Brewpubs = AG?

Back a few years ago before I knew anything about brewing someone once told me that brewpubs weren't exactly as they seemed to be. He said that they made all their beer from extracts.

Now that I know a little more about brewing I wonder about that. I guess I certainly wouldn't put it past brewpubs that are owned by largish corporations to do it if it's cheaper. How, you ask, could it be cheaper if extract costs more than grain? Easy. You could avoid the cost of hiring an experienced brewmaster at each of your locations. Instead you could train staff to run the equipment and to make three or four regular house brews plus a rotating seasonal one. Just give them the recipes and have them do the same thing over and over again.

The other thing I have wondered is, do brewpubs actually make their beer on site as one would expect from a place that bills itself as a brewpub. I'm sure that some or most of them do. But still-- they all have all that shiny, fancy looking equipment on display-- but did you ever notice that in most places you never see anyone actually using it? Also, I have never noticed brewing smells either inside or coming from outside any of the ones I have been to. Maybe I'm just being cynical, but what's to stop them from making all their beer at one central location, or even contracting out for it?

One of my father's favorite expressions is that "ignorance is bliss." Sometimes that is really true. Sometimes I'd really rather that I didn't know how some things are made.

I can't believe for a second that it would be cost efficient at all to use extracts. Grain is miles cheaper per batch.

My brewpub makes all of their stuff on-site, and every time I go there, the brewer is in the brewing building. You can watch him go about his business. They use their own hops too.

EDIT: Also, in many brewpubs, the owner *is* the brewer, so it's not like you have to "pay" some master brewer to make your beer. I'd put money down that you're pretty off-target here.

There are definitely some extract brewpubs, but I'd guess the VAST majority of them are all grain.

New Mexico has an extract brewpub if I'm not mistaken.....

I can't imagine that.

I've only seen one extract brewpub around here & it was about 5 months open to closed. You can easily get the wrong impression because the companies that sell extract setups are about the only ones who advertise in consumer publications.

Ever the guy in Hillsboro with a one barrel system does all grain.

As far as there being someone actively using it, if there are computer controls and steam process heat, about the only time you would see someone is at the beginning of the mash and during transfers. Most of those tanks are fermenters and bright tanks. It's also time of day, if you hit a place around lunch, the mash might be active, but by evening, it's in the fermenter and venting outside.

Dude said:

There are definitely some extract brewpubs, but I'd guess the VAST majority of them are all grain.

New Mexico has an extract brewpub if I'm not mistaken.....

I can't imagine that.

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I vaguely remember discussion on this forum about an extract brewpub, but I'm too lazy to try to find it this morning. I'd agree, though, that most must be AG.

I hope whoever told me that was wrong. Call me cynical, though, but I just never really trust big companies with things like this. Unfortunately, here in Milwaukee the brewpubs don't seem to be owned by the brewmasters.

That's not to say the places we have are bad-- for the most part they're pretty good-- but they don't seem to be owned by little guys.

Bernie Brewer said:

I vaguely remember discussion on this forum about an extract brewpub, but I'm too lazy to try to find it this morning. I'd agree, though, that most must be AG.

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I think it was Cheese that posted a whole "system" that brewpubs could use to make beer... extract, pre-measured hops, etc.

I've seen this mentioned in other forums, I would tend to believe it. If you think about it extract bought in bulk could be very cost effective when you consider that you no longer need a mash tun, the energy saved by elimminating the mash, time saved, no grain storage or grinding and no grain disposal issues.

Everybody is always talking about making award winning beer from extract so its entirely possible. Although I'm sure the vast majority are AG based.

Here's a turnkey setup http://www.addabrewpub.com/procedure.html

When I won Best of Show at our local clubs contest I won the opportunity to brew a batch of the winning receipe at the local brewpub.

It was a 250 gal all grain batch.

We have a local "brewpub" that brews off premises out of state, then trucks in the wort and ferments it locally. Apparently they do it for tax purposes, plus they have several locations and it's probably cheaper to have one centralized brewery. The beer is so-so.

Waldo said:

I've seen this mentioned in other forums, I would tend to believe it. If you think about it extract bought in bulk could be very cost effective when you consider that you no longer need a mash tun, the energy saved by elimminating the mash, time saved, no grain storage or grinding and no grain disposal issues.

