Thinking of changing careers.

I have been a chef now for several years and have an associats degree in culinary arts. I have hardly even made a dent in my massive student loan yet and I am already thinking about changing careers. Before and while I was went to culinary school, I use to think about food, plate presentations and use to come up with new reciepes in my head all the time. Every spare moment I had, I spent doing this.

When I first joined these forums, I told everyone that my goal was to open up my own brew pub one day and pair my beer with my food. I realized that I would not be able to directly oversee both food and beer production so my original goal was to hire a brewmaster and take care of the food myself.

But lately, I have not been thinking about food at all, even at work while I am cooking and preparing meals.

Like food before, I now think about beer with every spare moment I have. Instead of plate designs, I think about label designs. And instead of creating food receipes, I am creating beer reciepes (I have a lot that I have not even tried yet).

In October I am moving to England very briefy to finish my bachelors degree in Culinary Arts just becasue I am so close to getting it (it will only take me around 10 weeks to get) After I get it, I am seriously thinking about getting out of the culinary buisness and getting in to brewing for a living. I have been thinking about working for some brewing company both here in the states and abroad to get a fell for the large scale production of beer and to learn about operation of some of the large scale equipment. I have been thinking about offering to work for room and board in some of the forign breweries to get around work visas.

My goal right now is to open up my own micorbrewery by the time I am 35 years old. I am almost 25 now so that gives me a little over 10 years to brew and tweek my reciepes.

I am just wondering since I am thinking about getting a job at a brewing company, how much money should I expect to make? Also, do you think that me having two degree's in culinary arts will matter at all when I start looking for a job at a brewery?

If anybody on these forums owns a brewery or brewpud and would be interested, please let me know as I will probably be making the leap begining of 2008.

Any advice, thoughts, or concerns?

Nothing wrong with that. That sounds like the exact same path as Alan Sprints (owner of Hair of the Dog brewery). If you're young and don't have a problem starting small (assistant brewer isn't the best paying job FWIU), I'd say: Go for it!

I have to admire your ambition, i wish you the best of luck and i'm sure that if you put your mind to it you can do what ever you want in life. besides, life is what you make of it.

The reason I decided against it was the back breaking labor. I'm not a wimp, but the sins of the past and 15 years of bartending pretty much took me out of the spent grain shoveling side of it. The manual labor in most small brewing operations is grueling to say the least I hear.


Barry

Your degree probably won't matter in a large operation, although it might in a moderate sized brewpub. As mentioned, there is a lot of physical labor in small operations and the bigger breweries are so automated, they don't have many employees. Widmer has one brewer per shift and cranks out 1000 plus barrels a day. I do know a couple people who got into the brewery by starting as an assistant chef.

I am not too worried about the physical labor part of it. There is a lot of physical labor in the culinary industry also. I know the food network has kind of built being a chef up into being something glamorous and realtivly easy. But there is a lot of cleaning that has to been done in a restaurant and most owners don't want to hire extra people just to clean, (except the dish washers) everybody in the kitchen is expected to do their part and get it cleaned. There are a lot of grease traps, drains, and walkin refrid, to clean every day, apart from cooking. On top of that, it is usually very hot in a commercial kitchen. At least in a brewery it should not be that hot. I had a new brewpub that is about to or already has hopend up in Atlanta who was interested in hiring me but they wanted to hire me for the food part of it.

This new brewpub was in Atlanta and no offence ment for anybody from Atlanta but I lived there for a year and hated every minute of it. Every big city has traffic but I have visited cities twice the size of Atlanta and they did not have anywere a big of a traffic problem that Atlanta has. No way I would ever live there again.

Forrest said:

I am not too worried about the physical labor part of it. There is a lot of physical labor in the culinary industry also. I know the food network has kind of built being a chef up into being something glamorous and realtivly easy. But there is a lot of cleaning that has to been done in a restaurant and most owners don't want to hire extra people just to clean, (except the dish washers) everybody in the kitchen is expected to do their part and get it cleaned. There are a lot of grease traps, drains, and walkin refrid, to clean every day, apart from cooking. On top of that, it is usually very hot in a commercial kitchen. At least in a brewery it should not be that hot. I had a new brewpub that is about to or already has hopend up in Atlanta who was interested in hiring me but they wanted to hire me for the food part of it.

This new brewpub was in Atlanta and no offence ment for anybody from Atlanta but I lived there for a year and hated every minute of it. Every big city has traffic but I have visited cities twice the size of Atlanta and they did not have anywere a big of a traffic problem that Atlanta has. No way I would ever live there again.

