Bourbon County Stout clone attempt

mbbransc said:

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Obviously not all malts are created equal. What brand of malt would you use for each type listed?

For example, British 2-row can be any number of British two-row pale malts. There's Crisp, Thomas Fawcett, Bairds and others. Not all of them taste the same because of region or kilning style among other factors. Maybe it doesn't matter, but I believe it does. Spend this much cash, effort and conditioning time on a beer like this and I'd like to make sure I make the correct choice in grains.

Being a newb at grain and malt choices I'll defer to the forum experts for guidance.

Maybe the choice in two-row is less significant than the choice in specialty grains. I know there's an even bigger difference in roasted barley malts, and chocolate malts.

The lovibond is stated in the recipe, but which brand of malts would you use for this recipe?

They posted a video of the making of BCBS on their YouTube page. The camera stopped on the recipe sheet for a minute. There is 3100 2 row, 1000 borlander munich, 200 chocolate/c-60/roast barley, and 116 black malt. The Brewer also mentioned a 4 hour boil and a preboil of 1.129 and there is 60ibu of hops. Using this I'd say recipie is

24 lbs 2-row
7.5 Munich
1.75 chocolate
1.75 c-60
1.75 roasted barley
1 black patent (website mentions debittered black)

Hops are Willamette but you might need around 8 oz to get that 60 IBU.

All the malts used were briess BTW

Dirty25 said:

They posted a video of the making of BCBS on their YouTube page. The camera stopped on the recipe sheet for a minute. There is 3100 2 row, 1000 borlander munich, 200 chocolate/c-60/roast barley, and 116 black malt. The Brewer also mentioned a 4 hour boil and a preboil of 1.129 and there is 60ibu of hops. Using this I'd say recipie is

24 lbs 2-row
7.5 Munich
1.75 chocolate
1.75 c-60
1.75 roasted barley
1 black patent (website mentions debittered black)

Hops are Willamette but you might need around 8 oz to get that 60 IBU.

All the malts used were briess BTW

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Great information. Any mention of Lovibond or color? Especially for the Roasted Barley, Chocolate and Black Patent?

There are at least a couple varieties of each here: http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Assets/PDFs/Briess_TypicalAnalysis.pdf

roncruiser said:

Great information. Any mention of Lovibond or color? Especially for the Roasted Barley, Chocolate and Black Patent?

There are at least a couple varieties of each here: http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Assets/PDFs/Briess_TypicalAnalysis.pdf

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The sheet said 180 SRM. I'd say the black printz is the black malt they are using (dibittered is called out on their webpage). Borlander Munich is on the brew sheet so Munich 10L, c-60 is c-60, roasted barley is roasted barley...the chocolate malt might be the darker stuff

the Brewer also talked about them doing a double mash for one batch. The #s on the brew sheet are pounds I believe. They show the grain hopper reading about 4000+ lbs and numbers follow the 1 sack rule. So 20 sacks of borlander Munich, 4 sacks of c-60/roasted barley/chocolate, and 2 sacks of black printz per mash. Then 3100 lbs from the silo.

It's irrelevant how many barrels they are making. We know the percentages of grain and the OG 30 Plato/1.129 SG

HA! I headed straight here to post this. Recipe at 3:19. Several good tips throughout.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZc1c52Ue1U[/ame]

Also noticed, WTG Ratio of 2.655

Dirty25 said:

the Brewer also talked about them doing a double mash for one batch. The #s on the brew sheet are pounds I believe. They show the grain hopper reading about 4000+ lbs and numbers follow the 1 sack rule. So 20 sacks of borlander Munich, 4 sacks of c-60/roasted barley/chocolate, and 2 sacks of black printz per mash. Then 3100 lbs from the silo.

It's irrelevant how many barrels they are making. We know the percentages of grain and the OG 30 Plato/1.129 SG

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Double mash? Just the first runnings? Kinda like they do for ten fidy?

It states the ABV as 11.75. Bottle states 13. Where would the 1.25 difference come from? The Bourbon Barrels do not add alcohol and I'm unsure they add any actual bourbon. I doubt it.

roncruiser said:

It states the ABV as 11.75. Bottle states 13. Where would the 1.25 difference come from? The Bourbon Barrels do not add alcohol and I'm unsure they add any actual bourbon. I doubt it.

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Evaporation while in the barrel

adamranders said:

Evaporation while in the barrel

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Thanks.

Just FYI, it's illegal to add liquor to beer. There is some sort of grace for a small amount of residual in the barrel.

mbbransc said:

Just FYI, it's illegal to add liquor to beer. There is some sort of grace for a small amount of residual in the barrel.

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If you're a commercial brewer.
Homebrew doesn't apply.

mbbransc said:

Just FYI, it's illegal to add liquor to beer. There is some sort of grace for a small amount of residual in the barrel.

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Don't call the cops on me, bro

Sorry, I meant it would be illegal for GI to add bourbon. We can do wtf we want! We're home brewers!!

Dirty25 said:

the Brewer also talked about them doing a double mash for one batch. The #s on the brew sheet are pounds I believe. They show the grain hopper reading about 4000+ lbs and numbers follow the 1 sack rule. So 20 sacks of borlander Munich, 4 sacks of c-60/roasted barley/chocolate, and 2 sacks of black printz per mash. Then 3100 lbs from the silo.

It's irrelevant how many barrels they are making. We know the percentages of grain and the OG 30 Plato/1.129 SG

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Does a mash temp of 152F sound about right?

mbbransc said:

Sorry, I meant it would be illegal for GI to add bourbon. We can do wtf we want! We're home brewers!!

