Glycol Pump for a 12 foot rise from basement keezer to living room tap?

I have been struggling to find a home for my keezer( that is yet unbuilt) the freezer is 26 cubic feet - a big one I know -and our house is small. I have a 6 tap perlick glycol tower that I was planning on mounting on top. As I type this its 2 am and I can't sleep so I am a bit whimsical. So here is my idea - freezer in basement, run insulated lines through a vent or something, pump chilled salt water through the old glycol lines(made of copper). Then put the tower on top of a cabinet/stand with a relatively small footprint( will help win SWMBO over)(if we had more room she would have no problem) I plan on running the beer lines in a bundle with the glycol line coiled around it and then clad that in armaflex pipe insulation, and perhaps stuff all that into a pvc pipe to add stability.

My question is this: is there a cheap pump that will pump liquid up 12 feet and down again in a recirculating system? I have seen posts on here about doing something similar to this but no specific pumps are mentioned.

Thanks

runningweird said:

pump chilled salt water through the old glycol lines(made of copper).
Thanks

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salt water and copper(almoust any metal) don't mix well. Copper will corode after a wile and salt will eat thru the pipe wall. why salt water? just go with a glycol agane.
don't know about that pump.

bohdan987 said:

salt water and copper(almoust any metal) don't mix well. Copper will corode after a wile and salt will eat thru the pipe wall. why salt water? just go with a glycol agane.
don't know about that pump.

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Copper and salt water are fine together - They use copper on ship bottoms after-all. What happens is that the copper forms an oxide which protects the copper from further corrosion. Even that small oxidation the rating for yearly degradation of copper in the ocean is something like 25 microns.

why salt water - inhibition of bacteria, easy to make and replace. I would use the food safe glycol if I can find it but I want to keep this as cheap as possible.

http://ozbo.com/070532-Propylene-Gl...-DA95-E011-87D9-001B21A69EB8&mr:referralID=NA
a little expensive but will do a much better job of heat transfer

chemman14 said:

http://ozbo.com/070532-Propylene-Gl...-DA95-E011-87D9-001B21A69EB8&mr:referralID=NA
a little expensive but will do a much better job of heat transfer

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i'd go a little cheaper, but that's just me

http://www.ruralking.com/rv-antifreeze-gallon-50f.html?utm_medium=google&utm_source=cse&cvsfa=1908&cvsfe=2&cvsfhu=303436373730303335

If the cooling loop's return hose is submerged in the liquid in the reservoir, the pump doesn't have to pump 12' of head.

Bobby_M said:

If the cooling loop's return hose is submerged in the liquid in the reservoir, the pump doesn't have to pump 12' of head.

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Please explain this to me in terms a child would understand.

runningweird said:

Please explain this to me in terms a child would understand.

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The liquid going downhill pulls the liquid going uphill.

944play said:

The liquid going downhill pulls the liquid going uphill.

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understood. Is there a pump that springs to mind that would work for this?

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001I04P5W/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

that will have enough power to get the water up 12 feet of empty line before gravity takes over and helps it down the other side. and also give you a good amount of flow rate. ive had one of those running 24/7 for the better part of a decade; they are a little pricey, but very well made. the plastic housing gets brittle below 0C, but i have used it to pump -15C coolant before without issue.

once the loop is full, the only force acting against the pump in a closed loop would be the friction from the inside of the tubing. however on first start up with air in the lines, your pump will need to be able to force the liquid up the full 12 feet on its own (or you need to manually bleed it first some other way).

also- "RV antifreeze" is meant to not freeze solid and burst your pipes. it does however still turn into a semi-solid slush at temperatures below 0C, which make it very hard to pump. i would use something else if you are looking to go much lower than freezing.

ok well a hitch has come up in my get along. The freezer will not fit down the basement steps. Luckily there is already a full sized fermentation fridge down there, guess I will have to strip the door shelves and drill some holes in that instead. 6 kegs should fit in a full sized fridge right? Co2 outside

Thanks for the pump suggestion audger, 10 years on something like that is a long time, I will try to find one.

I am interested in this as well. My only concern is what happens to the beer that is in the line when the keg runs dry? Shouldn't the beer come through the line fine as long as the keg stays pressurized? The distance I am looking to run means there will be 1.4 gallons of beer in the line at any given time. If the line has beer in it and the keg is now only filled with pressurized CO2 the beer should be able to stay in the vertical portion of the line and resist gravity because the system is sealed? The only way it would drop back down is if there is a leak in the line, but at that point that would be the least of my worries. Does that sound right?

Runningweird check out the glycol/beer line combos that kegman offers.

http://www.kegman.net/products/4-Product-2-Glycol-5{47}16-id-Trunk-Line-%2d-6834.html

bluestang50 said:

Runningweird check out the glycol/beer line combos that kegman offers.

http://www.kegman.net/products/4-Product-2-Glycol-5{47}16-id-Trunk-Line-%2d-6834.html

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I have the line all supplied I got in on the 100 feet of tubing from birdman brew supply a while back so that will serve as the beer line, and I have a whole roll of 3/8 tubing to use for the glycol lines. it looks great though.

Update on this project : I headed to home depot earlier and came home with a bunch of goodies - foam insulation, duct sealant, silver weather tape, a pond pump, and best of all I think I figured out where to put my fridge so I can have only about 8 feet or less of travel from keg to tap. Now I have to work up the courage to drill a 2 inch hole into the hardwood floor of a house in which we hope to not be living in beyond a year or so.

well I got it all figured out, set up the whole thing and got my taps running. Check it out: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/long-draw-salt-water-chilled-beer-tower-271578/

in the end the vertical distance from keg to tap was less than 8 feet, I feel confident that this pump would work with more distance than what I have though using a re-circulation cooling system.
for anyone interested this is the pump I used:http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

if the link fails its a Beckett 1/64 HP Submersible Shut-Off Fountain Pump