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Hey what was the name of the brew pub? I live in alpharetta (30mins north fo downtown), I know that a new one called 9 Rivere Brewrey (or something like that) just opened up north of ATL, is that the one youre talkin about?

I am not sure what the name of it was. The owner fo the 5 seasons brewpub partnered with a man who used to own a brewpub in Atlanta (which closed) I was in contact with them through someone I know. I think one of thems name was Moreland or something like that but they never told me what they were going to name it.

gotcha, I read your intro post and you and me are 2 of a kind. I am a former Johnson and Wales student up in charolette, NC. I was there for a year then decided that food was a hobby and not a career for me. (I still work in high end kitchens right now to pay off college. Anyway, im at Georgia Southern right now majoring in Finanace, brewing beer for frat parties and such. Im going into real estate development, so hopefully after several years that will get me enough money to open up my own brew pub

Just good to know im not the only one here coming from a culinary background!

Criniit said:

gotcha, I read your intro post and you and me are 2 of a kind. I am a former Johnson and Wales student up in charolette, NC. I was there for a year then decided that food was a hobby and not a career for me. (I still work in high end kitchens right now to pay off college. Anyway, im at Georgia Southern right now majoring in Finanace, brewing beer for frat parties and such. Im going into real estate development, so hopefully after several years that will get me enough money to open up my own brew pub

Just good to know im not the only one here coming from a culinary background!

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There is another one here too.... I spent a year at Johnson & Wales in North Miami and then realized that I was loosing my passion for food and cooking and decided to go another route and joined the navy and got into electronics, and have since turned that into a career working as a civilian for the dept of the Navy.

I say follow your heart, if that leads you to a career in brewing then so be it, it may change in a year but you always have the culinary arts to fall beck on. Me on the other hand I am struggling with what i need to do to get out of where I am at right now, I never intended for electronics to be my life but I fallen into that rut and am having ot work toward a new degree so I can change fields.

Cheers

I spent some time at Georgia Southern before going to Culinary school my self. I grew up about a 30 minute drive from GSU. My mom is the personal secritary for the Dean of the College of Education at GSU so I have ties there. I majored in Information Tech and Hotel/Restaurant Management while there.

Ahh cool man, send me a PM if your ever back in statesboro maybe we can do a brew together or something.

Will do! I will actually be in Statesboro this weekend but it is for my moms wedding so I dought I will have time for a social call.

That is the hard thing about choosing a profession and course of studies. Often you have not yet experienced enough in life to know exactly what is out there and what may really be your "calling". Food and beer preperation are still the same thing in my opinion (I considered culinary school once myself) essientially a conusmable art form that is also very scientific. It is tough to make a leap to something "different" after spending so much time and money pursuing one thing. Though I think you will find that your culinary schooling will be very useful in the bigger picture.

You'll figure it out, best of luck. Keep us posted.

oh, and if you are planning on running/owning a brewpub then you really out to look into some business/manegement training as well. I also considered owning a restaurant/cafe once until I got burned out just working in one. Restaurant/pub/cafe business will BE your life 24/7 if you own one, it will also own you so make sure you have the temperment. I definately do not, too much of a stress case. :fro:

Also, read brewpastor's stories of opening a brewery... Nice advice from someone who's been through it all already. Not quite what you're looking into, but definitely close enough.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=11412
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=20962

I'm your age right now, and considering a similar path. I'm hoping this summer to pick up an 'internship' at a brewpub nearby (read: please, let me do your grunt-work for a month and don't pay me, no really!). A small step into what may be something big for me...

kvh

u say that ou're not put off by the manual labor aspect but i'm here to tell you from interacting with our local brewery here in sc (thomas creek) it's A LOT of HARD WORK making beer. dude - the brewmaster prob sees his wife less than a week total out of the month - if that. it sounds glamorous - but i'm here to tell you it's not the romantic job you're thinking of

FYI

starting wages as an assistant brewer is about 30-35k a year if you have been to school or have prior experience. Like everything else, the more experience you gain, the more you're worth to the brewer.

Start reading as much as you can. I mean every single book on brewing you can get your hands on. Read as much theory as you can take before you bust. Brew as much as you can, and by that I mean even volunteer at a local brewpub or micro to make sure it's want you want to do.

Good luck

Forrest said:

I have been a chef now for several years and have an associats degree in culinary arts. I have hardly even made a dent in my massive student loan

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In October I am moving to England very briefy to finish my bachelors degree in Culinary Arts just becasue I am so close to getting it (it will only take me around 10 weeks to get)

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With all due respect, isn't studying cooking in England like studying Oceanography in the Sahara?