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They do still have to account for the extra ABV that the spirit provides. Legally anyway - I know plenty who fudge that detail.

Now back to your regularly scheduled topic....

roncruiser said:

Does a mash temp of 152F sound about right?

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I think that would be a good mash temp

I did 155 with an OG of about 1.154. Got a projected FG of 1.040. I'll let you know how it turns out

Are you guys using S-05 for this (which is one of the suggestions in the BYO article)? Any trouble getting the yeast to work all the way up to 13-15% abv? I saw somebody say theirs crapped out at 1.060...

wobrien said:

Are you guys using S-05 for this (which is one of the suggestions in the BYO article)? Any trouble getting the yeast to work all the way up to 13-15% abv? I saw somebody say theirs crapped out at 1.060...

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A big pitch and slightly elevated temps should do it. I'm going to do it with the cake from a 1.040 Belgian single (3787), and pitch 099 if I have attenuation probs. fwiw.

BigPerm said:

A big pitch and slightly elevated temps should do it. I'm going to do it with the cake from a 1.040 Belgian single (3787), and pitch 099 if I have attenuation probs. fwiw.

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My plan is 8 gallons at 1.150 (if low efficiency brings it in a little less I'm not going to sweat it) and pitch 4 packs of S-05, oxygenate and see what happens. If it looks like it's starting to stall, I'll add 099 or champagne yeast.

I'll check my gravity tomorrow and let you know how it turned out. I did a huge starter 2L then stepped to 3L of 001. Figured fresh would be best

Sitting at 1.042. I ended up just following the recipe in BYO

roncruiser said:

It states the ABV as 11.75. Bottle states 13. Where would the 1.25 difference come from? The Bourbon Barrels do not add alcohol and I'm unsure they add any actual bourbon. I doubt it.

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Anyone know (or have educated guesses of) the liquid volumes for this, trying to build it up in beersmith but as they use only the first runnings for this at GI the OG isn't useful as BS calculates it from the entire volume. Trying to nail down the grain bill scale to get the correct grav from first runnings alone.

adamranders said:

Anyone know (or have educated guesses of) the liquid volumes for this, trying to build it up in beersmith but as they use only the first runnings for this at GI the OG isn't useful as BS calculates it from the entire volume. Trying to nail down the grain bill scale to get the correct grav from first runnings alone.

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Can't you choose a mash schedule with no sparge in beer smith?

Yes, you can select No Sparge in BS.

mbbransc said:

Yes, you can select No Sparge in BS.

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where is that option, can't seem to find it.

adamranders said:

where is that option, can't seem to find it.

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I think you have to use a BIAB mash profile

kcmobrewer said:

I did 155 with an OG of about 1.154. Got a projected FG of 1.040. I'll let you know how it turns out

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What temp did you ferment at, and for how long?

68. Still in there. Just letting everything mellow out. Probably been 3 weeks now or so.

kcmobrewer said:

68. Still in there. Just letting everything mellow out. Probably been 3 weeks now or so.

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Thanks. Did you end up using all Briess grains?

I plan to brew this beer soon, but my mash tun volume is only 7.5 gallons. Big enough to fit the specialty grains but not nearly large enough to even contain a quarter of the base malt (plus the specialty malts). I want to do this as a almost full all-grain recipe with maybe a few pounds of DME to attain proper gravity. So, I'm waiting on black-Friday to unload on a 15 gallon mash tun. 15 gallons should almost be I really want a 15 gallon circular igloo cooler but I'm not sure they exist.

Anyhow... thanks for the information.

No, some were Weyerman I think. I really don't think I have a discerning enough of a palate to be able to tell the difference. As long as I'm close that's good enough for me.

As long as it tastes ok post fermentation I'm gonna fine it and move to a keg for a year.

So the recipe doesn't mention wheat, but my 2014 bottle states it contains wheat... Unless this was meant to inform those that need to know about the gluten in barley?

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Mine is about finishing up..at 1.039 started at 1.13 ...taste is in the ball park of bcbs...time to add the chips and bourbon

BigPerm said:

A big pitch and slightly elevated temps should do it. I'm going to do it with the cake from a 1.040 Belgian single (3787), and pitch 099 if I have attenuation probs. fwiw.

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I used 3787 on a beer this size and it got down to 1.020, which was definitely too low. My recipe (not bcbs) had some table sugar in there, but either way, 3787 is a beast. You might want to consider an ale yeast, but ymmv.

My clone project is about to go to the next level

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Ha! You've got some brewing to do!

Finally got the bung ...still has some bcbs in it...taste like a dark chocolate woody booze...this is going to be big effort from other local homebrewers to get this filled up

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Sleepyemt said:

So the recipe doesn't mention wheat, but my 2014 bottle states it contains wheat... Unless this was meant to inform those that need to know about the gluten in barley?

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I was going to make the same point regarding a 2015 bottle. Funny that their website does not mention it as an ingredient though.
I was speculating on the fact that wheat/dark wheat could maybe be responsible for the great mouthfeel in this stout when i noticed that on the bottle.

the thing about gluten makes sense, but why falsely claim an ingredient? that'd be CYA to the extreme. just say "contains gluten" instead, it gets right to the chase. seems odd, no?

i still believe they used wheat...

adamranders said:

Anyone know (or have educated guesses of) the liquid volumes for this, trying to build it up in beersmith but as they use only the first runnings for this at GI the OG isn't useful as BS calculates it from the entire volume. Trying to nail down the grain bill scale to get the correct grav from first runnings alone.

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Did you find out what the volume is on this? I feel like I'm missing something on the first runnings SG but I'm also trying to construct the recipe in BS.