kids to disobey it.. Disagree, yes.. Vote for a change. I guess it was the phrase "teaching moment" that I took issue with rather than the rest of what you said...
the problem is, it is NOT ILLEGAL to give your kids alcohol in your own home. so, you are teaching them to follow the law.
Lancer033 said:
That's what me, my wife, my other wife, and our three kids think, too!
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