BCS 2 Vessel No Sparge Garage Brewery Build

poptarts said:

4" like 100cfm, super cheapo for like 19$ on ebay. I figured there is no more than 2cf of headspace in my kettle so if it cycles the air close to once a second that should be more than adequate. Plus the steam wants to go up and out and should do a majority of the moving on its own.

Click to expand...

Oh man, that's awesome. I was looking at that same style and worried it might not be enough. My plan was to use an old rubber made tub as a makeshift hood instead of a lid, but the same general setup as yours.

I guess I have a project for the weekend.

yea idk if you use the hood, that cfm might not be enough unless the hood is super close to the pot.

poptarts said:

And this was a 90 min mash 90 min boil and I was cleaned up and done in 4 hrs 10 mins. Pretty sure a brew day under 3 hrs is possible on this thing.

Click to expand...

Awesome! That's one of the biggest benefits that I've got out of the BCS and automation. Once you have your processes/states laid out, the BCS makes it easy to keep things moving in a timely manner and keep you on track. Because the BCS is controlling the timing of each step, I've changed to doing double batch brew days.

JonW said:

Awesome! That's one of the biggest benefits that I've got out of the BCS and automation. Once you have your processes/states laid out, the BCS makes it easy to keep things moving in a timely manner and keep you on track. Because the BCS is controlling the timing of each step, I've changed to doing double batch brew days.

Click to expand...

Yea i was noticing that without a doubt yesterday. Sitting around BSing with my friends then my system decided it was time to lauter and boil etc, didn't have to pay super close attention to a clock.

BrunDog said:

I don't think you read my post correctly. "Chill through CFC or PC as normal" means connected to ground water. I used the term pre-chiller to be consistent with Tricky Dick's terminology. Look at my first post on the topic a few posts up.

Click to expand...

OK, I just read "pre-chiller" and assumed that meant it was going through that first (pre = before). If it's actually a "post-chiller" it makes more sense.

Oh yeah just realized youre the $50 HERMs guy. Did that system not perform well enough or did you just get the call to the bling side?

it worked great, seriously no issues at all. but decided to ditch propane. Then it went out kinda crazy from there. The programmer in me saw an awesome way to mix code and brewing so I jumped on it.

Propane has given me so many hassles over the years. It was better than kitchen stove, but it ended there.

I think your no sparge plan to save time is awesome. I'm going to try too. What kind of efficiency can I expect? I was getting around 79% before, but that was entirely different setup.

All 3 batches have been 70-72%. I plan on tightening my mill a bit more once everything else is stable and working as planned.

poptarts said:

All 3 batches have been 70-72%. I plan on tightening my mill a bit more once everything else is stable and working as planned.

Click to expand...

When I started brewing there was basically only one real mill you could get. The "malt mill". Mine is mechanized now and I have no intention of replacing it unless it breaks. Non adjustable. After that several other homebrew mills became available, but I digress.

I plugged in 65% to beersmith to convert from fly sparge to a no sparge (using the biab profile- irks me that the mashing part of the program is hard to tweak. Very finicky), and then used the adjust gravity to bump it back to where I wanted it. Maybe I'll adjust up to 70% and take it from there.

TD

Tou could try a partial sparge to increase efficiency or limit inefficiency (if that's a word). You could either:

1. Heat sparge water in the BK, put it in a temporary holder, then sparge with it as the wort is pumped over from the MLT to the BK.

2. Heat sparge water in the BK, then pump it onto the top of the MLT while pumping the wort to the bottom of the BK (under the hot sparge water).

3. Heat the sparge water in the BK then gently pour it on top of the MLT water. Once you start the transfer, this low gravity water will rinse grains in the way down and not fully mix with the wort.

Anyway, just some ideas.

I spent a considerable amount of money and time brewing, or wishing I was brewing. Its a great hobby. For a guy like me with a full time job, family, kids in sports, etc, its harder and harder to eke out time for a brew day. It gets worse as kids get older. When I built my propane rig I didn't forsee that coming. When I started dreaming of electric, I didn't even think about a no sparge until I saw the massive mash tun and thought here is a time saver! Indoor brewers can also set stuff up a little bit at a time days before they want to brew so its all set to go, which outdoor brewers cannot typically.

You make some good points about how to add a sparge, but the more I think about it, the less interested I am in sparging anymore. grain is pretty cheap. ( Getting rid of spent grain is a pain. ) No sparge cuts a good 45 to 60 minutes (on my old system anyway), and could always do a partigyle back to back? I dunno though. I end up making more than I can drink anyways. I have read no sparge beers taste better. Perhaps some folks oversparge.

If Poptarts is getting 70% range with no sparge, I'd say that's pretty dang good! Another thing he COULD do and I forgot if he can run two elements simultaneously or not, but while he is mashing, he could heat say 5 gallons of water in the BK, transfer to a bucket or two or a cooler and do a batch sparge after collecting the wort in the boil kettle and recirculate while beginning the boil process.

TD

I'm on 30A and my system is wired so its impossible to fire both elements at one time. I can always cold water sparge if I really feel the need to (And maybe I will when brewing a massive RIS) but I thought about this a long time before I went the no sparge route, a 5% hit in efficiency is totally acceptable to me. And like I said earlier I believe I can tighten my mill and bring it back to 75% without much issues. I'm far more concerned with consistency than efficiency. If I was chasing efficiency numbers I would have built a fly sparge system. Saving a full plus hour on brew day is worth the extra couple of pounds of base grain for me personally. And if for some magic unforeseeable reason I hate both no sparge and cold water sparge in the future I will just slap together a instant hot water rims tube like BruDog has.

