Belgian Beers, sugar in boil, or sugar after initial fermentation

I imagine this is debated quite a bit. My thought is that Belgian beers, dubbels, Tripels, Strongs, etc that utilize candi sugar needs to have that sugar added to the fermenter after three or four days of active fermentation. Thought being that the simpler sucrose needs to be added after the maltose is gobbled up, creating the flavor profile. If both the sucrose and maltose are present at the same time, the yeast will preferentially gobble the sucrose in the initial fermentation. Given the high OG of most Belgian ales, that leaves a nice chance that you'll have a less than complete fermentation.

But this is a pain in the ass. It throws off my OG calculations if the sugar isn't present at pitching time. I can correct for this, but I'd rather not. Plus, the process of boiling the sugar in water to sterlize everything and then adding it, it's just tedious.

Am I overthinking this. Given that the sugar is only about 10% of the total, if I just added it to the boil and pitched an extra super-duper slug of yeast, wouldn't that alieviate the concern?

I add sugar later for three reasons: lower osmotic pressure = happier yeast, and lower gravity = lower pitching rate, so my starters don't need to be as large. I can also adjust the amount of sugar I use based on where my actual OG and FG ended up.

You're right that yeast will preferentially eat simple vs complex sugars. If they eat enough simple sugars, their metabolism will 'switch' and they won't be able to eat maltotriose. If they're healthy enough, they can switch back, so it may not be a big risk provided adequate yeast health.

I just take the sugar out of the recipe in my brew softawre to get an OG without the sugar. Add it back in to get the full picture, of oG with sugar and estimated FG.

I do usually add it after a few days of fermentation. I seem to get a few more points of attenuation. This lets the yeast start out eating the more complex sugars of the wort, then a few days later adding the sugar is like desert to the hungry yeast.

My only experience with adding sugar later resulted in a stalled fermentation. It stalled at 1.020, which is gross for a Belgian beer. Adding an active 001 starter fixed it, but in the future I'm just going to add my sugar additions during or before the boil.

Note, I added my sugar just as the high krausen phase was ending. That was probably too late. Also, it was with 3787. Oh, and the fermenter blew its top bigtime after I dumped the sugar in.

Prionburger said:

Oh, and the fermenter blew its top bigtime after I dumped the sugar in.

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That sounds like the problem to me. Just don't let your fermentor explode.

I've successfully added my sugar to the boil multiple times. I've never had stalled- or even slow for that matter- fermentations and I've ended up with dry, delicious Belgian beers. I personally think its easier, and with sufficient yeast its fine. Even if you underpitch (SLIGHTLY), its ok as this will add to the amount of ester production. I wouldn't worry honestly... the yeast knows what to do if you give it good enough conditions (O2, temp since its a belgian)

+1 to Mainebrew. 4 Belgians with sugar added to boil. Never a FG above 1.008. Make sure you pitch plenty of yeast and add some yeast nutrient near the end of the boil.

AG can sometimes go lower than extracts. There is a mysterious extract wall with regards to finishing gravity. Never experienced it myself but have heard about it.

solbes said:

AG can sometimes go lower than extracts. There is a mysterious extract wall with regards to finishing gravity. Never experienced it myself but have heard about it.

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Most extracts contain Carapils or similar.

i just did a Belgian Golden Strong Ale, OG 1074 ,I'm @ 4 days today. I should boil the candi syrup with some water? (how much) cool ,dump in, and give a good swirling? or just dump in?

I don't think you'll need to swirl. The yeast activity alone should be enough to distribute.

You probably don't even need to bring the syrup to a boil, but it wouldn't hurt. I'd add 2 cups of water to the syrup and get it heated, then cool, then dump.

I just add the sugar to the last 5 or so minutes of the boil. Never had an FG higher than 1.012, typically under 1.010 for most brews. If I remember reading right, the brewers at Ommegang say it shouldn't matter for yeast metabolism if you add it during the boil. I do like their beers, so I figure that's proof enough for me.

phenry said:

If I remember reading right, the brewers at Ommegang say it shouldn't matter for yeast metabolism if you add it during the boil. I do like their beers, so I figure that's proof enough for me.

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What kind of internal QC do they have? What type of yeast analysis do they do? What's their viability/vitality? I'm sure a brewery as large as Ommegang has a good handle on their yeast health, and their yeast can perform well with their recipes.

I'm sure for most homebrewers, most of the time, adding sugar to the boil is fine. Too often though, the yeast available is old or has been mistreated along the way. I wouldn't say adding sugar to the boil is "best practice," though it's usually acceptable. The only stuck ferments I've ever had were in Belgian Quads where I added sugar during the boil. YMMV and so on, but just a word of warning.

Nateo said:

What kind of internal QC do they have? What type of yeast analysis do they do? What's their viability/vitality? I'm sure a brewery as large as Ommegang has a good handle on their yeast health, and their yeast can perform well with their recipes.

I'm sure for most homebrewers, most of the time, adding sugar to the boil is fine. Too often though, the yeast available is old or has been mistreated along the way. I wouldn't say adding sugar to the boil is "best practice," though it's usually acceptable. The only stuck ferments I've ever had were in Belgian Quads where I added sugar during the boil. YMMV and so on, but just a word of warning.

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I'm sure they hold yeast health as one of their highest priorities, and IMHO, so should homebrewers. I try to put most of my efforts towards yeast health, so I'm almost always pitching a stepped up starter at high krausen into my big Belgians as per Mr Malty pitching rates. This, along with proper aeration, should negate most viability issues with the yeast. Even with simple sugars making up 20% of the grist I haven't had a stuck fermentation (knock on wood).

phenry said:

I'm sure they hold yeast health as one of their highest priorities, and IMHO, so should homebrewers. I try to put most of my efforts towards yeast health, so I'm almost always pitching a stepped up starter at high krausen into my big Belgians as per Mr Malty pitching rates. This, along with proper aeration, should negate most viability issues with the yeast. Even with simple sugars making up 20% of the grist I haven't had a stuck fermentation (knock on wood).

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That's really good advice. IMO yeast health and handling is the #1 factor in making great beer. Both of my stuck ferments were in the first couple years I was brewing, when I didn't really know what I was doing. I haven't had a stuck ferment in probably six years now. Since there are a lot of newer brewers reading the boards, I just wanted to warn them that there may be issues if they don't handle their yeast properly.