Critique IPA recipe

Here's a recipe i'm working on and I would like some input from this fine group of brewers.

10 gal.

16# 2-row
2# crystal
1# toasted pale malt

4oz. chinook boiling
2.5oz. hallertauer aroma

local brewmasters IPA yeast

Any input, criticism, pitfalls or suggestions will not go to waste.

My critique would be that, unless you have incredible, super-human AG efficiency, this is going to be on the low end of the gravity scale (low 50s?) for the style and the IBUs are going to be insanely high (close to 100?) for that gravity.

What changes to this recipe should be made to bring it within the style guidelines,

increase the 2-row and cut the chinook by 1/2 and the aroma hops by 1/2?

joe s. sausage said:

What changes to this recipe should be made to bring it within the style guidelines,

increase the 2-row and cut the chinook by 1/2 and the aroma hops by 1/2?

Click to expand...

Yes, yes, and no.

The aroma hops are fine--it was that huge addition of chinook that was sending the IBUs through the roof. (Depending on when you add it, the aroma hops add very few IBUs)

Google "beer recipator" for a straightforward, free recipe calaculator that include style guidelines for gravity, color, and IBUs.

I'd do at least 20 lbs. 2-row.

Personally, I don't like Chinook, even for bittering hops, they have a distinct flavor. If you like them, that's all good, but if you haven't used them before, I'd use Columbus or Centennial.

I'd really use a different aroma hop, myself. Cascade or even better Centennial or Amarillo. And more finishing hops. Throw some in at 5 minutes. Throw some in right before chilling. Throw some in for dry hopping. Maybe 2 ounces each time. IPAs want a lof of finishing hops.

Cheers

thanks i'll check out the recipator

oh, and the reason i'm using the hallertauer's is that they were given to me, i'll just mix tem in with some others. i'm trying to develope a recipe so i'm finding my way through the maze. i want to establish the correct texture and alcohol and then start playing with the hops. thanks and i like and have plans to use the hop varieties that you mentioned, i'm writing these notes in my recipe book, thanks again. feel free to keep giving advice, i want to brew this in the next week.

I second the Centennial recommendation. I am enjoying a great IPA at the moment with this hop. Used 4 oz's to do everything: bittering, flavour, aroma and dry.

I'd save the hallertauer for a hefeweizen of a bock, or some other German style beer. They are low alpha acid, and will get overpowered by other hops, especially the varities used in IPA's. All of Janx's suggestions are great. I'd put the hallertauer in the fridge or better, the freezer, and plan another beer soon. Think of it this way, More Beer!

That is what i will do, the hallertauers are in the deep freeze. I tried the recipator and had no luck, here's the new recipe

10 gallon
22# 2-row
4#crystal
2#toasted malt
2 oz chinook boiling
2 oz centennial@5min.
2 oz cent before chilling
2 oz dry hop what do you think?

That's starting to look pretty tasty

Only thing...what is the alpha acid level on the Chinook? For IPAs, I'll often use 2-3 ounces of Columbus, and those are like 17%. Chinook aren't as bitter I don't think. I like a nice bitter IPA myself. Just make sure you use an IBU calculator (ProMash, SUDS, etc) and get it to the level of bitterness you want. The 4# of crystal will leave a residual sweetness, so you want a nice bitter backbone to balance it. Without knowing the Chinook alpha acid level, I can't say where you're at along those lines.

Looks like a winner to me. Cheers

Thanks for all the help, i've got to start somewhere. this is a test and all i want is that the test is tasty, good night now!

Here is one of my favorites:



Indigenous Pale Ale

India Pale Ale

Min OG: 1.050 Max OG: 1.075
Min IBU: 40 Max IBU: 60
Min Clr: 8 Max Clr: 14 Color in SRM, Lovibond
Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (Gal): 10.00 Wort Size (Gal): 10.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 25.00
Anticipated OG: 1.06975 Plato: 16.998
Anticipated SRM: 11.5
Anticipated IBU: 53.5
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 75 Minutes

Pre-Boil Wort Size: 10.67 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.06539 SG 15.99 Plato

Grain/Extract/Sugar
% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
60.0 15.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row) Great Britain 1.03800 3
16.0 4.00 lbs. Munich Malt Germany 1.03700 8
12.0 3.00 lbs. Pilsener Germany 1.03800 2
8.0 2.00 lbs. Crystal 55L Great Britian 1.03400 55
4.0 1.00 lbs. Rye Malt America 1.03000 4


Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
4.00 oz. Fuggle Pellet 5.00 47.8 75 min.
2.00 oz. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 4.75 5.7 15 min.
3.00 oz. Czech Saaz Pellet 3.50 0.0 0 min.

Yeast
-----
WYeast 1968 London Extra Special Bitter

Or this one:

FLHRPale
Min OG: 1.050 Max OG: 1.075
Min IBU: 40 Max IBU: 60
Min Clr: 8 Max Clr: 14 Color in SRM, Lovibond

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (GAL): 11.00 Wort Size (GAL): 11.00
Total Grain (LBS): 29.00
Anticipated OG: 1.070 Plato: 17.11
Anticipated SRM: 14.3
Anticipated IBU: 83.8
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Actual OG: 1.075 Plato: 18.20
Actual FG: 1.028 Plato: 7.07

Alc by Weight: 4.80 by Volume: 6.24 From Measured Gravities.
ADF: 61.2 RDF 51.9 Apparent & Real Degree of Fermentation.