I agree that grain is cheap. The only problem is if your rig's efficiency does not approximate that of the recipe you are copying, you have to modify it which sometimes is not as simple as just scaling up grain quantities.

I think the cold sparge is probably a great idea just to help flush out the dense first runnings as they would yield a big contribution to throughout. I would let your MLT get drained maybe 3/4 of the way, then pour some cold water on top (maybe 1/3 to 1/3 or normal sparge volume), then drain the rest of the way.

Almost all recipes I come across are 70-75% calculated.

True but those assume sparging. You also have bottom drain which likely helps you.

poptarts said:

I'm on 30A and my system is wired so its impossible to fire both elements at one time.

Click to expand...

You can effectively use both elements at the same time using this technique.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=479201

I used to have a 2 vessel setup with a RIMS tube. I batch sparged and would heat up the sparge water in the boil kettle during the mash. Given that the RIMS tube was running at less than 15% duty cycle to maintain the mash temp, this gave the other 85% of the time for the boil kettle to fire.

First running went into a bucket or 2 and then I transfered the sparge water into the mash tun before emptying the buckets into the boil kettle. I was getting 80-85% efficiency with this way.

My panel is wired so its impossible to fire both at the same time. Either way idk why we are on this topic, I built a no sparge system and am happy with no sparging, was kind of the point.

Sorry PT! We gotta shoot the **** about something and this felt like a fun topic! Moving on!

Brewed a berliner this past weekend. Everything is working as expected still. Had to add a weep hole into the vent but that was the only modifications. I'm getting good at knowing what valves to leave open vs closed so I can avoid thawing most of them manually. I remembered I have a heat gun (industrial hair dryer thing for heat shrink / drying paint) and that thing makes quick work of frozen valves and pumps. Brewing an ESB this next weekend, pretty fun being able to brew every weekend trying to recover my pipeline since I was out of a brew system for several months.

I hear that. I have more beer than I know what to do with.

Hey pop I am wondering how your SS scrubby is working out?

On my system, I have a bottom drain in my BK. Historically, I successfully just whirlpooled to isolate hops/break, just leaving the drain open and letting everything flow through it and chillers until whirlpool did its job. Unfortunately, on a couple brews ago, my secondary chiller clogged (dunno with what) and I was forced to go semi-no chill. The following brew (the one in the video I made) I experimented with a 6" bazooka vertically installed, but it clogged easily on a blonde ale (only 1 oz hops total).

I was thinking for my next brew I would try the scrubby route. I know you have been doing that with your innovative snorkel design. I realize only the lower portion of the kettle drains through it as most goes through the snorkel... but what is your experience?

if I drain / recirc at full speed it gets clogged (not the snorkel but the scrubbie), but at about half flow, it works fantastic. I dont have plans to change it or not use it in the future.

OK, gotcha. I am trying to determine a solution. I am going to try a scrubbie but I hear they do clog with pellet hops. I need a pre-screen that will allow me to go full rate with the pump. After a few minutes the whirpool will affect the amount, but in the beginning it needs not to clog or cause cavitation. I realize that's a big ask! I might make a bigger hop screen from some larger SS mesh I have - it's just putting it together that is not that easy.

I would get a tee fitting, and give it a go. I cant see mine till it is drained but I assume it clogs only when the wort is below the snorkel piece.

brewed up an ESB this weekend. Things went textbook smooth. Hit 72% again exactly, all numbers and volumes dead on. Time to tweak the mill so see if I can get a bit higher efficiency next round, I figure I can either get more efficiency or faster mash times. I rock a corona mill though so I already get a decent amount of flour, not sure how much tighter I can go and really get better efficiency without squeezing or sparging.

For a hundred bones, get a legit mill.

BrunDog said:

For a hundred bones, get a legit mill.

Click to expand...

Is it worth it though?

Well, "worth" is relative and dictated by the beholder... So YES!

Man BrunDog is making you spend some money Poptarts lol

Im still hesitant on this, if I buy a mill it will be a nice monster mill or something, not a 100$ deal, mine works fine so I have trouble believing that I need to drop 200+ on a new mill.

Yeah man we aren't in this hobby to skimp!

Yea might be a future upgrade at some point but I need to let my hobby budget recover a little, this system did a little damage to it haha.

A nice mill will last you a lifetime.
I bought a hand crank, non adjustable, "malt mill", when there were really no other options. I think there was also the incredibly small Phil mill, and also another called the valley mill, but it had just come to market around the time I bought mine.
I eventually motorized it, and it's on a cart now with plastic carboy as a grain hopper. One of the best projects I've done to date.

Have fun with the new brewery! Sounds like you are getting at it far more than I am.

Here is my mill setup at the moment. I dont hate it so its hard to upgrade it.

Just bought 144lbs of base grains, let the brewing party start

Muse be a motor under that we can't see...
What are you fermenting in?

TrickyDick said:

Muse be a motor under that we can't see...
What are you fermenting in?

Click to expand...

yea harbor freight drill.

I ferment in PET carboys, Inside mini fridges.

poptarts said:

yea might be a future upgrade at some point but i need to let my hobby budget recover a little, this system did a little damage to it haha.

Click to expand...

amen to that.