Forrest said:

This new brewpub was in Atlanta and no offence ment for anybody from Atlanta but I lived there for a year and hated every minute of it. Every big city has traffic but I have visited cities twice the size of Atlanta and they did not have anywere a big of a traffic problem that Atlanta has. No way I would ever live there again.

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Atlanta traffic is awesome!!! I live ITP and don't have to hit the interstates and love to listen to the traffic reports. Every morning they seemed shocked that is bad. I figured at some point they would just stop talking about it.

Hey guys I never said I thought working in or owning a brewery would be glamorous. I am not scared of hardwork. I grew up on a farm for goodness sakes.

Right now, i don't even own the restaurant I work at and I still don't hardly have any spare time. Most chefs who get married have a hard time staying married. I may decide later too go back to the brew pub idea but for now I am thinking just a brewery.

Thanks for the links, that is very interesting.

And I know the british are not known for their food but they actually have a very good culinary school in London, one of the worlds best.

Cheesefood said:

With all due respect, isn't studying cooking in England like studying Oceanography in the Sahara?

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It may seem that way with those with little knowledge of what the range and quality of good food in the UK is like.

That is very true. I have traveled the UK extensivly. The main thing Americans don't like about British food is the lack of seasoning (as we see it) The british tend to let the natural flavors of their food come out where we Americans tend to heavely season everything. So since we are use to that, we see British food as being bland.

brewhead said:

u say that ou're not put off by the manual labor aspect but i'm here to tell you from interacting with our local brewery here in sc (thomas creek) it's A LOT of HARD WORK making beer. dude - the brewmaster prob sees his wife less than a week total out of the month - if that. it sounds glamorous - but i'm here to tell you it's not the romantic job you're thinking of

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Never get to see your wife, huh? Sounds like the perfect job to me!

Follow your heart, dude. Most of us have changed careers many times...or are working in a field that has nothing to do with our degrees. Passions change over time, so there's nothing wrong with doing what makes you happy, especially if you are single and don't have family responsibilities.

orfy said:

It may seem that way with those with little knowledge of what the range and quality of good food in the UK is like.

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That might be true, but it's just because you never see any Authentic English restaurants ANYWHERE. I've gone to Irish restaurants and found the food to be pretty aweful. Same with Dutch. Reminds me of a joke I heard at Boom Chicago in Amsterdam:

"In America, they have a phrase that goes 'Bite the Bullet'. You can tell it's American because it's about guns. The Dutch have a similar phrase that goes 'Bite the Sour Apple'. You can tell it's Dutch because it's about sh!tty food."

Chimone said:

FYI ...
Brew as much as you can, and by that I mean even volunteer at a local brewpub or micro to make sure it's want you want to do.
Good luck

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I'm currently finding this is harder than it seems (certainly harder than I expected). Maybe it's just because I'm the new guy trying to squeeze my way into what may be an already full field, but I've recently been turned down by 2 micro- and craft-breweries offering to shovel their tuns and scrub whatever they want. The last one I called said I could come for a day and watch him brew, but any more than that and I'd be in his way. Maybe I can convince him otherwise when I meet him...

There aren't THAT many close to me without having to commute...

Frustrating, that's what it is....

kvh

p.s. on the plus side, I attended my first homebrewing meeting last night and perhaps I can do some more extensive brewing with them in the coming months....

Ive worked with some who are laid back, and take their time to enjoy a few beers while working. Then theres the ones who have their routine locked down and get pissed if something as small as a hose being in the wrong place when they need it. They like to come in, get their **** taken care of and then gtfo. Depends on the brewer really.


If you have to commute, well just consider it part of your training expenses. Becasue experience is really what your after here.

I live in Savannah Georgia now, there is one Brewpub here in town called
Moonriver Brewing Company. I have been there. I was really impressed with their beers but there food could have been better, it was not bad but could have been better but then again I guess I am the ultimate critic.

http://www.moonriverbrewing.com/

I am not from Savannah, if I decide to come back to Savannah after returning from England, I have thought about contacting this brewpub and enquiring about a position in either the kitchen or the brewery.

This brewery is where the Savannah Homebrewers society meets and the owner is a member so I am sure he would have an appreciation for what I am trying and want to do.

I am open to travel and relocation but if I do that, then I must be paid for my work. Unfortunaly, it costs money to live. I don't have any family with in driving distance to any brewpub or brewery, the Moonriver is the closest.