Everybody is always talking about making award winning beer from extract so its entirely possible. Although I'm sure the vast majority are AG based.

Here's a turnkey setup http://www.addabrewpub.com/procedure.html

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I don't know. They are in it to sell their extract and at 30 cents a pint, that's almost TWICE what it costs me to make a pint of Bavarian Hefeweizen and my bulk purchasing power is limited to finding folks to go in on a pallet.

This is kind of funny but I was visiting with the guy that owns the local grocery store, he told me that one of the bigger towns in our area has a brew pub, I had no idea. Anyway ends up they use a similar system like the one I linked to, its all prepackaged extract, mix with water in the tanks ferment and serve. You can bet I'm gonna check that out and report back here!

beer4breakfast said:

There's a BJ's Restaurant and Brew Pub in Addison (Dallas) that does not have a local brew operation. Their closest brewery is in Houston, so I presume it is kegged there for shipping. The beer is good, especially the Tatonka Stout.

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I went their for lunch the other day, I was going to get a beer after I ate, well my food was soo gross and serves was horrible. I decided that I wouldn't waste my money on their beer.

EdWort said:

I don't know. They are in it to sell their extract and at 30 cents a pint, that's almost TWICE what it costs me to make a pint of Bavarian Hefeweizen and my bulk purchasing power is limited to finding folks to go in on a pallet.

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Whats a brew pub get for a pint $2.50? $3.50? thats a pretty good profit margin.

I only have one local brewpub and it is small and dinky, but I know for a fact they brew AG and onsite. I love the way it smells when they are brewing. like the smell of homebrewing magnified by 1000. they had their spent grains outside in a wheelbarrow one time and swmbo jokingly tried to convince me to steal them not realizing they were pretty much worthless lol.

beer4breakfast said:

There's a BJ's Restaurant and Brew Pub in Addison (Dallas) that does not have a local brew operation. Their closest brewery is in Houston, so I presume it is kegged there for shipping. The beer is good, especially the Tatonka Stout.

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Not all the restraunts brew on site, but they do get their beer from other restraunts. The closest BJ's to me, Cerritos CA, does not brew on site. They get kegs from another one. I have been to the one in Covina CA and they do brew. The Cerritos location just isn't big enough to brew.

When I was in Ca, almost 6 years ago, BJ's food was great, but their beer sucked ass. I made better beer than them back then and y'all should be buying from me now!!!

I think in BC if a brewpub opened up that was extract all the other brewpubs would rally together and kill the demon spawn. Swords though the dark heart, burning the body and pissing on the ashes type of thing.

Pacific Coast Brewing Company in Oakland, CA is an extract brewpub. I believe they chose extract because they had a great location for a restaurant, but not enough space for an all-grain operation. The brewing network has an interview with one of the brewers, it was rather amusing, not because of the extract but for the brewers views on styles.

They just celebrated their 17th anniversary, extract is possible, just not common.

That brewpub setup.. ummmm.... ferment for 5 days, then serve??!!!!!

Vermicous said:

Pacific Coast Brewing Company in Oakland, CA is an extract brewpub. I believe they chose extract because they had a great location for a restaurant, but not enough space for an all-grain operation. The brewing network has an interview with one of the brewers, it was rather amusing, not because of the extract but for the brewers views on styles.

They just celebrated their 17th anniversary, extract is possible, just not common.

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What? Light, medium, and dark? lol

The majority of brewpubs are all grain brewers. A very small percentage are extract brewers. Some brewpubs do most of their beers all grain, but may do a special or seasonal using extract, often as a trial. The cost of extract and the limitations it places on a brewer in making craft beers makes it unattractive. The level of activity you see in a brewpub and the number of brews they make in a week is related to their sales and the size of their brewing system. The economics of brewing makes it attractive to brew in 7 - 10 barrel batches. If a brewpub has a 10 barrel system, depending on sales, they may only brew 2 -3 days per week or less. And yes, some brewpub chains may brew more beer at one location than another and truck the kegs between pubs. So, not all the beer sold at one location was made at that location. Are there brewpubs out there with the equipment as show, I suspect yes. However, I suspect either the equipment has been bought as a decoration and is not functional or the particular location does not need the capacity at the current time and draws its beer from a functioning brewpub at a near by location.

These are just my observations.

Dr Malt