Actual Mash System Efficiency: 83
Anticipated Points From Mash: 70.23
Actual Points From Mash: 77.70


Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 15.00 Percent Per Hour

Raw Pre-Boil Amounts - only targeted volume/gravity and evaporation
rate taken into account:

Pre-Boil Wort Size: 14.19 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.054 SG 13.43 Plato

With sparge water, mash water, additional infusions, vessel losses, top-up
water and evaporation rate recorded in the Water Needed Calculator:

Water Needed Pre-Boil Wort Size: 12.19 Gal
Water Needed Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.063 SG 15.52 Plato


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
69.0 20.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row) America 1.036 2
13.8 4.00 lbs. Light Carastan Great Britian 1.035 15
17.2 5.00 lbs. Crystal 40L America 1.034 40

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.50 oz. Warrior Whole 18.50 56.4 90 min.
1.50 oz. Cascade Whole 6.50 18.0 60 min.
1.00 oz. Cascade Whole 6.50 6.1 30 min.
0.75 oz. Amarillo Gold Whole 9.70 0.0 0 min.
1.00 oz. Cascade Whole 6.50 3.2 15 min.
2.00 oz. Simcoe Whole 14.00 0.0 Dry Hop

Ok, after some thought my new recipe looks like:

22#2-row
4#crystal
2#toasted malt
centennial@120min
simcoe@5min
columbus before chilling
chinook dry hop

Hmm...definitely use the Columbus for bittering and the Centennial for the addition before chilling. Columbus is a whale of a bittering hop, and Centennial is perfect for aroma/flavor/dry additions. It has fantastic flavor. I'd definitely reverse them.

And again, are you sure you like Chinook? Because using it for dry hopping will make it very prominent. Personally, you couldn't pay me to dry hop with Chinook, but YMMV. Someone must like it I guess, but I don't know about for a dry hop.

Janx, i appreciate your opinion. i can easily forego it. The reason i like it is that the brewpub i go to does a cask conditioned ipa every wednesday night, they are doing what they call 30 hops-30weeks, so they dry hop with a different variety everyweek and sometimes a combination and i loved the chinook dry hop. OK, being that i am working up a foundational recipe, i can always do a follow up batch with another hop for comparison.

And, yes cenntenial was one of the hops i have marked for this formula, thanks for the nod.

What is it about the chinook, that you find unsavory?

Here is what i think will happen:
grain bill remains constant
hopping schedule:
columbus@120
simcoe@5
centennial before chill
cenntenial dry hop

Also, how does 2 oz of each hopping sound?
Also, my plan is to let it age 4-6 weeks in the keg.

Don't get me wrong...the Chinook is personal opinion. I really don't like it and have met many others who don't either, so I wanted to make sure you knew what they were like. It's a pretty unique hop flavor IMO. Sounds like you're familiar with them, though, so you should use them if you like them

You really can't guage the amount of bittering hops to use...especially the Columbus...without considering the alpha acid content. It's REALLY easy to go overboard with Columbus because it's so bitter. It's not the weight of hops you use...it's the alpha acid content. Eg 2 oz of Fuggles does not equal two ounces of Columbus.

With hop additions in the last 15 minutes of the boil, alpha acids are pretty irrelevant...then it's just whether you like the character of the hop.

If your Columbus are in the 15% range, then that should put you in IPA style. You'll want to check the alpha on your Columbus and run it through an IBU calculator to be sure. Too much Columbus can ruin your day, and of course too little won't be very IPAish.

Just curious, why the 2 hour boil?

Cheers

2 hour boil? i've been reading a lot about boiling it up.

What is your experience? I'm very new to brewing, so i may uneccessarily be applying some techniques across the board. This forum is an excellent learning tool and of course i keep re-reading and referring to the papazian books. I'm cutting and pasting many of the suggestions into an ipa document so any suggestions will be considered, thanks.

OK, from papazians book, the hop chart shows
chinook 12-14%AA
columbus14-18

I went to use the recipator with no success, i'm going to try it again.

Chinook and Perle have a flavor that many folks describe as "harsh." I'm not quite sure how to describe it any bettter than that, inadequate as it is.

Yep...Perle...I don't like Perle either.

Different strokes and all that...

joe s. sausage said:

OK, from papazians book, the hop chart shows
chinook 12-14%AA
columbus14-18

I went to use the recipator with no success, i'm going to try it again.

Click to expand...

But the key thing is to know the alpha acid of YOUR hops. It'll say on the bag. The hops Papazian has don't matter.

Especially with hops like Columbus, knowing the alpha acid content is important. As I said, it's only really an issue for your boiling(bittering) hops.

You only need to boil for an hour. Some styles benefit from longer boils, and there are arguments for longer boils, but it's not important for an IPA. I boil 90% of my beers for one hour. You'll save a lot of energy and boil off less wort that way.

OK, now the picture is becoming more clear. With your help, this beer will get built.

Just to make you feel better--I love Chinook :rockin:
It is my staple base bitter for several west coast ale and IPA recipes I do and I have dryhopped with it in conjunction with Cascade or Centennial and loved the results. I dig the pine/citrus combo.

carry on.

This is what i want, placed above the crisp bitter quenching of the columbus. :rockin:

I'm going to brew it, age it, and analyze it.:rockin:

And tonight i just had a cask conditioned ipa, dry hopped with a combo of millenium and amarillo hops, tasty, but it doesn't match the brightness of the chinooks.

that is what is great about homebrew, as many people, that's how many styles are possible.